MS/NVIDIA are KILLING 3D Vision Driver via Windows 10 Update

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oneofthe8devilz
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MS/NVIDIA are KILLING 3D Vision Driver via Windows 10 Update

Post by oneofthe8devilz »

MICROSOFT/NVIDIA are FORCING Geforce Driver 432.00 via Windows 10 Update

Last week I started to think I was tripping when suddenly out of nowhere I noticed that my beloved and meticulously tuned 3DS&VR Windows 10 setup would force update without message or warning from the 425.31 3D Vision compatible driver to the NON 3D Vision containing 432.00 geforce driver version...

I guess MICROSOFT/NVIDIA finally figured that with users preventing geforce driver updates via their usual delivery pipelines (geforce experience & co) they would try a new approach by forcing the geforce driver update via the windows update system...

I don't know about you guys but with most 3D Vision enthusiasts having moved from nvidia.com to here, this pretty much looks like a declaration of war from where I stand...

It seems that I have figured out a way to reliably prevent that "SLIP-IN" forced windows update on my machine but before giving a tutorial that could potentially brick your Win10 installation I thought I would first bring this matter to you guys' attention.

Apologies in advance in case this has been already posted/discussed on these forums...

Nice Try NVIDIA !!!

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Last edited by oneofthe8devilz on Sat Dec 07, 2019 8:45 am, edited 5 times in total.
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Re: NVIDIA KILLING 3D Geforce Driver via Windows Update

Post by schwing »

    You can set the option in Windows Update to disable driver updates, but I don't see it on my end. Another is to use DDU's similar option, but I assume that's only temporary for installing a driver just after the restart without WU interfering. I haven't seen any normal way of stopping regular updates other than delaying them.

    As for another way, if it's system DLL's then no, that won't brick your OS. What I've seen from that are notifications stop working (clicking the icon does nothing) and WU stops doing anything. IIRC the PC Settings app that WU is based on stops working correctly too. In any case, you could create a system restore point first to fix any bricking that does occur.

    If it's not that and w/e you did works for you, then I'm sure other people on this forum would be interested to know. Thanks for letting us know.
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Re: NVIDIA KILLING 3D Geforce Driver via Windows Update

Post by bo3bber »

Interesting change in behavior.

I'm getting something similar on 1903, where the driver is pending a download, but is not forcing itself on. That is most likely because I set the networking as being a metered connection, and they mostly respect that maybe you don't want immediate downloads burning your data cap.

It's also strange because 432.00 is not even a WHQL driver that you can fetch from the geforce driver downloads. Seems like yet another Microsoft software disaster. I wish they'd get their sh*t together and stop making these amateur mistakes. PC gaming is being ruined by Microsoft's bad choices.

Happening to other people as well: https://www.tenforums.com/graphic-cards ... -00-a.html

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Re: NVIDIA KILLING 3D Geforce Driver via Windows Update

Post by oneofthe8devilz »

It looks like this geforce 432.00 driver windows update started being pushed around November 2019.

There is plenty of people complaining about this at various places: https://www.windowsphoneinfo.com/thread ... 00.262287/

Well here is what I did to prevent my version of Win10 from being able to actually apply this update and it ain't exactly "RocketScience":

From observation I noticed that while this update is being downloaded it is being placed temporarily at the following file & folder location:
"C:\Windows\SoftwareDistribution\Download\23cf258f4b2cc02eb5ef7d0bd54cc168\857e4a5473a85c2623285311e25e1bc0644c5862"

On update download completion it is being placed at: "C:\Windows\SoftwareDistribution\Download\857e4a5473a85c2623285311e25e1bc0644c5862"

Once the update is being applied by Windows, that file generates a temporary installer folder at "C:\Windows\SoftwareDistribution\Download" from where the Geforce 432.00 driver is being installed.

So to break this chain process, I simply replaced the already existing "581,714,058" bytes large file "C:\Windows\SoftwareDistribution\Download\857e4a5473a85c2623285311e25e1bc0644c5862" with a self-created fake/dummy "33" bytes large file, only containing a short text expression of what I think about this update. Then I set that fake/dummy file's attributes to "read only".

So whenever Win10 now tries to apply this update, it actually fails to do so since it tries to execute/extract this purposely corrupted fake/dummy update file.

Now the folder and file naming for this update so far always remained the same for me. It might be worth checking if the same naming is used for everyone else so that the above procedure to prevent this update would generally apply.
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Re: NVIDIA KILLING 3D Geforce Driver via Windows Update

Post by Feisty_Fernando »

Happy to be running Win 7 64. By the time I migrate to 10 you rocket scientists will have the 3D driver issues all sorted.

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Re: MS/NVIDIA are KILLING 3D Vision Driver via Windows 10 Up

Post by Necropants »

My 1803 build is currently on pause for 365 days.
But I have Disabled driver updates via Group policy. Is this not enough?

