[DIY] Auto-Stereo with Parallax Barriers

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Jarvis
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Re: [DIY] Auto-Stereo with Parallax Barriers

Post by Jarvis »

Possibly but I'll give it a shot in the near future and come here with results.
I tried the near pattern of a discrepancy to the .00 decimal place still not that great but hey I'm not sure what I should even expect seeing how I've only ever seen a 3ds for all of about 10min a few months back and this screen in much larger, next is .000 and .00000 accuracy to test so maybe I can offer a good idea of the e- exponent people need to use.
The pattern has a decent effect at a distance of 20-27mm and seems to not cut the resolution as much so I might try to make a frame with arduino and driver compatibility between a printer hardware and computer to motorize it (for focal length adjustment )to test on larger size screens but I still get a lot of sub-pixel miss shading/coloring not to mention the amount of interleaving required overlays on the next frame too much as the image moves.
Monday I'm gonna try to get some stuff printed with the Digital press's, and Pixima Pro units in the canon show room here in town. They output 4800 x 2400 dpi1 - 4800 x 4800 dpi1 Black so I should have good success with the best calculation variations and I'll make sure to have a lot of test sample images ready.
Btw when I'm done with this project which is a want for good glasses-less 3d screen for modeling stuff with my small cnc machine, I'm really interested in making a HMD for another project how is the immersion and 3D with some commercial/consumer products you have used cyber?

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Re: [DIY] Auto-Stereo with Parallax Barriers

Post by patfreak »

hi there,im new to this forum an want to make a parrallax barrier for iphone 4s..is there someone who already had the format so i could just download & print that out..tia & more power...

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Re: [DIY] Auto-Stereo with Parallax Barriers

Post by Fredz »

You can buy one from grilli3d, no need to print it yourself.

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Re: [DIY] Auto-Stereo with Parallax Barriers

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Re: [DIY] Auto-Stereo with Parallax Barriers

Post by luna138 »

Hi guys,
I have a problem with my parallax barrier. when I put it on my monitor(lenovo 1366*768) with a interleaved black and white image(black as right image and white as left image) on it, I just see RGB patterns. If it works, I should see black when I close my left eye and white when I close my right eye, but I do not. what is the problem?! It could be about my measures? help me please.

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Re: [DIY] Auto-Stereo with Parallax Barriers

Post by cybereality »

If you are seeing vertical bands of color, that is good, you just need to adjust the measurements. Like something like this:

Image

If you are seeing wild patterns of color, then you either have the pattern totally wrong, or your printer is not good enough.

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Re: [DIY] Auto-Stereo with Parallax Barriers

Post by Burbruee »

Thinking about trying this on my asus ultrabook 13" 1080p for some 3D gaming. But it looks like iZ3D driver is dead and you can no longer activate or buy a license, and they didn't make it free so it will only work for 30 days no matter what? What about TriDef, can I purchase that instead or maybe they don't support the mode required? Also not sure where to buy the transparent film and what size and if it will fit my printer. I live in sweden so it needs to be able to ship internationally or even better if I can buy local. I have one HP Laserjet P2055d (black only) and one Deskjet F4180 (color) hoping one of those will do the job.

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Re: [DIY] Auto-Stereo with Parallax Barriers

Post by cybereality »

You can use the DDD driver in 'Sharp 3D Laptop' mode.

I got the paper on ebay, you can probably find some international sellers. Just look for "transparency film" in a size that will fix your printer.

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Re: [DIY] Auto-Stereo with Parallax Barriers

Post by Burbruee »

Found the paper, now the question is whether the printer is good enough. Looking at the specs, it's
up to 600 x 600 dpi (mono) / up to 1200 x 2400 dpi (color)

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Re: [DIY] Auto-Stereo with Parallax Barriers

Post by cybereality »

1200dpi should be enough. With 600dpi you may have problems. Make sure to use black ink only and set the printer to the high quality setting.

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Re: [DIY] Auto-Stereo with Parallax Barriers

Post by Burbruee »

cybereality wrote:You can use the DDD driver in 'Sharp 3D Laptop' mode.
Just installed the trial version to confirm, when I select this mode it appears to run games at a fixed resolution of 1024x768, possible to get it running at 1920x1080 or 1280x720? Other modes such as Side-by-side, line interlaced or side-by-side indicates "Any resolution" for Preferred.

Image

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Re: [DIY] Auto-Stereo with Parallax Barriers

Post by cybereality »

You may be right. I tested a game in windowed mode and it worked, but maybe it restricts full screen games to that 1024x768 resolution.

