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 3D LCD monitor 
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One Eyed Hopeful

Joined: Tue Apr 12, 2011 6:39 pm
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hi guys,

need some info. please help me decide. I'm about to buy a new 3D LCD monitor for 2D/3D viewing and had decided on anyone of the below LCD's

LG W2363D
Asus VG236HE
Acer 235/245
Viewsonice 22" 2265wm/2268wm
Samsung 22" 2233r

First priority being LG and least Samsung, and depending on price, availability of model near my place, extra features with being little tight on the budget. :)

So my concern here is the other 2 "3D LCD monitors" mentioned in post viewtopic.php?p=58952#p58952 , that is Planar SA2311W and LG W2363D, are these 2 models superior to Asus LCD (review says Asus model might lead to tearing of eye due to glossy reflections) in terms of Real 3D viewing (like Nvidia 3D Vision) like less ghosting, stuttering, brightness, etc ?

Which Active Shutter glasses with emitter should I buy since none of the model come with inbuilt emitter that can run with ATI Radeon 5770 card.

will this glass work ? http://cgi.ebay.in/X3D-system-glasses-p ... 20b842bfc0

would be grateful if you could help me out.

PS: I still own 3 CRT @85Hz but I guess those won't support any 3D as 120Hz is minimum for Real 3D ? never seen any 3D movies so far. I checked Anaglyph Red/Cyan S3D on CRT and did not appeal to me that much. So is it worth investing in 3D monitor & shutter glass ?


Last edited by neol on Wed Apr 13, 2011 6:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.



Wed Apr 13, 2011 5:40 pm
3D Angel Eyes (Moderator)
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If you are on AMD GPU then you will want either the Acer HS244HQ, or any Zalman Trimon model. The other monitors are for Nvidia only.

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Wed Apr 13, 2011 6:13 pm
Petrif-Eyed
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neol wrote:
are these 2 models superior to Asus LCD (review says Asus model might lead to tearing of eye due to glossy reflections) in terms of Real 3D viewing (like Nvidia 3D Vision) like less ghosting, stuttering, brightness, etc ?
I'd say the most important factor for 3D is ghosting, and in this regard the Asus VG236HE is pretty bad compared to the two others. In the following images the ghosting is indicated by the visibility of the smaller R circles on the right and the big R in the middle. On a perfect 3D display they shouldn't be visible, that's almost the case with DLP projectors.

Asus VG236HE
Image

Planar SA2311W
Image

LG W2363D
Image

neol wrote:
Which Active Shutter glasses with emitter should I buy since none of the model come with inbuilt emitter that can run with ATI Radeon 5770 card.
You should buy an NVIDIA graphics card, nothing else is correctly supported for both games and movies in 3D at 120Hz.

These glasses will only be supported with an older NVIDIA graphics card (<7950 GT IIRC) under Windows XP.

neol wrote:
PS: I still own 3 CRT @85Hz but I guess those won't support any 3D as 120Hz is minimum for Real 3D ? never seen any 3D movies so far.
120Hz is the most comfortable frequency, but 85Hz CRT monitors will also work for stereo 3D. You'll experience a lot more shuttering though, better watch them in the dark. Are you sure these monitors don't support 120Hz in lower resolutions ? What are the makers/models ?

From a ghosting point your CRT monitors should be better than any 3D LCD monitor except the Planar and the LG and they should be comparable to the Zalman.

neol wrote:
I checked Anaglyph Red/Cyan S3D on CRT and did not appeal to me that much. So is it worth investing in 3D monitor & shutter glass ?
Stereo 3D with shutter glasses is a lot more impressive than anaglyph, if you're not sure you'll be convinced and don't want to invest much to try, you should first try with your CRT monitors. You'd need to find an older NVIDIA graphics card that should be found for quite cheap, install Windows XP and the NVIDIA stereo driver and buy VGA DDC shutter glasses like the ones you've found.


Wed Apr 13, 2011 8:06 pm
One Eyed Hopeful

Joined: Tue Apr 12, 2011 6:39 pm
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Thanks for replies.
Fredz wrote:
These glasses will only be supported with an older NVIDIA graphics card (<7950 GT IIRC) under Windows XP.

i have an Nvidia GeForce 7025 / nForce 630a IGP and an Geforce FX 5200 AGP Card on other old PC are both sufficient enough to play Real 3D ? :roll:
Fredz wrote:
neol wrote:
PS: I still own 3 CRT @85Hz but I guess those won't support any 3D as 120Hz is minimum for Real 3D ?
120Hz is the most comfortable frequency, but 85Hz CRT monitors will also work for stereo 3D. You'll experience a lot more shuttering though, better watch them in the dark. Are you sure these monitors don't support 120Hz in lower resolutions ? What are the makers/models ?


