Minecrift Discussion Thread

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cybereality
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Re: Minecrift Discussion Thread

Post by cybereality »

Cool, man!

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Jademalo
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Re: Minecrift Discussion Thread

Post by Jademalo »

Ooh, colour me excited!

Better abb correction sounds good, it was something I noticed once or twice when I was testing everything. Good luck on the rest of it!

What version are you building it for?

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Re: Minecrift Discussion Thread

Post by StellaArtois »

Still 1.6.4. At the moment.

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Re: Minecrift Discussion Thread

Post by CaptnYesterday »

That's fantastic news! :woot

Great work Stella! Cant wait to try it out.
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Re: Minecrift Discussion Thread

Post by StellaArtois »

Head tracking fixed.

Oh. my. The head track latency is LOW. :twisted:

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Re: Minecrift Discussion Thread

Post by Jademalo »

:O

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Re: Minecrift Discussion Thread

Post by CaptnYesterday »

Must. Try. Now.
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Re: Minecrift Discussion Thread

Post by Jademalo »

Damn, can't fault dinnerbone.
Remember I complained the other day about the launcher deleting all of my mods? I made a ticket and he answered it dead early on monday with a fix immediately deployed. Your old mod versions are safe from now!

:D

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Re: Minecrift Discussion Thread

Post by CaptnYesterday »

Jade, that's great! I was bumming out about it wondering if I would lose anything.

Thanks for letting us know.
(That's fast service!!!)
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Re: Minecrift Discussion Thread

Post by Jademalo »

Yeah, I'm really impressed at the turnaround, I wasn't even expecting a fix at all. I believe the new method deletes uncalled libraries available remotely, but leaves local only intact.
I was extremely lucky that I had my backup though, I hadn't noticed it for two days and was unable to recover any of it with an undelete tool.

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Re: Minecrift Discussion Thread

Post by StellaArtois »

Progress update; try this!:
minecrift-1.6.4-031_Preview_b1-installer.txt
It's a little rough around the edges! Rename to .exe, then install. Windows only obviously.

Recommended settings: VSync ON (may need a Minecrift restart). Render settings->Chrom Ab, Timewarp, Vignette do nothing and are always on (the Oculus SDK crashes if they are changed). Let the chunks load in a bit otherwise it's stutter city (I really need to have a go a finding a fix to that). Head track latency is very good for me.

FSAA is a little blurrier than usual, because we now supersample, THEN distort / timewarp. However this is probably also the same reason for the chromatic ab being a little better.

Let me know how it goes... :shock:
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Re: Minecrift Discussion Thread

Post by supcaj »

holy crap, the latency (or lack thereof!) is insane! It's really something to see. Nice work, Stella!

Unfortunately, I can't see any of the HUD elements in this version, including the in-game menu when I hit escape :( Looking forward to a playable release.

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Re: Minecrift Discussion Thread

Post by CaptnYesterday »

Nice work on this. The tracking feels snappy for sure and it did seem like less blur. Does this include auto-prediction? What was the old default for prediction?

Beyond a couple of things I found below, I did not lose HUD elements and did not notice anything missing. Looked about ready for prime time to me. :D

FSAA + MIP mapping created whitish artifacts (most noticeable on distant tracks and jungle vines. Higher lvls of MIP + FSAA caused anomalies such as part of a glass roof to disappearing in one eye but not the other. (I forget which to disable to clear the artifacts. So sleepy now... Just crank them both up to make it more obvious)

Menus: Tracking/Latency issue. Inventory or menu navigation seems to add loads of latency. Goes away after I close the menu.. but 'feels' like the opening/closing starts to add up (that or all the settings I mess with) and I then have to restart minecraft to get a fresh sample and clear residual lag. Actually found it in b28 as well though.
Anyone one else get this? (NOTE TO OTHERS: when testing settings, close the menu before you start shaking your head around. You may not get accurate readings in the menus)


If I can make a request, can you take player height off of the Oculus Profile enabled section? Or maybe let us control it with a slider? I'd like to use it to see if it makes any diff (with eye relief settings, etc) but do not like getting so short in-game. :roll:

I think I am hooked on the vsync, but we'll see.