The stereo driver I've been working on supports vertical interleave, but unfortunately only with a handful of games. It will be released in the next week so at least you can have something to test with.

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Re: [DIY] Auto-Stereo with Parallax Barriers

Post by Burbruee »

Well it seems to render fine at higher resolutions as long as the game itself is capable of running in windowed mode, just tried 1600x900 in windowed and looked as it should. I haven't done any printing just yet (waiting for the film to be delivered) but it looks to render fine, as opposed to full screen where the display sets itself to 1024x768 automatically. The main games I plan on playing supports windowed so it's alright I guess. Plus there's always my 3d vision kit for the desktop in the other room so it's no deal breaker. This is just a fun project to test and have some portable S3D gaming.

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Re: [DIY] Auto-Stereo with Parallax Barriers

Post by industrai »

I found this on ebay, http://www.ebay.ca/itm/Glasses-free-3D- ... 518wt_1139

From the description it looks like they use plexiglass with precision slits, and recommend insulating tape to angle the barrier. I haven't seen anything else as far as commercial parallax barriers for regular screens go, is this the first? I don't imagine it would be too difficult to manufacture a frame with adjustable height for a parallax barrier insert of varying resolutions/sizes, but google be damned, this DIY and that ebay item are the only things I could find.

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Re: [DIY] Auto-Stereo with Parallax Barriers

Post by cybereality »

Nice find, industrai.

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Re: [DIY] Auto-Stereo with Parallax Barriers

Post by shiraz »

Hi cybereality

I'm hoping you could help me with a few questions.

Can you please tell me if your hack worked well with viewing 3D YouTube / local mp4 3d video files on a 2d monitor.
What viewing Mode in YouTube 3D works best?

Have you tried any of these or other possible materials available on the net:
http://lenstarlenticular.com/Single/flatbed.htm
http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Lenticul ... 44659.html
http://globalwave.heteml.jp/en/html/2_about_pic3d.html

Cheers mate
Shiraz
Id be grateful if u could add me to Skype for further discussions.
Skype: ShirazAAhmed

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cybereality
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Re: [DIY] Auto-Stereo with Parallax Barriers

Post by cybereality »

The hack did work on YouTube for 3D videos in their "column interleaved" mode. You can also do this with the Stereoscopic Player.

I did not experiment with lenticular lenses much. I did look into it briefly but it did not seem viable because of the difficulty of matching the dot pitch of the monitor to the LPI of the lenticular sheet. I know its possible, because I've seen videos on YouTube (I think from some Japanese guy, can't remember what the video was called). So there is a way to make it work, I just don't know much about it.

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Re: [DIY] Auto-Stereo with Parallax Barriers

Post by Fredz »

Lenticular lenses can be used slanted, so you don't need to align them with pixel columns. You need to convert 3D videos to this format though, but it's just a matter of using an AVISynth script with an image mask. I posted such a script in my 3DeeSlide review thread and a movie converted in this format on YouTube.

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Re: [DIY] Auto-Stereo with Parallax Barriers

Post by natoftw »

I have a quick question ! I'm planning to do the whole parallax barrier thing as a graduation project for my bachelors degree. If i want to convert 2D video into 3D video, what should i change ? Do i have to shift every off pixel in time, do i change color scheme ? I'm not quite sure. In other words, how does the "Column Interleaved" 3D mode of youtube work (since cyberreality said the method works with that mode) ? Thanks !


My idea is to record HD Video in real time, convert it using some sort of a software (if there is no software available i'll write one myself on MatLab) and showcase the 3d technology to an audience.

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Re: [DIY] Auto-Stereo with Parallax Barriers

Post by zalo »

Here's a kooky idea:
What if you had a printer that could make lines the width of one subpixel. Then, you make a barrier for each subpixel with the inverse of that color subpixel. Now you have a mono-color display with 3x the horizontal pixel density, since the barrier neutralizes the colors coming from each subpixel!

I'm thinking about it specifically for the rift. Your eyes move a little relative to the display, so even though parallax isn't a huge issue, it would need to be accounted for across the FoV.

Also, I wonder if Chromatic Aberration can be abused to fake more resolution, but that's a subject for another thread.

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Re: [DIY] Auto-Stereo with Parallax Barriers

Post by djemergency »

Wouldn't it make life easier if you created something like this? http://spritesmods.com/3dmonitor/sheetwizard/

This only works with multi angle parallax... we just need something like this to make a barrier for every other pixel. (If I knew coding I could make this, but I don't :()

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Re: [DIY] Auto-Stereo with Parallax Barriers

Post by Robban8818 »

Hi I have tried to make the parallax barrier pattern on my Samsung SyncMaster 2233SN LCD but I do not understand how to make 11.7 px on Adobe Photoshop CS6 :( . I can do 11 or 12 px. Would have been happy if someone could help me make the 11.7 parallax barrier pattern to me :) .
Sorry for my english.