Dell M770 (17"), Acer AC713 (17"). Had iPex CRT monitor but cannot use that anymore as I recently converted that monitor to TV.



Viewsonic V3D241WM – LED2
Acer HS244HQ
checked for both ATI supported HD3D monitors and both are currently unavailable. Acer guy said they have no production plans for next 6 months to get HS244HQ model in the country. Viewsonic model is about to arrive in a month(becoz of my enquiries/request :roll: ). So I guess am buying Viewsonic model and this one comes with wired shutter glasses as stated on the site (Viewsonic guy said he wasn't sure if this model comes with shutter glass or not). man I hope this 3D setup with ATI 5770 & Viewsonic wire shutter glass work :fingers crossed:


Last edited by neol on Thu Apr 21, 2011 11:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.



Thu Apr 21, 2011 3:17 pm
3D Angel Eyes (Moderator)
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You can check the IZ3D subforum for that Viewsonic monitor ( http://forum.iz3d.com/viewforum.php?f=40 ). Seems like some people are having problems. Honestly I would not trust Viewsonic based on their false marketing of 3D products before (mostly projectors) that didn't fully work in 3D. I would probably recommend getting an Nvidia card and buying the Planar SA2311W. If that is not an option, then maybe see if you can find a Zalman Trimon (which does work perfectly fine with AMD). The Zalman does have its share of issues: narrow viewing angles, loss of resolution, some ghosting, etc. but it has the best compatibility right now.

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Thu Apr 21, 2011 9:24 pm
Petrif-Eyed
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neol wrote:
i have an Nvidia GeForce 7025 / nForce 630a IGP and an Geforce FX 5200 AGP Card on other old PC are both sufficient enough to play Real 3D ? :roll:
I think stereo 3D will work with both these graphic cards and the old NVIDIA stereo driver under Windows XP, using the shutter glasses you found on ebay.

neol wrote:
Dell M770 (17"), Acer AC713 (17").
Here are the specifications of these monitors, as you see they both support up to a 160Hz vertical frequency, which is good news :

Dell M770 : http://supportapj.dell.com/support/edoc ... c/spec.htm
Vertical scan range : 50 - 160 Hz
Horizontal scan range : 30 - 70 kHz

Acer AC713 : ftp://ftp.work.acer-euro.com/monitor/cr ... nglish.pdf
Vertical scan range : 50 - 160 Hz
Horizontal scan range : 30 - 72 kHz
Video Dot Rate : 110 MHz

They should work in stereo 3D at 100 or 120Hz, but probably at quite low resolutions according to my calculations using the XFree86 Modeline Generator. For 120Hz I think you should be limited to 640x480 and to 800x600 at 100Hz, which looks like a good compromise between flickering and resolution. It should also work in 1024x768 at 85Hz, but the flickering will be quite annoying at this frequency. The effect can be reduced by playing in the dark though.

So I think you can test stereo 3D for quite cheap by just buying the shutter glasses you found on ebay. If you are convinced by the result you could then buy a 3D LCD monitor. The ghosting will probably be equivalent or worse, but you should be able to play in higher resolutions and with a larger image diagonal.


Sun Apr 24, 2011 12:25 pm
One Eyed Hopeful

Joined: Tue Apr 12, 2011 6:39 pm
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Thx for replies cyberreality and fredz. I hope am not irritatting.


http://cgi.ebay.com/Brand-New-3D-wirele ... 657wt_1147

how about this emitter and shutter glasses, will this work with CRT ?

I guess this shutter glass & emitter should work any ATI/NVIDIA Card + 120Hz LCD as well ???! IF yes, then which below setup is better

Viewsonic V3D241wm + use inbuilt wired glass
Viewsonic V3D241wm + get this new shutter glasses as well
LG W2363D + this new shutter glass

====================== OR ==============================
Wait for few more months and get a Passive 3D monitor like new LG model. ?

EDIT: by any ATI/Nvidia card, I mean for ATI 5000 and 6000 series.


Mon Apr 25, 2011 11:51 pm
3D Angel Eyes (Moderator)
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Those glasses are bootleg Nvidia glasses, and thus have the same compatibility (see here: http://www.nvidia.com/object/3d-vision- ... ments.html ). But they should work with a CRT, provided you have an Nvidia card. Iz3D is also slated to release their own shutter glasses, which will be universally compatible (AMD/Nvidia) but who knows how many months that is away. I would stay away from the Viewsonic, I've heard too many bad things in terms of compatiblity.

