Nvidia Releasing Wired 3D Glasses - $99 a Pair!

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Nvidia Releasing Wired 3D Glasses - $99 a Pair!

Post by PressBot »

Some interesting news out today.  With an expected release date towards the end of June, Nvidia has announced plans to release an inexpensive $99 version of their GeForce 3D Vision glasses.

Image

We haven't sampled a pair yet, but the big difference is that these units are wired rather than wireless (which are only $50 more, by the way).  To make the glasses more comfortable, the frame is more flexible around the ears.  For those concerned about a price versus image quality relationship, the lenses are identical to what Nvidia has been marketing until now.
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Re: Nvidia Releasing Wired 3D Glasses - $99 a Pair!

Post by cybereality »

This is great news, the cheaper the better. $99 is within impulse buying range, especially for hardcore gamers who might already own 120Hz monitors but are still skeptical towards 3D. Considering that the 3D Vision glasses previously cost $200 (before the recent price drop) this would be effectively half the original price. Also, the cord looks like its a respectable length. Nice job.

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Re: Nvidia Releasing Wired 3D Glasses - $99 a Pair!

Post by tritosine5G »

dude they can make a complete picoprojector light engine for 20-35 dollars, it's b-s they can't make eye tracking.

Hope this signals the return path of some feedback system! LC turd gone and we also have 1000hz per eye. :lol:
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Re: Nvidia Releasing Wired 3D Glasses - $99 a Pair!

Post by BHawthorne »

It's a step in the right direction, but still not in impulse buy price range. $49-59 should be their target for market saturation IMHO. That and ensuring display manufacturers can lock 100hz+ by default on a majority of their product line. If you already have a 3D Vision kit with the emitter, I fail to see this as as a viable alternative. In that case just buy some more compatible wireless glasses for cheaper.
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Re: Nvidia Releasing Wired 3D Glasses - $99 a Pair!

Post by cybereality »

Well the saturation of 120Hz monitors is not enough to support mass market $49 pricing for shutter glasses. The type of people who own 120Hz monitors are usually enthusiasts who build expensive rigs which they can obtain 120fps frame rates, or stereoscopic 3D. Either way, these are people that regularly spend hundred on video-cards (even dual video-cards), so I don't think $99 is too much to ask. If and when 120Hz monitors become standard, then at that point I think Nvidia should go for the $49 pricing. Right now 120Hz and/or 3D is a premium market, and deserves a premium price.

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Re: Nvidia Releasing Wired 3D Glasses - $99 a Pair!

Post by Fredz »

3D is a premium market because NVIDIA decided so, but that has not to be the case. They make the more expensive shutter glasses at $119 when older models containing the exact same technology (eDimensional) can be found for less than $30 and equivalent glasses like the Ultra-Clear can be found at less than half the price ($49.95). Glasses sold by 3D TVs makers are even cheaper than the NVIDIA glasses for most of them, so the problem in prices is not with 3D in general but with NVIDIA in particular.

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Re: Nvidia Releasing Wired 3D Glasses - $99 a Pair!

Post by Neil »

Hi Fredz,

You are forgetting about the software! EDimensional and other shutter glasses makers had little to no software support internally. ED's work was subpar (though they tried), and the Nvidia drivers weren't getting updated on a regular basis in those days. DDD and IZ3D drivers go for about $50 a piece, so when you factor in hardware - this is in line with the other players. I think the hardware is relatively inexpensive, it's the software that is a lifelong investment for Nvidia - and I can see how they need some money coming in for that.

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Re: Nvidia Releasing Wired 3D Glasses - $99 a Pair!

Post by speedy22 »

I wonder, this glasses will work with an ATI/AMD card and IZ3D?

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Re: Nvidia Releasing Wired 3D Glasses - $99 a Pair!

Post by Fredz »

The old NVIDIA stereo driver has always been free, and it has been regularly updated from 2001 to 2007, with at least 4 or 5 updates each year. Since the 3D Vision driver is basically the exact same thing minus some features, it's not more expensive for them to release it either.

And basically a stereo driver only consists in duplicating 3D calls and flipping two render buffers, so it's not like it is expensive to program, I've even implemented one for Linux in no time that can't unfortunately work at 120Hz because of purposely missing info about CRT registers from NVIDIA (or other GPUs makers for the matter).

And you can perfectly use the 3D Vision driver with older VGA DDC glasses (using the ED-activator) or DLP-Link ones using the recently posted hack, so there is really no reason why 3D Vision glasses are so expensive. DLP-Link glasses can also be found for $49.95, still half the price of the wired 3D Vision glasses.

The key is that NVIDIA wants to make money, even with hardware that should be quite cheap normally. They do the exact same thing by selling their Quadro GPUs at a very high price when most differences with the GeForce GPUs are only at the driver level (hence the SoftQuadro hack). Same thing for the 3DTV Play driver that they sell at $30 when it's basically the same thing that their free 3D Vision driver.
Last edited by Fredz on Tue May 31, 2011 9:58 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Nvidia Releasing Wired 3D Glasses - $99 a Pair!