EDIT: Almost forgot, how can I check FPS in MCrift without using fraps (and duplicating the monitors)? Is there a way? I hate duping displays when trying to test fine-point latencies.
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Re: Minecrift Discussion Thread

Post by Jademalo »

I think I've just noticed an error in the json, jmumble library is listed as 1.0 to download and 1.1 to extract.

EDIT: I'll test in a bit. Also, F3 brings up loads of diagnostics for MC

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Re: Minecrift Discussion Thread

Post by Jademalo »

Right, just did my tests, focusing spesifically on tracking latency.

Hoo mama Time Warp is impressive. The fastest I could get it was definitely faster than I've ever seen it. It's a pretty incredible difference, I'm very impressd.

...However, it's not all sunshine and roses =[
The main issue was that FSAA added an unusable amount of lag even at 1.5x. Turned off it was fine, as soon as it was turned on I felt extremely sick extremely quickly. I'm not entirely sure what the cause of that was, but in my previous tests FSAA hasn't impacted it to that kind of level. It very quickly became difficult to hold in my breakfast. In a few hours when I'm alright, I'll give it another shot. It may just be that it had a higher impact on framerate for whatever reason,

Quaternation/Euler was an interesting one, I did a blind test (menu behind my back, spam clicked etc) and it seems that Euler was a bit snappier.
Also, my Chromatic Abberition Correction felt broken, there were a lot of chromatic artifacts and changing the option did nothing at all. No idea about that though, I was judging it on the white text on the menu primarily.


Also keyhole mode is broken, the keyhole is off really far to the right for some reason.

Overall though I'm extremely impressed with the new sdk, given optimal settings it's more responsive than I've ever seen the tracking. I have a feeling that beyond that point the blur becomes too much of a factor, so I'm extremely excited for DK2 and the lowe persistance screen.

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Re: Minecrift Discussion Thread

Post by CaptnYesterday »

Hey Jade, did you try closing and reopening minecraft after turning on fsaa?
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Re: Minecrift Discussion Thread

Post by Jademalo »

It was on by default, and it started sluggish.

I was actually worried to begin with until I disabled it.

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Re: Minecrift Discussion Thread

Post by CaptnYesterday »

Jademalo wrote:It was on by default, and it started sluggish.

I was actually worried to begin with until I disabled it.
So strange, but still not unexpected. I have always, from the moment it was added, had an increased lag with any amount of FSSA in MCrift. I May have been the only one, but just running the game at a higher res worked best for me (although not quite as pretty). Still does, but I did not see any diff last night when testing FSAA in b28 vs FSAA in the new experimental 0.3.1 build.

This is the difficult and awesome thing about this app for performance VR testing. So many options that you can really get a good understanding of what options work well on your rig in this and other games. Makes conclusive group-testing results a real b%tch though. I have also found that sometimes a person can get used to the feel of a WORSE setting so that when it is improved or updated, the change alone feels awkward for a while. I think I was that way with VSYNC, now i really like it!
Jademalo wrote:Overall though I'm extremely impressed with the new sdk, given optimal settings it's more responsive than I've ever seen the tracking. I have a feeling that beyond that point the blur becomes too much of a factor, so I'm extremely excited for DK2 and the lowe persistance screen.
Can you clarify the above? Beyond what point does blur become too much of a factor? Does that mean that we can only see so much improvement before the blur 'blurs over' the rest? :D
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Re: Minecrift Discussion Thread

Post by StellaArtois »

supcaj wrote:holy crap, the latency (or lack thereof!) is insane! It's really something to see. Nice work, Stella!

