Minecrift Discussion Thread

Post by **Croccy22** » Wed Jul 03, 2013 1:22 am

Hi,

I know this is lazy of me and I really need to read through the whole thread again to get updated. But does this latest version now work with other headtrackers apart from the Rift? I saw that support for the Razer Hydra is now added and didn't know if using FreePIE we could "write" to the razer plugin (Not sure if that plugin is read only though).

I have a Sparkfun 9DOF sensor for my DIY Rift, It is running the AHRS Frimware and is working fine in FreePIE emulating TrackIR, Vireo, mouse etc etc.

I had Minecrift working before with just mouse emulation but you then dont get the head roll and this is the main thing I am after.

Thanks, Matt.

Post by **rowanunderwood** » Wed Jul 03, 2013 5:17 am

Jademalo wrote:
mabrowning wrote:Heyo!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jQ3vQ85tR0Q
I may have one of those on order

Yea, I'm a kickstarter of these guys too. One major worry I have about the omni though is that the walking detection is going to have to be pretty good to avoid nausea. This is why features like the analog walking speed you guys added in Minecrift are KEY to VR catching on. Stop or Go is not going to cut it for the omni

Post by **Jademalo** » Wed Jul 03, 2013 5:20 am

rowanunderwood wrote:
Jademalo wrote:
mabrowning wrote:Heyo!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jQ3vQ85tR0Q
I may have one of those on order
Yea, I'm a kickstarter of these guys too. One major worry I have about the omni though is that the walking detection is going to have to be pretty good to avoid nausea. This is why features like the analog walking speed you guys added in Minecrift are KEY to VR catching on. Stop or Go is not going to cut it for the omni

I imagine when they get their proper tracker setup they'll let you bind it as a generic analogue stick. If that happens, it will be _awesome_

Post by **thenomad** » Wed Jul 03, 2013 5:52 am

I can't speak from experience, but apparently you need to go directly up - don't turn your head back to face forward and then go up.

Thanks for the suggestion! I've been trying that, but to no avail, I'm afraid.

Any other tips? Or is there a way to bypass the calibration? It seems to come out basically calibrated OK anyway...

Post by **mabrowning** » Wed Jul 03, 2013 7:06 am

mrklaw wrote:Not been on for a while,but progress looks amazing.

Are there any plans to use the hydra motion for strafing? Buttons/stick for strafing isn't good for me in the rift, so assigning it to a physical motion might help trick my brain into thinking that motion is normal

Already fixed! Will be in the next release, but (and I'll probably kick myself later after telling so many people this) you can download a development issue from our Jenkins build server

Post by **mabrowning** » Wed Jul 03, 2013 7:10 am

thenomad wrote:
I can't speak from experience, but apparently you need to go directly up - don't turn your head back to face forward and then go up.
Thanks for the suggestion! I've been trying that, but to no avail, I'm afraid.

Any other tips? Or is there a way to bypass the calibration? It seems to come out basically calibrated OK anyway...

Sorry. We're actively developing this. Stella added some code last night to give you progress/feedback. Check back soon! There currently isn't a way to bypass it, but the problem comes with yaw drift over time: you won't see any issues if you just glance around, but play for 5 minutes or so and suddenly you won't be moving forward anymore!

Post by **mabrowning** » Wed Jul 03, 2013 7:12 am

rowanunderwood wrote: Yea, I'm a kickstarter of these guys too. One major worry I have about the omni though is that the walking detection is going to have to be pretty good to avoid nausea. This is why features like the analog walking speed you guys added in Minecrift are KEY to VR catching on. Stop or Go is not going to cut it for the omni

Omni has an SDK of some kind. Hopefully we can get even better than direction+magnitude walking and go full 1:1! That would be my goal.

Post by **thenomad** » Wed Jul 03, 2013 7:19 am

Sorry. We're actively developing this. Stella added some code last night to give you progress/feedback. Check back soon

Wow. You guys are fast - and nice! Not the usual Open-Source experience at all.

I shall follow your progress eagerly.

Anything I can do to help, btw? I can code, albeit not too well, I can do 3D art, I'm a not totally useless tester, and I'm a good tech author and growth hacker, if any of that's any use.

I'll definitely be posting some videos once I get this thing going. Might even give a stab at getting Wii Balance Board working, since that's one of my current VR obsessions

Post by **mabrowning** » Wed Jul 03, 2013 7:30 am

thenomad wrote:Wow. You guys are fast - and nice! Not the usual Open-Source experience at all.