Post by Neil »

Hi Fredz,

I don't think this is a fair analysis at all. I'm the one who was leaking those Nvidia updates back in the day, and the profile updates were hardly as advanced as they are now. I'm not a big fan of Nvidia limiting the convergence controls with several profiles, but it is definitely much better support now than they ever had before. The Nvidia drivers we used several years ago had little to no post processing support, and with each graphics card release, there was a new slew of bugs and problems that couldn't be predicted or overcome in many cases.

Hey - if Nvidia can make loads of money from 3D gaming, than great. If they and the other 3D players can make money from this, it just proves there is real demand for stereoscopic 3D gaming, which means 3D support and technology will continue to improve. It would be nice if some of that money trickled down to help make MTBS an even better place - but that's a separate story.

Regards,
Neil

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Re: Nvidia Releasing Wired 3D Glasses - $99 a Pair!

Post by Fredz »

Neil wrote:I don't think this is a fair analysis at all. I'm the one who was leaking those Nvidia updates back in the day, and the profile updates were hardly as advanced as they are now.
I've heard a lot of people trying games that were presented as supported in stereo 3D on NVIDIA site, to only discover that it was in fact only the case with the old stereo driver but no longer with 3D Vision. I fail to see how you consider this to be a progress in their support of stereo 3D, along with the features that have also been purposely removed (like the convergence settings as you said yourself, but also dual output, other types of glasses, etc.).
Neil wrote:Hey - if Nvidia can make loads of money from 3D gaming, than great.
I've no problem with companies making money, I even created a company with some colleagues and the goal was clearly not to loose money. What I don't like is when companies are overpricing their products using an unfair advantage, here the inner information about CRTC registers mapping, which was public before.

Using such tactics won't help the adoption of stereo 3D, and it still hasn't on the PC side when in the same time things are clearly better with consoles. This only creates a barrier to entry because of very high prices and in the end a very limited and complex offer for PCs. All this should be standardized and open, in the exact same way the HDMI consortium did for the 1.4 and 1.4a specifications. Heck, they even released them for free to the public, and the HDMI consortium is clearly not known to be a charity.

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Re: Nvidia Releasing Wired 3D Glasses - $99 a Pair!

Post by Neil »

I've heard a lot of people trying games that were presented as supported in stereo 3D on NVIDIA site, to only discover that it was in fact only the case with the old stereo driver but no longer with 3D Vision. I fail to see how you consider this to be a progress in their support of stereo 3D, along with the features that have also been purposely removed (like the convergence settings as you said yourself, but also dual output, other types of glasses, etc.).
I've never been a fan of announcements of hundreds of game profiles, and I normally don't mention announcements like that in our news wire service for anyone. However, I do own the Nvidia solution (among others), and I can tell you out of experience that their offering is better than what it was before. The best measure is M3GA (which sorely needs to be updated, I know).

I've no problem with companies making money, I even created a company with some colleagues and the goal was clearly not to loose money. What I don't like is when companies are overpricing their products using an unfair advantage, here the inner information about CRTC registers mapping, which was public before.

Using such tactics won't help the adoption of stereo 3D, and it still hasn't on the PC side when in the same time things are clearly better with consoles. This only creates a barrier to entry because of very high prices and in the end a very limited and complex offer for PCs. All this should be standardized and open, in the exact same way the HDMI consortium did for the 1.4 and 1.4a specifications. Heck, they even released them for free to the public, and the HDMI consortium is clearly not known to be a charity.

The HDMI spec is free, but using the connector and the branding requires a licensing agreement I'm sure. Also, while the HDMI spec added great support for 3D in theory...the practice is currently limited to 720P for 3D gaming. Far from perfect!

I agree that industry-wide support is better for customers and industry alike (I got S3DGA started because of this). That said, I think Nvidia's pricing is reasonable.

Regards,
Neil

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Re: Nvidia Releasing Wired 3D Glasses - $99 a Pair!

Post by crim3 »

What upsets from nvidia is how they have added all those limitations to their 3D solution at the software level to maximize their 3d gaming market share and incomings via licenses fees of display manufactures, taking advantage of their superior position, instead of just releasing their 3d gaming hardware and let it compete with other brands. Instead of compete releasing the best hardware at the least price they are focusing mainly in the manipulation of the market.
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Re: Nvidia Releasing Wired 3D Glasses - $99 a Pair!

Post by Fredz »

Neil wrote:However, I do own the Nvidia solution (among others), and I can tell you out of experience that their offering is better than what it was before. The best measure is M3GA (which sorely needs to be updated, I know).
Unfortunately your M3GA initiative (which I find very welcomed) doesn't include games supported by the old nvidia stereo driver, so it's quite difficult to compare game support between these two drivers objectively. For me I've found that all the games I've tried on my older config are pretty well supported, even OpenGL ones. The problem I encounter are mostly related to 2D impostors that are not at the good distance or shadow techniques (shadow volumes specifically) that are not correctly rendered, but a stereo driver can't do anything for that.
Neil wrote:The HDMI spec is free, but using the connector and the branding requires a licensing agreement I'm sure. Also, while the HDMI spec added great support for 3D in theory...the practice is currently limited to 720P for 3D gaming. Far from perfect!
The fact that a branding requires a licensing agreement is not a problem in my opinion, if NVIDIA did this there would be more or better stereo drivers available, including the ones from DDD and iZ3D that would be able to do 120Hz on NVIDIA GPUs, which they've tried in the past but have abandonned by lack of information about how to do it.

