New geo-11 driver

[bo3bber]

I tried Witcher 3 with the nvidia_dx11 output and I get a black screen (but I can hear the music). I have to Ctrl-T to disable 3d vision to be able to see the menu so I can quit the game. (Stereoscopy works fine with normal 3d vision.)

-3d vision enabled in Nvidia control panel
-hardware = emitter+Asus monitor
-Geforce driver: 452.06
-3DFM 3d fix installed for Witcher 3
-Game is set to fullscreen in settings
-I simply copied over the x64 folder contents and set force_stereo = 2 in d3dx.ini

As noted on the blog post, fullscreen does not work for nvidia_dx11 output mode. Should work windowed though.

I'm keeping the blog post updated with details as we learn them, but won't do that for this initial thread post.

[BazzaLB]

I added the 3DVision driver to my 511.65 nv driver using HelixVision and then enabled 3D. I have a 3080. If I set output in d3dxdm.ini to nvidia_dx9, I only ever get an anaglyph output. I have a 3DTV that can do proper 1280x720 frame packed 3D (3DTVPlay). Am I missing something in the setup? I set resolution in game to 1280x720 with fullscreen etc. I can get SBS working fine but dx9 output only ever produces anaglyph.

EDIT: Well, the NVidia 3DVision test application only shows anaglyph output as well.. Maybe this is a limitation of 3DTVPlay and latest drivers as there is no way to "setup" your display (No SetupWizard) and therefore the driver probably doesn't correctly identify your display device.

[whyme466]

@BazzaLB - if you have 3DTV, you do NOT need 3DTV Play or any changes to NVidia driver. Simply set output in d3dxdm.ini to tab mode, and use your TV’s remote to select tab 3D setting. The new geo-11 drivers are working great with the newest NVidia graphics drivers and my LG E6 display, with 3080Ti. Note that no NVidia Control Panel 3D test pattern exists, but you can easily tell if geo-11 driver activates.

[BazzaLB]

@BazzaLB - if you have 3DTV, you do NOT need 3DTV Play or any changes to NVidia driver. Simply set output in d3dxdm.ini to tab mode, and use your TV’s remote to select tab 3D setting. The new geo-11 drivers are working great with the newest NVidia graphics drivers and my LG E6 display, with 3080Ti. Note that no NVidia Control Panel 3D test pattern exists, but you can easily tell if geo-11 driver activates.

Howdy Yes, I have been using geo-11 SBS/Tab on my 3080 with no issue, but I wanted to try frame packed to see if 1280x720 frame packed looked better than 1920x1080/sbs/tab (resolution loss). I guess 3DTVPlay means I can't do that.. I am happy with SBS/Tab but wanted to experiment.

Cheers.

[whyme466]

I don't know how that would be possible, but there are a lot of moving parts. Were you using the dx9 or dx11 output mode I would assume? Even in those modes, the code only makes non-destructive changes to driver mode, and does not set any parameters in the registry for example.

Interesting. I am using tab output mode, for my interlaced 3DTV. In my repeated OS switching to test geo-11 (and identify my unusual 3080Ti performance issue), I accidentally ran the geo-11 fix under 3DMigoto mod TWICE, and I had to reload the 3D Vision driver both times.

By the way, congratulations and thank you for this world-class 3D driver! This should re-invigorate interest in the outstanding HelixVision environment. For the limited number of games that I have tested, the geo-11 driver works superbly with the latest RTX hardware and drivers, even with other apps like EVGA Precision X1 running concurrently. Are there plans for a geo-12 driver?

[bo3bber]

@BazzaLB - if you have 3DTV, you do NOT need 3DTV Play or any changes to NVidia driver. Simply set output in d3dxdm.ini to tab mode, and use your TV’s remote to select tab 3D setting. The new geo-11 drivers are working great with the newest NVidia graphics drivers and my LG E6 display, with 3080Ti. Note that no NVidia Control Panel 3D test pattern exists, but you can easily tell if geo-11 driver activates.

Howdy Yes, I have been using geo-11 SBS/Tab on my 3080 with no issue, but I wanted to try frame packed to see if 1280x720 frame packed looked better than 1920x1080/sbs/tab (resolution loss). I guess 3DTVPlay means I can't do that.. I am happy with SBS/Tab but wanted to experiment.