We aim to please.

thenomad wrote:Anything I can do to help, btw? I can code, albeit not too well, I can do 3D art, I'm a not totally useless tester, and I'm a pretty poop-hot tech author and growth hacker, if any of that's any use.

Absolutely! Github issue list is here. Just PM me one you're interested in tackling and I'll point you in the right direction! Some of them are even pretty easy!

thenomad wrote:I'll definitely be posting some videos once I get this thing going.

That would be excellent! I don't have infinite time, but watching gameplay videos helps us spot problem spots people that didn't write the game are having

thenomad wrote:Might even give a stab at getting Wii Balance Board working, since that's one of my current VR obsessions

I suspect you can already have a go by using the Wii Balance Walker. That, with the option "Decouple Look/Move: ON", should be a pretty good experience.

Post by **CaptnYesterday** » Wed Jul 03, 2013 9:40 am

Have to agree with Thenomad on this. You guys are really doing this fast. Constant updates and even pioneering into the new ground with control and menu. Really blew away expectations. Not to mention this is no demo, but a full fledged game support mod.

Genuinely confused at how you 2 are keeping this pace, but you guys have our respect for sure. Its also nice to start seeing your work appear in the online articles alongside CinemaVR, Rift Coaster and Titans of Space.

Post by **Croccy22** » Wed Jul 03, 2013 10:05 am

Ok, So if I want to have a play and look at getting my own head tracker working with this, what is the best place to start?

I have looked at the MCMouse.java and the Oculus.java

I take it that when using the Oculus the yaw/pitch/roll only move the head, and normal controller/mouse is used for walking/turning? Is the turneing etc then handled by MCMouse?

If I wanted to make my own custom control for testing, could I just strip out the Oculus.java and just keep the 3 overrides for getHeadYawDegrees, getHeadPitchDegrees and getHeadRollDegrees?

For example could I simply create a java file that statically return 45 for each of those values, then when running I would be able to walk around like normal but my head would be tilted at 45 degress in all directions? It would then just be a case of retrieving those values from my Razer AHRS device and getting them into those values?

Am I over simplifying things here or that basically it?

Thanks, Matt.

Post by **mabrowning** » Wed Jul 03, 2013 10:15 am

Thats pretty much it for the "guts". There are some things you'll need to do to make the plugin "work", and I don't actually have a plugin loader yet... not sure the best way to go about that.

You'll need to implement the IBasePlugin interface and all its methods (or derive from the dummy BasePlugin class), and the IOrientationProvider interface (check com.mtbs3d.minecrift.api ). You'll need to provide an implementation of getID() and getName() so that it shows up sensibly in the in-game menus. The poll() method is called when the game engine is pulling updates and probably a good place to do any data transfers

For testing purposes, just create an instance of your plugin, which will register it, add it to the menus, etc. We are still in a disruptive development stage though, so things may change!

Post by **Marulu** » Wed Jul 03, 2013 10:27 am

Oculus VR just released a update to their SDK including profiles which store your IPD and other Rift related data.
Could you please add support for this function of the SDK in the next release of this mod?

Post by **mabrowning** » Wed Jul 03, 2013 10:29 am

Marulu, we're way ahead of you

Well, not way ahead, but we've started looking into it already! I'm especially motivated to get it in, since it includes Linux support!

Post by **Jademalo** » Wed Jul 03, 2013 11:11 am

Oh man, I didnt know that had been added!
IPD in the SDK is something I was really hoping would come, I've got an optician to measure mine so I've got a precise reading =p

Post by **Croccy22** » Wed Jul 03, 2013 3:44 pm

Ok,

I've downloaded Minecrift from the git, downloaded mcp and placed that in the extracted folder. Ran the install.bat which went and downloaded all the files. It then said I need to manually download JRift and Sixense-Java. I have downloaded those from their gits but where do I put them? I tried extracting them into the JRift and Sixense folders but what should be the top level folder inside those folders? It then also says about putting the JAR files in mcp/lib, where do I get these from.

I have tried a few different combinations but when I run the build.bat it errors with loads of stuff about cannot find Symbol Sixense....... So I guess I have put the files in the wrong location.

If I can get it to succesfully build then I have a chance of being able to mess around with the other stuff. I've not done much Java before, only some Android programming. But I can understand most languages so seeing what something does and changing it isn't usually a problem. I've just never worked with this build environment before.