The fact that HDMI 1.4 or 1.4a is limited to 720 at 60Hz per eye has nothing to do with HDMI per se, it's only because chip makers didn't feel the need to produce HDMI chips with a bandwith higher than 225MHz. Things are changing though, the first 300MHz have been released one week ago by Silicon Image, so 1080p at 60Hz per eye will be possible in a near future now.
Neil wrote:I agree that industry-wide support is better for customers and industry alike (I got S3DGA started because of this). That said, I think Nvidia's pricing is reasonable.
That's where I disagree, but we won't arrive to a consensus there anyway. I think selling shutter glasses at $99 when the competition sells similar glasses at half the price is a bad practice and is hurting the S3D market on the PC platform. To each his own...

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Re: Nvidia Releasing Wired 3D Glasses - $99 a Pair!

Post by Fredz »

I completely agree with crim3, best said than what I tried to explain.

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Re: Nvidia Releasing Wired 3D Glasses - $99 a Pair!

Post by BHawthorne »

cybereality wrote:Well the saturation of 120Hz monitors is not enough to support mass market $49 pricing for shutter glasses. The type of people who own 120Hz monitors are usually enthusiasts who build expensive rigs which they can obtain 120fps frame rates, or stereoscopic 3D. Either way, these are people that regularly spend hundred on video-cards (even dual video-cards), so I don't think $99 is too much to ask. If and when 120Hz monitors become standard, then at that point I think Nvidia should go for the $49 pricing. Right now 120Hz and/or 3D is a premium market, and deserves a premium price.
My main problem with the pricing structure is that those that already have a 3D Vision kit and want a few extra glasses for friends to also use this isn't the answer. Just buy 3D Vision compatible ones for $20-30 less.
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Re: Nvidia Releasing Wired 3D Glasses - $99 a Pair!

Post by cybereality »

I admit, I don't think shutter glasses cost very much to make. Nvidia could probably drop the price further and still make a small profit. But why should they? This is a premium market, just like SLI, or Eyefinity, etc. Enthusiasts regularly spend upwards of $300 dollars every 6 months just to get the latest graphics cards. Some hardcore PC gamers will even spend $500-700 on the top of the line Nvidia card. And they may do this every year. I don't think its unreasonable to ask this same market to spend $100, or even $200, on 3D glasses that could last 5 or 10 years. You have to also factor in the cost of their driver, which they provide regular support for. And the cost for promotion, like getting developers to provide native 3D support, or getting YouTube to add 3D Vision support. That stuff doesn't come for free. People make the argument that since the Nvidia driver was once free that it should always be so, but that is just not valid. Nvidia was likely losing money on that. What they are doing with 3D Vision now is how they are recouping all the R&D, and making a little money on the side (they are a company after all).

$99 for wired 3D glasses is a reasonable price for the experience it provides. I mean, you can find gaming headphones that easily cost $100, I've recently paid $200 for a pair. Gaming mice or keyboards that could cost $100 a piece (or more). 120Hz monitors that start at $300 (usually a 100% markup from a comparable 60Hz screen). I could go on, but I think you get the idea. Nvidia, for better or worse, has a unique position in the market and they are taking advantage of that. I can't really blame them. Plus, they are showing effort to lower the price. There was a recent drop in the wireless glasses by $50. Now these wired glasses will be half the original price. Surely the price will drop further in the future. But even $99 is reasonable, IMO.

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Re: Nvidia Releasing Wired 3D Glasses - $99 a Pair!

Post by Chiefwinston »

Well I like the downward trend of costs for 3D entertainment hardware. This price IS very reasonable. We should see this as a trend for glasses moving forward. This is great for 3D in general.

A big shout out MOO to all the cow readers out there. I know cows like 3D, too. MOOOOO.

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Nvidia Releasing Wired 3D Glasses - $99 a Pair!

Post by Neil »

The following is an excerpt of a blog article.  Read Full Article

Some interesting news out today.  With an expected release date towards the end of June, Nvidia has announced plans to release an inexpensive $99 version of their GeForce 3D Vision glasses.

[caption id="attachment_16050" align="alignnone" width="339"]Nvidia 3D Vision Wired 3D GlassesNvidia 3D Vision Wired 3D Glasses[/caption]

We haven't sampled a pair yet, but the big difference is that these units are wired rather than wireless (which are only $50 more, by the way).  To make the glasses more comfortable, the frame is more flexible around the ears.  For those concerned about a price versus image quality relationship, the lenses are identical to what Nvidia has been marketing until now.


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