Cheers.

Trying frame packed is not a bad idea, although you'd should back up a step and make sure the 3D Vision Driver is working first. geo-11 can't fix the 3D Vision Driver part.

You can auto-install the driver using 3DFM/HelxiVision from the Drivers tab, but it does a silent install and sets up for older drivers. You might want to run the setup wizard out of the control panel to see if it can find and setup for frame packed, but I suspect you might only have the option of Discover mode. I'm not sure how the 3D TV Play options work out here.

[BigErn77]

I tried Witcher 3 with the nvidia_dx11 output and I get a black screen (but I can hear the music). I have to Ctrl-T to disable 3d vision to be able to see the menu so I can quit the game. (Stereoscopy works fine with normal 3d vision.)

-3d vision enabled in Nvidia control panel
-hardware = emitter+Asus monitor
-Geforce driver: 452.06
-3DFM 3d fix installed for Witcher 3
-Game is set to fullscreen in settings
-I simply copied over the x64 folder contents and set force_stereo = 2 in d3dx.ini

As noted on the blog post, fullscreen does not work for nvidia_dx11 output mode. Should work windowed though.

I'm keeping the blog post updated with details as we learn them, but won't do that for this initial thread post.

Windowed just gives me 2D/no stereoscopy (but, oddly, does have the geo-11 overlay. I also tried nvidia_dx9 with fullscreen and that just gives me normal 3d vision with the same handicapped performance (no geo-11 overlay).

[pj519]

@ bo3bber @ davegl1234. Thanks for all your great work, you keep our passion for 3D gaming alive. I am using the nvidia 452.06 driver and in the geo11 driver I choose the setting
- nvidia_dx11 in the d3dxdm.ini file. I play using the Asus PG278QR monitor with Nvidia 3DVision glasses. My question is actually not about 3D. In all the games I tested, I tried to use reshade. Unfortunately, the interface itself and the visual effects show up in one eye. Are you aware of this problem, and if so, is it fixable?

[EpsilonLyrae]

I bit the bullet and scooped up a 3dvision kit. Once it arrives, I'll get a chance to do some testing. Going to need a lot of things to line up (kit still in working order, able to configure nvtimingsed and cru correctly, dx9 mode of geo-11 has to play nice...), but the price was right for me not to feel too bad if it doesn't work out.

Happy to do my part and provide more meaningful test results. As a nice side bonus, if it all comes together, I can use 3d vision on my nice OLED tv

[3DNovice]

If I had a pair of ye-olde red and blue specs, this would technically be playable, albeit with the usual cross talk you can expect using such a dated method of stereoscopy.

On a good 4K TV there is no crosstalk due to the extensive coverage of the color gamut. Provided that you are using red/cyan, in older drivers it was red/blue.
But the eye rivalry from that red filter is the deal breaker. I haven't tried alternate anaglyph formats, the colors are changeable in the registry.

When you talk about using 3D Vision with your OLED TV, it would be at 1440P on anything older than a LG CX, which was the first 4K@120Hz OLED TV with full HDMI 2.1 support.

[harisukro]

Work perfect in WIN7 just copy "api-ms-win-shcore-scaling-l1-1-1.dll" from Win 8 System32.

[bo3bber]

@ bo3bber @ davegl1234. Thanks for all your great work, you keep our passion for 3D gaming alive. I am using the nvidia 452.06 driver and in the geo11 driver I choose the setting
- nvidia_dx11 in the d3dxdm.ini file. I play using the Asus PG278QR monitor with Nvidia 3DVision glasses. My question is actually not about 3D. In all the games I tested, I tried to use reshade. Unfortunately, the interface itself and the visual effects show up in one eye. Are you aware of this problem, and if so, is it fixable?

I fixed this in a special prototype build of Reshade that I made, but it's pretty old now. Maybe check on the forums and ask if there is a way around this, because I know people are using Reshade with VR now, and the problem would exist. Also, fairly sure BlueSkyDefender will know how to fix this or whether it's still a bug.

[bo3bber]

Work perfect in WIN7 just copy "api-ms-win-shcore-scaling-l1-1-1.dll" from Win 8 System32.