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Re: MS/NVIDIA are KILLING 3D Vision Driver via Windows 10 Up

Post by DJ-RK »

*puts on ambulance-chaser uniform*

If Nvidia is forcing a driver update that will make 3DVision completely obsolete (for your average user that doesn't know how to jump through hoops to make things otherwise), could that be possible grounds for a class-action lawsuit against them for rendering technology that people have paid them money for useless? This isn't usually my line of thinking, but if it is then maybe we should pursue that avenue, if nothing but to make an actual statement to Nvidia that they've officially gone too far this time and that their lack of respect and support for us, after all this time, will not go untolerated.

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Re: MS/NVIDIA are KILLING 3D Vision Driver via Windows 10 Up

Post by skyrimer »

Yeah this happened to me to, suddenly I saw 3d vision gone from nvidia panel and 432 drivers so wtf moment. I've installed the 441.20 with schwing method so I'm good for now and I assume MS won't annoy me for some time, but for future drivers this coul become annoying.
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Re: MS/NVIDIA are KILLING 3D Vision Driver via Windows 10 Up

Post by nGrander »

There's a Microsoft program called WUSHOWHIDE that is very helpful. With it one can hide unwanted updates thus being able to keep on using 425.31-driver.

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Re: MS/NVIDIA are KILLING 3D Vision Driver via Windows 10 Up

Post by Chtiblue »

Thx just what we need, very nice find nGrander!

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Re: MS/NVIDIA are KILLING 3D Vision Driver via Windows 10 Up

Post by oneofthe8devilz »

@nGrabder

From the "tenforums.com" thread:

"Showhide does not detect the update at all. As far as the apps, I had them selected to search for updates but not download or install. Then i tried to disable windows update and only use the apps which the update also ignored and proceeded to install once again."

Have you actually tried WUSHOWHIDE to confirm if it indeed actually prevents this specific update ?
Last edited by oneofthe8devilz on Tue Dec 10, 2019 5:05 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: MS/NVIDIA are KILLING 3D Vision Driver via Windows 10 Up

Post by nGrander »

@oneofthe8devilz

For me it didn't detect the update if Windows already updated the driver. What I did was use DDU to clean the Windows updated drivers, then not certain if i installed 425.31 or used wushowhide first. Probably doesn't matter. Anyhow: Windows update doesn't offer me nVidia-update anymore.

Hopefuly this helps.

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Re: MS/NVIDIA are KILLING 3D Vision Driver via Windows 10 Up

Post by bo3bber »

*puts on ambulance-chaser uniform*

If Nvidia is forcing a driver update that will make 3DVision completely obsolete (for your average user that doesn't know how to jump through hoops to make things otherwise), could that be possible grounds for a class-action lawsuit against them for rendering technology that people have paid them money for useless? This isn't usually my line of thinking, but if it is then maybe we should pursue that avenue, if nothing but to make an actual statement to Nvidia that they've officially gone too far this time and that their lack of respect and support for us, after all this time, will not go untolerated.
I've been thinking about this as well. I feel like NVidia is definitely abusing their monopoly position and breaking things without a care in the world. (Not out of malice, most likely just clumsy, stupid, large corporation).

But I do feel like they need a class-action lawsuit for their "one year of support" of 3D Vision. We have yet to see any update to the driver from 425.31, and that includes zero updates for security fixes. This is definitely breaking the contract for 'supported.'


Anyone feel like taking on a slow, long term task of getting some lawyers excited about this idea? Best place to start would be the lawyers that won the GTX 970 class action lawsuit. I'm sure they'd at least give it a look.

This is most likely a Don Quixote quest, but I'd really like someone here to take this on and drive it. (I thought about doing it, but honestly I can contribute better by coding.)

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Re: MS/NVIDIA are KILLING 3D Vision Driver via Windows 10 Up

Post by zig11727 »

Below are the group policy setting I use when enable these policies you will never download a driver via Windows update

Disable Driver Updates via Windows Updates
Computer Configuration > Administrative Templates > Windows Components > Windows Update > Do not include drivers with Windows Update > Enabled
Computer Configuration > Administrative Templates > System > Device Installation > Prevent device metadata retrieval from the Internet > Enabled
Computer Configuration > Administrative Templates > System > Device Installation > Specify search order for device driver source locations > Enabled (Do not search Windows Update)

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Re: MS/NVIDIA are KILLING 3D Vision Driver via Windows 10 Up

Post by Necropants »

That's what I also do Zig11727, question is does it work?

@Bo3bber

Also wasn't there a recent security scare and we were all getting told to upgrade to the latest version. If they have dedicated to support till april (A support person saying, we have ceased support is not support.) then I sure there is grounds. I wouldn't be the one to pursue it either though.

and currently I am having absolutely no issues just reinjecting 3dvision back into the driver via 3dfix manager. Id really prefer to not bring attention to the fact we are able to do this. If things got nasty I could imagine them definitely turning malicious.