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Re: [DIY] Auto-Stereo with Parallax Barriers

Post by cybereality »

Yes, you can do it but you have to use multiple lines at different widths.

For example, if you need 11.7px you can make one line at 11px, then 2 lines at 12px (then repeat the pattern).

11 * 1 + 12 * 2 = 35
35 / 3 = 11.66666 (which may be close enough)

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Re: [DIY] Auto-Stereo with Parallax Barriers

Post by Robban8818 »

Okay but I do not understand how real you mean. My English is bad :( . you can do one picture for example how to do it? Would have been happy for the help thanks! :)
// Sorry for my eng

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Re: [DIY] Auto-Stereo with Parallax Barriers

Post by cybereality »

parallax_barrier.jpg
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Re: [DIY] Auto-Stereo with Parallax Barriers

Post by Robban8818 »

Thanks I'll try it! :)

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Re: [DIY] Auto-Stereo with Parallax Barriers

Post by gl »

I did a DIY barrier like this with an inkjet a v. long time ago (I think I had a 4:3 aspect monitor at the time, it was my first LCD - yep, that long ago : ). It worked, but it kinda sucked. The sub-pixel issue (which I didn't understand then), but then it's also ghosting (crosstalk).

The main reason for that is that inkjet ink isn't opaque, so the blocked pixels are shining through a little. (that's why you need to print on white paper, the white shines through and the coloured ink just filters it). Easy to see, just hold the printed transparency up to a light. I used dye-based ink though, has anyone tried with pigment-based ink (often called 'archival' or similar)? That should be a bit better as it's more opaque. I also wondered if laser doesn't produce more opaque black on transparencies (never owned one) - anyone compare the two?

I'm seriously looking at doing a barrier again, for a cheap high-res tablet like the Teclast P90HD (2560x1600 res 8.9", ~339dpi). I need one to demo 3D videos and art, so large size, high res & good colour quality are essential. And I want it to be excellent 3D quality with very low ghosting and no RGB fringing.

So, we need a super-clear transparent material (probably a film), and high-res fully opaque (or near-as) black printing on it. Can we find some commercial printing method that can do this (without needing large minimum orders)? I guess if laser doesn't, then high-res screen printing or something like it would give fully opaque lines. Then you would prototype the exact barrier DPI with your own printer first, and then get it printed properly (probably needing a few more attempts to nail it).

Even better if we could agree on a device, then we can collaborate on the precise barrier specs or even get them printed together and distributed. The device sub-pixel arrangement would have to be vertical in landscape mode to avoid colour fringing.

That P90HD tablet is cheap @ ~200USD & has good reviews. Downside is you have to import them from China (eg. Ali Express) with little to no support, unless you're happy paying for expensive return shipping.

Either way I'd love to find the best possible (affordable) printing method. Anyone interested?
Last edited by gl on Sat Nov 08, 2014 8:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: [DIY] Auto-Stereo with Parallax Barriers

Post by gl »

There's also this one, same res but larger screen @ 10". Although something feels fishy about it, looks like it's a Samsung clone?

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Re: [DIY] Auto-Stereo with Parallax Barriers

Post by cybereality »

To be honest, the project was fun (for a DIY thing) but the quality really isn't there.

Not when there are high quality 3D monitors/projectors that you can buy for a few hundred bucks. And if you want mobile, there is the Nintendo 3DS.

I guess it can still be fun to tinker with, but just don't expect quality to rival commercial products.

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Re: [DIY] Auto-Stereo with Parallax Barriers

Post by gl »

You obviously didn't read what I wrote. I'm looking to find a commercial print method on high quality clear material with fully opaque lines. That's all we need.

The 3DS won't do to demo high-res 3D art and videos, will it? ; ).

EDIT: of course there's the Gadmei E8-3D which I have, but it has high ghosting, lousy alignment quality control, poor washed-out colour, at least on my older TN version that has such a large gamma shift, you see different brightness in each eye. So I'm looking to improve on that (might even try eye-tracking coding).

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Re: [DIY] Auto-Stereo with Parallax Barriers

Post by cybereality »

Yes, I did read it. Sorry if I misunderstood.

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Re: [DIY] Auto-Stereo with Parallax Barriers

Post by shinra358 »

can this be done software-wise. Like with an injected shader overlay?