Ah, super cool! Thanks for testing that and finding it working.

I think we can fix that dependency in a future build, but having this workaround for now is very helpful.

[ShiftZ]

Cant get it working on Quest 2 Air Link. Is it possible at all?

[thebigdogma]

Cant get it working on Quest 2 Air Link. Is it possible at all?

Not a problem in VD - works great. Haven't tried AL, but seems like, if VD works, it should work.

Here is the link to the thread with my testing results (so far) for Quest 2/VD/3070/SBS/TAB.

viewtopic.php?t=26311

[ShiftZ]

Cant get it working on Quest 2 Air Link. Is it possible at all?

Not a problem in VD - works great. Haven't tried AL, but seems like, if VD works, it should work.

Here is the link to the thread with my testing results (so far) for Quest 2/VD/3070/SBS/TAB.

viewtopic.php?t=26311

My guess is that VD can catch SBS and Air Link not.

[bo3bber]

OK, I just put up a new build, geo-11 v0.6.10.

This version includes VR support via the katanga app in HelixVision. No new download or HelixVision update is needed, it's command line parameters to tell katanga what to look for. I'll make a post for katanga as a separate output mode with details as not everyone will care.

Also improved the dx9 output mode so it will crash less, and have better performance. It's now using triple buffering for the output to avoid stalling the game.

[RAGEdemon]

geo v0.6.10 + 512.15 nvidia drivers
direct_mode = nvidia_dx9

Black screen, though game launches and sounds work. Have to alt-f4 out. Game tested: psychonauts 2.

Might I humbly suggest to keep old drivers archived somewhere accessible by users?

---------------
Edit: Made separate installations for VR and 3DV. 3DV version now launches via DX9 mode, however there is no stereo.

[3DNovice]

...

[daspwan]

watchdog2 deadrising3+4 these three game has The common problem is the sky clouds at the screen depth,Maybe there is a compatibility problem with the original HUD shader fix?

[Lysander]

Hey bo3b, Dave - out of curiosity, is there a roadmap for geo-11 for the near future? I guess the main focus now is on the dx9 and new driver/30xx compatibility, but just curious if there're some specific goals past that. Is DLSS on the table, FSR2.0?

cheers

[Zerofool]

Man, that's a piece of good news I wasn't expecting. What an awesome surprise!
Thank you guys, keep up the great work!

Our ouput modes need some work, but we can definitely add checkerboard as an option. Right now I think Interlaced also does not work. And also reversed may not be working. Not sure, too many modes to test, but you can expect we'll get around to all these. Adding checkerboard is a good idea, and I'll add it as a task for us so we don't forget.

However, do we know anyone who actually uses checkerboard? IIRC that was only used on DLP rear projection TVs, and I can't imagine any still running today. All coding has opportunity costs, so we always want to do stuff that has the biggest bang for the buck.

I still use the checkerboard mode on my active-3D Samsung LCD 3DTV from 2014 - 55" H7000 (H7150 in US) and it's undoubtedly superior to all other frame-compatible formats accepted by this TV, Including TaB/OU.
I would be extremely grateful if you implement checkerboard output support, especially if it works with DSR. I've been using 2.25x DL-DSR in checkerboard mode through the Tridef driver for D3D9 games and it looks stunning. Unfortunately, 3DTV Play does not support DSR in HDMI-Checkerboard mode (and DL-DSR was introduced only in recent drivers anyway), so if Geo-11 supports that option for its native checkerboard output in the future, that would truly be a dream come true!

Supporting Full-SBS from Geo-11 in HelixVision will finally make using future ultra-high res VR HMDs with future GPUs a viable alternative to the disappearing 3D displays. Thanks again for making it possible and reigniting my passion for this hobby!

[MaestroRoedor]

you gotta read the instructions carefully don't skip any steps or it won't work, follow the link, they explain it better.

http://helixmod.blogspot.com/2022/06/an ... r.html?m=1

[WickedScav]

I am a bit confused: I believed that the CTRL + ALT + INSERT 3DVision green info text was unique to nvidia's 3DVision and would not show up, when geo-11 is in use. Am I mistaken?