Unfortunately, I can't see any of the HUD elements in this version, including the in-game menu when I hit escape :( Looking forward to a playable release.
Out of interest - are you on ati / amd graphics hardware? Or nvidia? Or something else?
Last edited by StellaArtois on Wed May 21, 2014 2:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Minecrift Discussion Thread

Post by Jademalo »

CaptnYesterday wrote:
Can you clarify the above? Beyond what point does blur become too much of a factor? Does that mean that we can only see so much improvement before the blur 'blurs over' the rest? :D
I mean in terms of sluggishness. Obviously blur makes physical objects lag behind their absolute position while the screen is updating, and with the current hardware that's a hard limit. Even if the tracking and drawing pipeline was instantaneous, there would always be a bit of innate sluggishness because of the blur.

Low persistence is interesting in that regard since it should hopefully sort that. I'm certainly excited!

I'll reply to the other half of your message when I'm not on my phone later =p

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Re: Minecrift Discussion Thread

Post by StellaArtois »

Glad you're seeing the improvements in head track latency as well! Cheers for testing, as usual!

Is any one else getting menu display issues?

Regarding the additional lag with FSAA - I need to check we're not rendering too large a render target. I may be using the wrong scale factor on this. Or I may be defeating the SDK frame timing logic somehow.

The head track prediction is no longer controlled by Minecrift by the way. Previously we used a set default of 15ms. Then I dabbled with the dynamic setting. Now with 0.3.1 it's fully controlled by the SDK. The SDK decides when it's going to poll the sensor, uses past frame timing data to set a prediction time for each eye render. It then controls when to display the image, after first doing a last poll and time warp correction. Out of my hands completely. This is definitely a good thing! :lol:

The other concerns are noted. I'm wondering if the overlay slowdown is somehow Optifine HD U D1 related. I need to clean up the menus as well - a lot of settings are redundant now with the new SDK. The oculus profile / calibration stuff needs a clean.

Is it not possible to change player height at the moment?

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Re: Minecrift Discussion Thread

Post by Jademalo »

Player height is in the core SDK options in the oculus profile configuration thing

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Re: Minecrift Discussion Thread

Post by CaptnYesterday »

StellaArtois wrote:I need to clean up the menus as well - a lot of settings are redundant now with the new SDK. The oculus profile / calibration stuff needs a clean.
I was holding off on a request for this. I would love to see it, but you have been doing big things and this seemed to be a low priority. Anything to streamline options would be awesome-sauce. I still do not always remember that MIP Mapping is in optifine-->quality (or other settings). I almost wish that everything was in 1 MASSIVE menu, but that is too much. I'd love you for any consolidation though.
StellaArtois wrote:Is it not possible to change player height at the moment?
Jademalo wrote:Player height is in the core SDK options in the oculus profile configuration thing
Correct. But that is not within MCrift menus (or else I have not found it)? My issue is that, although I like to have my height as part of my Oculus profile, it is not something I particularly want in MC. Currently I would have to either disable the profile in MCrift, or manually change my height in the Oculus profile tool. I just want to be the standard height, but still use my profile in MCrift. A height option or slider in the MCrift profile menu would help this (or I am batshit crazy and just missed it).

Stella, is Mark back releasing on the builds? I saw his name by many of the B28 changelogs.

To both of you (if you have the time), what happens to be your favorite settings right now for fsaa, resolution and MIP Mapping (assuming latency was same allround)? Mine is:
FSAA: 2x (Currently disable for latency mitigation)
Res: 1280x800 (currently use 1200p or 1080p to make up for FSAA)
MIP: 1 or 2 (anything higher and vines and stuff look solid from a distance)


EDIT: Apologies for the long posts and questions. I am organizing a get-together to show some MineCraft players the whole MCrift version and want to show the best I can to make a good impression :P
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Re: Minecrift Discussion Thread

Post by StellaArtois »

Captn, I think you've summed up how I feel about the Oculus profile, and common Optifine settings. Give me a week or so to get that sorted, plus I'll get us moved to 0.3.2 to see if that cleans up some of the GL type alpha issues.