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Tue Apr 26, 2011 8:16 pm
One Eyed Hopeful
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Hi Neol
Although I am very new to 3D, but still I have been researching alot and would like to share what I have learned about it which might also be helpfull to you.
Regarding these "brandless" Nvidia-rip-off glasses, i wouldnt take any chance even using them with nvidia card. Keep in mind that you dont just want things to "work" only, you actually want to have full immersion. Bad galsses could ruin your entire experience.
As for CRT monitor, like Cyber said, normaly shutter glasses work with CRT but just to clarify the requirements have a look here: http://pymol.sourceforge.net/stereo3d.html
And finally for AMD GPU solution; well what I have discovered so far is that its impossible to use these "Nvidia 3D Vision certified" monitors with AMD because the monitor itself checks for the presence of "Nvdia Card" for doing 3D.
So your choices are limited here, the only proven and viable solution seems to be zalman monitor. Although new options like "Viewsonic V3D241m", "Acer HS24H / HN27H" and few others are there but i would rather wait to see the feedbacks.
Also same for the new “LG D2342P”

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Wed Apr 27, 2011 9:01 am
One Eyed Hopeful

Joined: Tue Apr 12, 2011 6:39 pm
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thx for replies
PrimeTimeAction wrote:
...Although new options like "Viewsonic V3D241m", "Acer HS24H / HN27H" and few others are there but i would rather wait to see the feedbacks.
Also same for the new “LG D2342P”


that is why I waited :)

as of now LG D2342P-PN (Passive 3D) looks like a better option after lot of people recommended it here, buying it off ebay once I get the my credit card. If anyone thinks why I should or should not buy this LG monitor let me know.

help much appreciated.


Tue May 03, 2011 7:32 am
Petrif-Eyed
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Have a look here if you want more opinions on this display :
LG D2342P-PN (Passive)


Tue May 03, 2011 6:10 pm
One Eyed Hopeful

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yea fredz am following that thread then considered this display. I guess 1080p in Passive 3D would take atleast a year for a monitor with 4k x 2K resolution(for 3D 1080p) to come out & even if it did it would be crazy costly. i think this is much better than Viewsonic V3D241wm-led like cybereality said.


Wed May 04, 2011 4:50 am
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Small (desktop size) FPR monitors with 4K resolution won't happen for a while due to the viewing angle issues.
I don't see FPR technology improving enough in the short term to allow it.
To circumvent this limitation, manufacturers would need to find a different way to polarise the light (do not use film over a standard LCD display) or change their pixel technology (get rid of LCD and use OLED instead).

Anyway you are right that when it will be available it will be expensive as hell.

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Thu May 05, 2011 1:45 pm
One Eyed Hopeful

Joined: Tue Apr 12, 2011 6:39 pm
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Finally purchased and LG D2342P-PN (Passive) just arrived.

Monitor is bundled with

2 3D Glasses(1 Normal type & other with Clip-on type)
LG Monitor Driver CD and TriDef 3D Software CD.
DVI-D cable
D-Sub cable
All the manual and stuff are in Korean wtf ?

before I proceed(b4 you guys judge), I haven't seen any 3D monitors, however searched and tried a lot in many Showrooms and Malls but none had them. All they had was Sony Bravia 3D TV with unwilling salesmen to give any 3D demo & non-charged Active Shutter glasses finally after persuading I got see Sony Bravia 3D demo. so my Real 3D experience was only this and Thor 3D in Xpand theater.

Setup: Monitor by default comes in Korean lang. changed & connected the monitor with DVI-D cable which came with monitor to my ATI 5770 & installed Tridef 3D App and your good to go with 3D. However I didn't see any HD3D option here like this guy claims probably coz am using XP or DVI-D.

I haven't checked much in depth just saw few Trailer, played a game. Rarely there is any ghosting even if there is you can tune the depth and precision and get rid of it. the funny thing is in game while playing and switching from 3D to 2D & viz I could easily make out the difference in DX9 and DX10 since the game profile was for DX9.

Like I said am yet to check the monitor fully. Will post more tomorrow. If you guys want me to check anything else let me know will do it.


Wed May 25, 2011 12:38 pm
Petrif-Eyed
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It would be nice if you could take photos of the DDD ghosting test through the glasses for the left and right eyes. You can find the image here : http://www.mediafire.com/imageview.php? ... hla505p65r

You could try to take photos from different distances if that's not to much to ask, since it was said that there was ghosting when the observer was not at least at 1.5m from the display.

Thanks.


Wed May 25, 2011 1:50 pm
3D Angel Eyes (Moderator)
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Yeah, I would love to hear what you think of the display. Ghosting can also be helped by tilting the monitor forward and back so that it lines up exactly with your center of vision. At least that is how it works on the Zalman.

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Wed May 25, 2011 9:07 pm
One Eyed Hopeful

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here you go guys a small review of LG D2342P-PN monitor.

As per manual for Optimal view recommended user distance should be 50cm to 90cm.
These screenshots where taken from a distance of ~95cm from monitor using mobile camera hence you can see some blur on the photos & tried to keep the hand still while capturing. :-D But these images are not as bad as they look in photos.
these were the better ones from several pics I took (ATM didn't have any other camera lying around).