The reason I'm asking is, because I thought I had been running geo-11 recently in a game and then found out that the above mentioned shortcut is still working. Now I'm wondering if I really have been using geo-11 or just the "normal" 3DVision... I do get the fps counter on the upper left part of the screen though...

[EpsilonLyrae]

I know in Dx9 mode, geo-11 still presents the normal 3d vision interface. Can 100% confirm this because I'm on an rtx 3070 and can't run dx11 games in 3d without geo-11. I'd imagine dx11 output is the same.

[3DNovice]

@bo3b,

Would it be possible, with the way that Dave hooks his layer into the 3D Vision drivers, that it could be passed on to BlueSkyDefender for SuperDepth3D use with 3D Vision monitors?

Edit: nevermind, I forgot that you had already done so for dx11, but what about dx12, anything in Geo-11 to do so?

[Lysander]

I am a bit confused: I believed that the CTRL + ALT + INSERT 3DVision green info text was unique to nvidia's 3DVision and would not show up, when geo-11 is in use. Am I mistaken?

The reason I'm asking is, because I thought I had been running geo-11 recently in a game and then found out that the above mentioned shortcut is still working. Now I'm wondering if I really have been using geo-11 or just the "normal" 3DVision... I do get the fps counter on the upper left part of the screen though...

Yes, it still uses nVidia 3D Vision driver code to output the image. So it's still dependent on the DX9 driver code in post 452.06 drivers for 3DV hardware.

[McNugglet69]

I can't for the life of me get Spyro Reignited to work, any help would be appreciated, using an AMD card.

[davegl1234]

I am a bit confused: I believed that the CTRL + ALT + INSERT 3DVision green info text was unique to nvidia's 3DVision and would not show up, when geo-11 is in use. Am I mistaken?

The reason I'm asking is, because I thought I had been running geo-11 recently in a game and then found out that the above mentioned shortcut is still working. Now I'm wondering if I really have been using geo-11 or just the "normal" 3DVision... I do get the fps counter on the upper left part of the screen though...

Yep, so the CTRL + ALT + INSERT 3DVision green info text is displayed in geo-11 too (nvidia_dx9/nvidia_dx11 modes, as we are using Nvidia 3DVision Direct to output the 3D). At one point I did think displaying 'geo-11' somewhere in the green memo was probably a good idea so its clear geo-11 is running, so will do this at some point.

[3DNovice]

It might be better to do it like Helifax does with VK3DVision and create your own logo to display.
Perhaps hit up Costiq, if I remember correctly he did the Helixvision stuff if you are not artistic.

VK3DVision logo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_qcqNZFfsyk

[bo3bber]

I can't for the life of me get Spyro Reignited to work, any help would be appreciated, using an AMD card.

This has got good potential, but you are only the second person I know of to try an AMD card.

However- you have to give us more information to go on, we aren't psychic. You don't even say what happens.

[bo3bber]

It might be better to do it like Helifax does with VK3DVision and create your own logo to display.
Perhaps hit up Costiq, if I remember correctly he did the Helixvision stuff if you are not artistic.

VK3DVision logo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_qcqNZFfsyk

Actually costiq has already kindly offered to create us a logo, and you can see his killer work in the HelixVision logos. I'm not sure we need a logo exactly, but maybe that's helpful. It just seems funny to me to have a logo for a driver that normally is an invisible piece of software. Like 3Dmigoto when playing- there is no UI, there is no overlay.

[3DNovice]

It just seemed to me, that a logo would be easier to confirm that Geo-11 is hooked in.

To write to Nvidia's green text, I'd assume that Geo-11 would have to write to the d3dx.ini of 3DMigoto and keep in tac any
settings by the shaderhacker, such a StereoFlagDX10=0x00004000

Writing to Helixmod is a different story and would require profile nips AFAIK for each individual game, with the exception of game.exe that is used in multiple games
Plus on a lot of dx9 games, we don't even use the official profile, so I would think that would add a layer of complexity to it. Not to mention, Helix did not support
profile imports until a later version(s)

I also wonder how the one eye issue and StereoFlagDX10 will be resolved if 3D Vision drivers are not installed, do the driver heurestics still look at those
settings when it perceives 2D Gaming is taking place? And what about an AMD user, might the run into this one eye issue?