Best settings? 2 x AA, 1280x800, full Mip map definitely my preferred.

Haven't heard from Mark for a while, it's been all my meddling on the builds lately... :oops:

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Re: Minecrift Discussion Thread

Post by CaptnYesterday »

Great! The New 0.3.2!

Bet he will eventually come back. I was gone for 6 months or so because of work and I am back. Almost ended up relocating from Saint Louis Missouri US to Singapore. :o Really wish I knew how to do what you guys do. It would be great to help, but I think passing Java 2 in university hardly qualifies :lol:

Menu optimizations...go get'em tiger!
New SDK History wrote: Oculus SDK
Added Mac and Linux support.
Added Oculus Configuration Utility for Mac and Linux.
Enabled VSync on both Mac and Linux.
Separated ovrSensorCap_* bits from ovrHmdCaps. HMD Caps, such as low persistence, are now modified through ovrHmd_SetEnabledCaps.
Unified format of ovrHmdCaps, ovrSensorCaps, ovrDistortionCaps.
Unified handling of graphics state save/restore across GL and D3DX.
...
Oculus SDK
Fixed shutdown crash on AMD by flushing windows message queue before posting quit state.
Removed mode change on Windows when going fullscreen in GL mode.
Fixed vertex buffer corruption in GL.
Fixed loss of input in full-screen applications on OSX 10.9.
Fixed potential SensorFusion crash when using a default profile.
Looks like we have some GL updates here. Also, might be worth following this 0.3.2 thread by Jherico on the Known Issues OVR Forums (scroll to the bottom).

EDIT:
jherico's 0.3.2 java bindings on GitHub.

EDIT 2:
Details on the bindings.

Hey Stella, I was reading the details above and it looks like 0.3.2 may still have some GL issues. Would this impact any of your grand works with MCrift?
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Re: Minecrift Discussion Thread

Post by ElectroPulse »

Hey guys!

This evening I'm looking to try out Minecrift (haven't given it a try since I left the country ten months ago, and just recently returned), and was wondering what the most newest (or most stable, even if it's for an older version of Minecraft) version is?

Thanks!

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Re: Minecrift Discussion Thread

Post by Jademalo »

Guys - The Jenkins needs re-provisioning again. I was going to reply to you Electro, but as of right now the download links won't work.

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Re: Minecrift Discussion Thread

Post by StellaArtois »

Going to put the latest build up in the Minecrift release thread here on MTBS. The Jenkins needs re-provisioning every 14 days if no new builds have been produced or we haven't accessed it. A pain.

Back from vacation. Made some progress while away; ported to 0.3.2. However my dev laptop now crashes within the nv driver when trying to run up Minecrift. After pulling my hair out trying to work out what's going on, and getting nowhere; it works fine on my workstation. Having trawled those links Captn (thanks!), hoping my laptop is dying, as opposed to exposing some race condition somewhere. Doesn't seem to be related to the InitBuffersAndShaders issues mentioned in the Oculus forum posts.

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Re: Minecrift Discussion Thread

Post by AforA »

So, since Minecrift was rebased against Optifine HD Ultra D1 for 1.6.4, I gave running FTB Monster a shot:

Step 1: Install the Launcher from feed-the-beast.com
Step 2: Launch Monster 1.1.1 once
Step 3: Setup a new Minecrift Forge 965 Profile with the game path pointing to a dedicated folder & launch it once, then close it.
Step 4: Copy the content of Monster\minecraft into that folder, overwrite all.
Step 5: Have a LOT of RAM and modify the JVM parameters for that new profile to: -Xms6144M -Xmx6144M -XX:PermSize=256m -XX:+UseParNewGC -XX:+UseConcMarkSweepGC -XX:+CICompilerCountPerCPU -Dfml.ignoreInvalidMinecraftCertificates=true -Dfml.ignorePatchDiscrepancies=true
Step 6: Start a single player world, walk around for about 20 seconds in a strangely rendered but somewhat working landscape, then observe as everything crashes and burns: http://pastebin.com/KaJHA7hW