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Re: MS/NVIDIA are KILLING 3D Vision Driver via Windows 10 Up

Post by zig11727 »

@Necropants

Yes it works before enforcing the group policy if I did a clean install and used DDU after rebooting from safe mode to normal mode a video driver would always download via Windows update I used to unplug my network cable to prevent video driver's from downloading.
Now since I'm using the enforcing the three setting in group policy for the last couple of months a driver hasn't downloaded via Windows Update I don't have to unplug my network cable when doing a clean driver install.

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Re: MS/NVIDIA are KILLING 3D Vision Driver via Windows 10 Up

Post by Lizzard »

Might be tossing a rock in the bush here but lately I've noticed some strange things happening around security concerns in passwords. Its as if Microsoft, Mozilla and Kaspersky are fighting for the "role" of protecting my passwords. Somehow I suspect loopholes have been detected through the display drivers. I understand this has been going on for as long as the internet's existence. But its getting intense now. My credit card was hacked through Amazon not too long ago. With Kaspersky in the background. (cant recall if the license expired) Who could be trusted these days? So excuse my paranoia, but keep such things in mind.

Noticed this thing today when I wanted to watch a 3d movie. 3d vision gone and the 432 driver magically appeared overnight. Something fishy is going on. In the event of a security breach where your passwords are vulnerable companies might force us to do which they just did until the loopholes were sorted. Its probably somewhere in the terms and conditions. But who ever reads that poop?

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Re: MS/NVIDIA are KILLING 3D Vision Driver via Windows 10 Up

Post by Dark_saiyens »

Same here... Today i have reboot my computer, i have changed my CPU for an 9700K and i have seen i was in 432.00 !! My 425.31 is gone !!
I can't reinstall 425 because it is uncompatible with my version of windows...

I am very bored about that, i wanted to play in 3D Vision tonight... I can't play anymore

EDIT: It was an auto install because i have changed my CPU and haven't got any nvidia drivers correctly installed so windows installed DCH drivers...!
Now 3D Vision works great after few hours spendingto use it!

I used DDU to uninstall everything then LOSTI method here https://www.mtbs3d.com/phpbb/viewtopic. ... 05&t=23277 then the 3D Fix by Schwing here: https://www.mtbs3d.com/phpbb/viewtopic. ... 05&t=23352

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Re: NVIDIA KILLING 3D Geforce Driver via Windows Update

Post by Horrux »

Feisty_Fernando wrote:Happy to be running Win 7 64. By the time I migrate to 10 you rocket scientists will have the 3D driver issues all sorted.
I so wanted to do that. I even got it to install on my new Ryzen build but at some point it stopped working. So now I'm in the same boat as the rocket scientists. :-(

I'm still on 418 though, and you guys are scaring me off installing a more recent 3D Vision compatible driver. My version works well enough for my needs ATM either way.

Question: can different users have different driver versions installed? If it comes to some newer games requiring up-to-date drivers, what are we going to do? Dual partitions with the same OS but different driver versions?

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Re: NVIDIA KILLING 3D Geforce Driver via Windows Update

Post by Porlonus »

Horrux wrote:I'm still on 418 though, and you guys are scaring me off installing a more recent 3D Vision compatible driver. My version works well enough for my needs ATM either way. ...... what are we going to do? Dual partitions with the same OS but different driver versions?
Whatever version you're running, you should still be able to get 425.31 running. The only question is about afterwards. We have guides for postponing 1903+ so you can run any driver easily (which is fine till "May 12, 2020 - for most" and "May 11, 2021 - for Enterprise and Education" editions) and for win 10 1903+ with certain steps to get 430.39+ running (which ... works but not in all cases). So no need to freak out now, you can still run anything you like for now, just may a bit of work for a re-setup or need to stay on older drivers.

Don't worry about the future. Well a concern is ok, but no need to be "scared off". We might get that 1903+ fix to work properly at any time, find other ways to get it running, or (dreaming, esp. that soon) may get our own stereoscopic driver where we are not limited in any way (so even amd might work) ....

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Re: MS/NVIDIA are KILLING 3D Vision Driver via Windows 10 Up

Post by lohan »

Now I am facing this problem! I am currently playing Jump Force (Easy Anti-Cheat) unfixed in 3D Vision. Because of that I can't use the latest drivers (Easy Anti Cheat detects the swapped DLLs)
So I am stuck with the latest official 3D Vision driver 325.31. Now everytime I install that driver it gets updated automatically to 432.00 after some restarts.

I see different suggestions here what could be done. Is there any way that definitely works which prevents the forced driver update?

Thanks in advance!

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