@McNugglet69 you need to give a lot more information, OS + version, GPU, driver version, Display model, connection type, desired stereoscopic format.

Plus have you ever played in 3D before, with iz3D, Tri-Def or 3D Vision? Or native in-game 3D, like in the newer Tomb Raider games?

[Megapsychotron]

I've been away from the latest 3D developments and am very pleased to see this! I can finally upgrade from my GTX 1080 card into a current gen card and still retain most 3D functionality. And support for this Geo-11 should only get better going forward! Thank you to all in the community that makes this possible!

[3DNovice]

I added the 3DVision driver to my 511.65 nv driver using HelixVision and then enabled 3D. I have a 3080. If I set output in d3dxdm.ini to nvidia_dx9, I only ever get an anaglyph output. I have a 3DTV that can do proper 1280x720 frame packed 3D (3DTVPlay). Am I missing something in the setup? I set resolution in game to 1280x720 with fullscreen etc. I can get SBS working fine but dx9 output only ever produces anaglyph.

EDIT: Well, the NVidia 3DVision test application only shows anaglyph output as well.. Maybe this is a limitation of 3DTVPlay and latest drivers as there is no way to "setup" your display (No SetupWizard) and therefore the driver probably doesn't correctly identify your display device.

If the drop down format selection in the Nvidia Control Panel only shows anaglyph, that should mean that the display is not detected as being HDMI 1.4 supported and 3D capable. Are you using an adapter, like DP>HDMI?

You can try this method to get Frame Packed 3DTV Play, you'll probably need to get the anaglyph only situation remedied first.
https://www.reddit.com/r/nvidia/comment ... hout_3dtv/

I'm unsure if this will work if using an EDID override as Optimized for Nivdia GeForce

[BazzaLB]

If the drop down format selection in the Nvidia Control Panel only shows anaglyph, that should mean that the display is not detected as being HDMI 1.4 supported and 3D capable. Are you using an adapter, like DP>HDMI?

You can try this method to get Frame Packed 3DTV Play, you'll probably need to get the anaglyph only situation remedied first.
https://www.reddit.com/r/nvidia/comment ... hout_3dtv/

I'm unsure if this will work if using an EDID override as Optimized for Nivdia GeForce

Thanks for the response, but I got this all sorted by just installing brand new latest driver and reinjecting 3DVision. It all works perfectly fine. If I'm honest, I think I might have fixed it once I copied my 3D registry entries from my old machine to the new one. I was just using the NVidia 3D test app. I noticed the colors changed after the registry additions (no longer red/blue) but it was still flat so assumed it was still broken. It was only after installing new driver and re-injecting 3DVision again that I tried an actual game using nvidia_dx9 output and it worked perfectly this time (witcher 3 - was previously anaglyph) but test app still showed as flat with weird colors. So.. I probably had already fixed it with registry hack.

TL;DR. I got it all sorted already, but thanks anyway.

[john105]

I'm very impressed with geo-11! Big thanks to everyone who worked on it.

Work perfect in WIN7 just copy "api-ms-win-shcore-scaling-l1-1-1.dll" from Win 8 System32.

It work fine for me on both Windows 7 and 11 too. Other than needing "api-ms-win-shcore-scaling-l1-1-1.dll" I noticed the red "Failed to create direct mode mUpdateIniParamsCS shader" message when any game starts, but it doesn't seem to affect anything. Games look similarly on both OS despite Windows 11 not having that message.

[EpsilonLyrae]

I did some driver testing today, to see if going back to the oldest viable drivers for my card (an RTX 3070, using 471.41, a driver that has patches for most, but not all current known security flaws affecting the Nvidia driver stack).

Going this far back made interacting with 3d snappier in general- The "standard" control panel can toggle 3d on and off much faster, and any time stereoscopic 3d is initialized by an app or game, the transition from a 2d image to a 3d image happens without a several second delay.

Keyboard shortcuts that save screenshots and driver profile settings still work. All elements of the nvidia 3d vision driver text that you can see in-game are available, including notifications for actions taken (screenshot saved, profile saved, etc).