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Re: [DIY] Auto-Stereo with Parallax Barriers

Post by cybereality »

shinra358 wrote:can this be done software-wise. Like with an injected shader overlay?
No. It's a physical mod to the display.

Honestly, it was a cool hobby project at the time but if you want 3D, just buy a 3D monitor/tv or get a VR headset.

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Re: [DIY] Auto-Stereo with Parallax Barriers

Post by pheggie2 »

Not too bright on this however I've been reading about parallax barrier autostereoscopic 3d tutorial at https://www.mtbs3d.com/phpBB/viewtopic. ... &start=191 do you think it world be possible to make the 3d on 24" or even a bigger monitor or 4k tv work in autostereoscopic 3d mode instead of with a transparency parallax barrier sheet but instead a parallax barrier patterned transparent gif or transparent png overlayed on top of a full screen 3dtv.at stereoscopic player setup as iz3d display mode? i was thinking of using alt escape key to bring the transparent image to the top layer of the screen?

in effect a software transparent image parallax barrier?

maybe this software can overlay the parallax barrier transparent image on top of the screen

http://www.colinthomas.com/overlay/

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Re: [DIY] Auto-Stereo with Parallax Barriers

Post by cybereality »

No, a software emulated parallax barrier won't work since it can't redirect the light like film can. That is the whole trick.

To be honest, though, the result was not as good as a real 3D display, it was more of just a fun project. It wasn't really practical because printing out the film at larger sizes is hard (I did this on a 21" monitor, and it wasn't even to the edge of the screen). Especially not for TV size, that would be impractical with consumer printers. It also had a very tight sweet spot, and moving a little would cause ghosting (like on the original Nintendo 3DS, but worse). I honestly wouldn't recommend trying the tutorial except for hobby/fun.

Right now, I would say getting a DLP 3D projector is probably the best bet, and using something like the DDD TriDef software. 3D projectors are still produced (unlike TVs) and they are not that expensive. I have a 1080p 3D projector with a 125" image. I think it cost around $800. If you already have a TV you like, you can try anaglyph glasses (red/cyan filters). The quality is not great (especially with color reproduction) but the 3D effect is there, and you can buy glasses for a few bucks. I've used these ones, they are $1.25 w/ free shipping. https://www.amazon.com/3D-Glasses-Direc ... 004HN2U7W/

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Re: [DIY] Auto-Stereo with Parallax Barriers

Post by nimatoed »

Well, Tridef is officially dead. And autostereoscopy is still infinitely more interesting to regular people than any 3D that requires glasses(outside of a movie theater).

The New Nintendo 3DS series is fantastic, and there are a variety of Asian autostereoscopic devices of dubious quality that exist, but the RED Hydrogen One is by far the best I've ever seen.

My Epson 3D Projector is superb for movies, but doesn't really fly for games. For Seventh Generation consoles, the PlayStation 3D Display will do all you need for games. For PC gaming, you really need an Nvidia 3D Vision 2 system, probably with the ROG SWIFT PG278QR. For a cell phone or 3D camera, you'll want the RED Hydrogen One.

Hopefully someone gets with the program and makes a 4K 3D autostereoscopic gaming monitor. Real time graphics are the one place where content is resolution-independent, so this is really where autostereoscopy can flourish.

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Re: [DIY] Auto-Stereo with Parallax Barriers

Post by cybereality »

Agreed.

I don't think the market for 3D glasses will come back, but I could imagine auto-stereo working if a company could solve the short-comings with it.

Nvidia 3DTV Play still works and you can buy new projectors that support it. I guess that is the best thing for playing traditional games in stereo.

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Re: [DIY] Auto-Stereo with Parallax Barriers

Post by narhicfd »

Is it possible to do this parallax mod to an android phone or is it only possible for iPhones? If it is possible for Android. What possible application could it be used for?

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Re: [DIY] Auto-Stereo with Parallax Barriers

Post by cybereality »

Doing this on a phone I guess would be possible in theory, but may be more difficult due to the much smaller and more precise measurements of the lines.

This would mean you may need a better printer, or it may be too small of a pixel pitch to do with modern phones (I had a lot of trial and error with a 22" monitor).

Also, there would not be a good way for there to be software support unless you were developing your own game (and only wanted support for your own game).

Overall it probably wouldn't be worth it unless as sort of a hobby kind of project.

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Re: [DIY] Auto-Stereo with Parallax Barriers

Post by Guig2000 »

Also if your phone have an amoled display, it may have only 5 subpixel per 2 pixels (it means that there is a shared subpixel between 2 pixels). It leads to unavoidable ghosting if you try a parallax barrier ob this kind of phone.
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