The last five lines from the Tessellator then loop infinitely & the process hangs. There's also an issue with rendering Forge Microblocks (they're invisible) that I've managed to observe for the 3 seconds that it worked in during multiplayer, here's a log that shows it, but also ends in the Tessellator loop:
http://pastebin.com/XQkeNQBd

And there was a crash when switching resource packs in the menu, this one actually managed to crash instead of hang:

http://pastebin.com/9fqeWznS

All of this happens even with VR mode being off, and I'm nVidia hardware.

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Re: Minecrift Discussion Thread

Post by molton »

My 7 year old nephew with down syndrome just tried minecrift and he didn't want to leave the virtual minecraft world. :)
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Re: Minecrift Discussion Thread

Post by CaptnYesterday »

Molton, that's great. I can see vr being a good place for people of differing levels of autism to immerse and relax without as many distractions and complications to interupt.

That said...I never like having to leave Minecrift either.
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Re: Minecrift Discussion Thread

Post by Jademalo »

I do, because normally it means I can lie down to recover from the motion sickness >_<

Bring on DK2!

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Re: Minecrift Discussion Thread

Post by ElectroPulse »

Very cool! Just tried it last night (had been sitting around waiting for an updated link to be posted in the Minecrift archive thread, without realizing that the first post of the thread had it ;)).

The only issues I have with it is the control scheme and the Oculus Rift drift.

As for Oculus Rift drift, is there any way to set up a button on the hydra that resets the origin? It seems like it only takes a minute or so for my Rift to drift like 15 degrees for some reason, and pausing to go into the VR menu to reset the orientation is a bit annoying ever minute or two.

Now, my thoughts on the control scheme: First let me preface this with some background information. Before I got my Rift last summer, I played with the Hydra in Borderlands, Minecraft, Killing Floor, and several other first-person style games. Because of this, I got very accustomed to the control scheme set up by the Sixense Motion Creator. I believe that this is where much of my problems with the control scheme come from. I'm sure if I hadn't done that, I would be fine with it.

Firstly, is there a way to set it up so that I can move the reticule vertically with the Hydra? For some reason, I am only able to move it horizontally, and the only way I can aim at blocks is by looking at them at the same horizontal angle (I can look left and right while hitting blocks, just not up or down).

Now, for some others that were likely brought on by my use of Motion Creator.

Is there a way to ratchet the reticule motion control? For some reason the reticule keeps getting thrown off, and it feels like I am not pointing in the same direction as the reticule is. With Motion Creator, they have it set up so that you hold a button to disable motion tracking, move the Hydra to where you want it to be pointed, and release to resume motion tracking.

Also, is there a way to completely do away with the keyhole for body rotation with the Hydra, and just use the thumbstick? I know it isn't as "natural" as the way it is currently set up, but I would like to be able to face more-or-less the same direction the whole time (within about 180 degrees, so not turning around), while being able to turn around in the game world. I guess what I'm looking for here is have looking, aiming, and body direction all conditionally detached from one another. When I look somewhere, the reticule (aiming) stays still, and so does my body (which is attached to the HUD). When I aim to my side (or even behind me) while looking straight ahead, the in-game character's body (and the attached HUD) and my view should not move. However, when I turn my in-game body (using the controller's stick) (which the in-game body would always be facing "forward" in relation to my real-life body orientation), the head movement as well as aiming would move along with it. This is what I imagine the ideal setup would be, for me at least. Maybe not quite as natural as doing a 180 to change directions, but certainly more convenient.

Other than that, I absolutely love it! Great job so far with the mod :) Really cool idea with the neck model positional tracking, by the way! (and I love how easy the mod is to install!)