However, it didn't allow FFXV or Yakuza 0 to work for me while using geo-11- same exact issues crop up where the game will launch, 3d vision initializes and my glasses/emitter turn on, then the game closes before a single frame is rendered to the screen. (In the case of both games, I can no longer get them to work in more compatible modes like SBS, either.)

But it did at least answer one major question for me- newer drivers, perhaps starting with ones that implement the DCH based control panel, no longer allow you to use the hotkeys to save your current settings to the driver profile, or take a stereoscopic screenshot. It would be nice to see these functions implemented as part of geo-11 itself- perhaps as one small step towards completely eliminating the reliance on 3d vision drivers at all. My long-term dream for the path we're on currently is an open sourced driver/software pack for active glasses, free of the current driver restrictions (no pixel clock above 650MHz, so no 4k120 support), and bandaids on top of bandaids to keep 3d working as our OS and GPU drivers continue to evolve.

[bo3bber]

I did some driver testing today, to see if going back to the oldest viable drivers for my card (an RTX 3070, using 471.41, a driver that has patches for most, but not all current known security flaws affecting the Nvidia driver stack).

Going this far back made interacting with 3d snappier in general- The "standard" control panel can toggle 3d on and off much faster, and any time stereoscopic 3d is initialized by an app or game, the transition from a 2d image to a 3d image happens without a several second delay.

Keyboard shortcuts that save screenshots and driver profile settings still work. All elements of the nvidia 3d vision driver text that you can see in-game are available, including notifications for actions taken (screenshot saved, profile saved, etc).

However, it didn't allow FFXV or Yakuza 0 to work for me while using geo-11- same exact issues crop up where the game will launch, 3d vision initializes and my glasses/emitter turn on, then the game closes before a single frame is rendered to the screen. (In the case of both games, I can no longer get them to work in more compatible modes like SBS, either.)

But it did at least answer one major question for me- newer drivers, perhaps starting with ones that implement the DCH based control panel, no longer allow you to use the hotkeys to save your current settings to the driver profile, or take a stereoscopic screenshot. It would be nice to see these functions implemented as part of geo-11 itself- perhaps as one small step towards completely eliminating the reliance on 3d vision drivers at all. My long-term dream for the path we're on currently is an open sourced driver/software pack for active glasses, free of the current driver restrictions (no pixel clock above 650MHz, so no 4k120 support), and bandaids on top of bandaids to keep 3d working as our OS and GPU drivers continue to evolve.

That transition to DCH introduced the weird stalls in the control panel. Microsoft forced Nvidia to repackage the driver DCH style, and NVidia broke the 3D Driver settings as part of that transition. One of our friends of 3D is madshi, who makes a cool 3D TV output device and relies upon 3D Vision for his frame-packed 3D for 3D movies. He and I managed to work out what was happening with that DCH transition.

The drivers are the same, this is literally just Microsoft forcing everyone to dance like marionettes because they feel like it. You know who owns your computer? Not you, that's for sure.

There is a funny/old/obsolete named pipe that NVidia uses for communication to 3D. We don't understand the details, but we did find out that under DCH drivers the service that runs that pipe gets installed to the wrong locaction, because it was not updated for the new install locations. This is on NVidia- the 3D Driver was still supported during that time, and they did nothing to make it work properly on DCH.


I've been meaning to make a post about this, madshi and I figured out how to fix the DCH stalls. I just made a quick post with what I can pull up:
viewtopic.php?t=26356

I don't know how to properly take ownership of the protected folder, as the Microsoft ownership model does not make any sense to me. I was planning to figure that out, but well, maybe you all know this better than me.


Longer term, we definitely want to move completely away from ANY dependence on NVidia. They cannot be trusted and have been hostile to us for a long time. Making screen shots directly from geo-11 is definitely in the near term, that's not hard. Adding the ability to handle non-NVidia shutter glasses is definitely doable. I'm not sure we can get away from 3D Vision Driver dependence for strictly 3D Vision hardware itself, but certainly for stuff like 3D TVs, projectors, VR, and any new hardware we expect to have full support.

[3DNovice]

Interesting find.

Another thing to consider down the road, is some type of plugin for something like ShadowPlay or OBS. Could be useful for further teaching or promotional stuff.