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image


GTA 4 - 3D game left view
Image

GTA 4 - 3D game left view
Image

3D wallpaper both views.
left view
Image
right view
Image
left view
Image
right view
Image

3D movie left view

Image

*************************************************************************

these below 2 photos were taken from 1.5 meter (150cm) distance

Image

Image

Monitor has 3 options in HDMI 1.4 3D mode*
SIDE BY SIDE
TOP & BOTTOM
LINE INTERLACED.
^^these 3 options are not available when connected in DVI-D. By default 3D in DVI-D is LINE INTERLACED.

I remember watching Thor 3D movie in 4K Xpand theater(Active 3D) the first 5 minutes scene were Thor is dropped on earth, the scenes were severely dark. Unlike other 3D monitors (Active Shutter display) Brightness is not a problem when viewing 3D content. this is one of the features already mentioned on LG site.

Like cybereality said titling monitor helps in reducing ghosting providing perfect 3D content.
You can also lock your 2D or 3D Settings on monitor.
There's also a power saving feature available on the monitor.

These are the Resolution and refresh rate when connected thru HDMI.
Image

Another factor I wanted to discuss is you guys mentioned that 3D content will be halved from 1920x1080p to 1920x540p but I didn't notice much difference. Probably that happens only when 3D is viewed in Side-by-side mode ??

Currently am using Tridef app for viewing 3D content. I'm yet to figure out how to use ATI HD3D, however am not finding any HD3D option even after installing latest ATI catalyst driver + hotfix, not sure where to find it cause another user with same monitor + ATI gfx card found that option, what am I doing wrong ?
I didn't try iZ3D driver as Tridef was sufficient enough. But I need to find out the ATI HD3D option thingy as the other user says its AWESOME. If anybody knows let me know.

If I find any other option or settings will let you know, as I haven't tried all features & HDMI/HD3D. thats it for now. If anyone wants to buy this I would definitely recommended it. Its a great 3D display. If you guys want me to check/test anything else let me know. Will be glad to verify.

uploaded monitor manual here if anybody wants to verify something.

***
1)By HDMI 1.4 mode and DVI-D mode I mean connected using HDMI 1.4 cable and DVI-D cable respectively. As you know this monitor supports HDMI 1.4 as well.

2)All the above posted pics where taken in DVI-D mode(LINE INTERLACED) with Tridef 3D software.


Last edited by neol on Fri May 27, 2011 9:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.



Fri May 27, 2011 8:47 am
Petrif-Eyed
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Thanks for the review, I'm pretty much impressed by the very low grey ghosting, not much by the black-white ghosting but that was expected.

When we were talking about the resolution divided by two, I think we didn't talk about 1920x1080 -> 1280x720 but about 1920x1080 -> 1920x540, which is still better than 1280x720, but we can clearly see this reduction in resolution with the black lines that are apparent at the distance you took the pictures.

Seems to be a quite good display still, I didn't think they would be able to do that much progress compared to the Huyndai or Zalman displays already available with this technology.

Some less blurred photos would have been great but I can understand it's not that easy to take good photos without a tripod. If you could try to take more by using the delay of a camerathat you would just put still somewhere without the need to push the button to take the photo, that would be even greater.

Thank you very much for that review anyway.


Fri May 27, 2011 5:33 pm
3D Angel Eyes (Moderator)
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Judging from the pictures it looks better than Zalman. I imagine its pretty nice looking in real-life. Thanks for the review.

To use AMD HD3D mode you need to go into "Tools" -> "Display Settings..." on the DDD TriDef Ignition driver and then choose "AMD", "AMD HD3D". Only works over HDMI. Here is a video showing the steps:


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Fri May 27, 2011 9:54 pm
One Eyed Hopeful

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I have 2 xfx6870 in crossfire, I know AMD only utilises 1 card, will the passive LG D2342P-PN utilse both?


Fri Oct 28, 2011 12:44 am
3D Angel Eyes (Moderator)
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Unfortunately Iz3D and DDD drivers do not yet support Crossfire fully. Well I think Iz3D had some beta support for it, but I don't think for DDD. However you should still be able to use the monitor, you just won't get the full performance of your system.

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Fri Oct 28, 2011 5:47 pm
One Eyed Hopeful

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I now have bought the monitor


Sat Nov 19, 2011 12:42 am
3D Angel Eyes (Moderator)
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dozenkai wrote:
I now have bought the monitor

Did you get it yet? What do you think of it?

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Sat Nov 19, 2011 11:24 am
One Eyed Hopeful

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dozenkai wrote:
I now have bought the monitor

congratulations. your thoughts on dual Gfx card setup, does it work ?


Sat Nov 19, 2011 10:25 pm
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