Thanks!
ElectroPulse

(Edited for more info/clearer presentation of points)

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Re: Minecrift Discussion Thread

Post by nah89 »

Is there any way that something like FaceTrackNoIr could be tied so that DIY rifts that use IR could tie in too for movement and positioning?

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Re: Minecrift Discussion Thread

Post by ElectroPulse »

Heck yea! Went into the config file and was able to completely disable Hydra rotation by changing the values for keyholewidth and keyholeheight to 360 :D Gonna screw with the config file a bit more in a little while and see if I can tweek it to my liking :)

EDIT: Nevermind, looks like there's no way to turn my body with that setting without tying body to head movement.

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Re: Minecrift Discussion Thread

Post by rupy »

StellaArtois wrote:Progress update; try this!:
minecrift-1.6.4-031_Preview_b1-installer.txt
It's a little rough around the edges! Rename to .exe, then install. Windows only obviously.

Let me know how it goes... :shock:
Where can I find your JNI .dll for Oculus SDK 0.3.X?

Basically I only need the old API because my game renders at 200+ FPS and will not require position.

Which version of the Oculus SDK are the binaries in mabrownings GIT built with?

Why do they require VisualStudion stuff to be installed?

So many questions...
Image
"It's like Homeworld in first person."
Disable Aero and vSync for a completely simulator sickness free experience with 2xHz FPS.
Keep the 0.4.4 config utility open for tracking to work.

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Re: Minecrift Discussion Thread

Post by Tiedye »

Say, it's been a while. Any new info on anything? Sorry for the generality, just curious.

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Re: Minecrift Discussion Thread

Post by Jademalo »

I know stella was on holiday, but I haven't heard anything in the last few weeks.

Is there any chance of the new SDK being implemented in time for DK2 arriving? I'm extremely hype

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Re: Minecrift Discussion Thread

Post by Riftmuckel »

StellaArtois wrote:Glad you're seeing the improvements in head track latency as well! Cheers for testing, as usual!

Is any one else getting menu display issues?

Regarding the additional lag with FSAA - I need to check we're not rendering too large a render target. I may be using the wrong scale factor on this. Or I may be defeating the SDK frame timing logic somehow.

The head track prediction is no longer controlled by Minecrift by the way. Previously we used a set default of 15ms. Then I dabbled with the dynamic setting. Now with 0.3.1 it's fully controlled by the SDK. The SDK decides when it's going to poll the sensor, uses past frame timing data to set a prediction time for each eye render. It then controls when to display the image, after first doing a last poll and time warp correction. Out of my hands completely. This is definitely a good thing! :lol:

The other concerns are noted. I'm wondering if the overlay slowdown is somehow Optifine HD U D1 related. I need to clean up the menus as well - a lot of settings are redundant now with the new SDK. The oculus profile / calibration stuff needs a clean.

Is it not possible to change player height at the moment?
Hi StellaArtois! Your new sdk-integration is amazing.

I got the invisible hud-menu problem solved. You have to change in the hud-settings the hud-orientation to body instead of head. That got the menu working for me, as I normally have it set to head. []-)

senritsu
One Eyed Hopeful
Posts: 1
Joined: Thu Apr 10, 2014 7:20 am

Re: Minecrift Discussion Thread

Post by senritsu »

The new tracking is incredibly snappy, but for some reason drift is through the roof.
I skipped a few builds, so not sure if that is from this specific one, but like another poster above i get at easily 15 degrees in a really really short time. Not only that, but when i hit recalibrate, it's basically up to random chance where my new forward direction ends up. Had everything from 180° behind me, to actually forward. Strange thing is, it stays consistently offset if i recalibrate a few times in a row (i can figure out the yaw offset and move my head not-forward on purpose and press space to set approximately the correct forward direction), but if i wait a bit and try again it may or may not be the same.

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