Any help would be much appreciated. I have run up the latest Minecrift on my DIY rift and just tweaking some of the settings it looks perfect. I just need to map the head control to my RazorImu and it will be perfect!

Thanks, Matt.

Post by **mabrowning** » Wed Jul 03, 2013 4:22 pm

This should be your directory layout:

Code: Select all

/src/
/patches/
/mcp/ <-you extracted mcp here
/mcp/bin/ <- should exist after extracting
/mcp/lib/JRift.jar <-Add the jar here
/mcp/lib/SixenseJava.jar  <-Add the jar here
/mcp/src/ <-- edit the source in here
/install.bat
/build.bat
/releases/

install.bat tries to clone the /Sixense-Java and /JRift repositories into the top level directory. You don't really need those unless you're changing them. Using the JRift.jar and SixenseJava.jar from our 1.0 beta release should be good enough for now (we're releasing an updated version soon for OVR SDK 0.2.3)

Running build.bat should create /releases/minecrift_1.0_beta_classes.zip.

Let me know if that works.

Post by **thenomad** » Wed Jul 03, 2013 5:15 pm

@mabrowning - would there be anything non-coding related that would be useful for the project? I'm not familiar with Java, my 3D math is pretty limited, and I'm a bit concerned that my spaghetti code would slow down the project rather than speed it up

For example, I could write docs (I spot quite a few questions coming up again and again that I could probably reduce, saving you time), set a website and domain name up for Minecrift, enter/prune/tag issues on Github, test and write competent testing reports, that sort of thing.

I'm happy to code if it's the thing that would help most, but I may be able to produce considerably more of use in a non-coding capacity

Post by **rowanunderwood** » Wed Jul 03, 2013 5:50 pm

Hello again guys. Just tried out build 37 with the keyhole controls. Not to complain, but I think some options for preset control schemes would be a nice feature. I actually prefer the controls from build #30. What I can't wrap my brain around in 37 is the cursor only moving left-right with the hydra, but up-down with my head (reminds me of the "legacy" style controls from the n64 days). Also I get a lot more nausea with the keyhole style of turning, maybe because you can't know exactly when the turn is going to start? I do really like the hydra becoming a mouse in the gui though, that feels more natural.

If you are going to add some preset control schemes, I'd like to see the one from build 30 make a comeback.

Also I wouldn't mind a two-handed Hydra preset to make jumping/turning/straffing at the same time a bit easier. Thanks guys!

Post by **mabrowning** » Wed Jul 03, 2013 5:53 pm

thenomad wrote:@mabrowning - would there be anything non-coding related that would be useful for the project? I'm not familiar with Java, my 3D math is pretty limited, and I'm a bit concerned that my spaghetti code would slow down the project rather than speed it up

For example, I could write docs (I spot quite a few questions coming up again and again that I could probably reduce, saving you time), set a website and domain name up for Minecrift, enter/prune/tag issues on Github, test and write competent testing reports, that sort of thing.

I'm happy to code if it's the thing that would help most, but I may be able to produce considerably more of use in a non-coding capacity

I think some how-to videos would help if you are ok recording screencasts: how to install it, how to configure it, what each option does, etc. Unfortunately, at the rate we are changing stuff, it gets out of date pretty quick, though the core features should be stable. What do you think? If videos aren't your thing, I started a wiki on github. Feel free to add pages on there explaining what each option does with a bit of detail. Or anything really; documentation is limited to the readme, these forum posts, and the hovertext in the UI. Should be enough for most people, but a centralized, clear, concise wiki would be awesome.

Post by **ElectroPulse** » Wed Jul 03, 2013 9:18 pm

Quick question: How do you get that annoying message to go away that says something about needing me to hit space to calibrate the Rift? I hit the spacebar, but it didn't disappear... I tried going into the VR Settings and manually calibrating it there, but that didn't make the message go away. I closed out of Minecraft and opened it again, same thing.

Post by **nypraise** » Thu Jul 04, 2013 3:16 am

I have the same problem. I press spacebar and nothing happends. Any solutions?

Post by **Croccy22** » Thu Jul 04, 2013 4:02 am

Ok, I have now got it all compiling.

I now this is cheeky would would it be possible for someone just to put together a "Template" plugin that would just hard set to Pitch, Yaw and Roll to variable p,y and r (For example). So All I would need to do then would be to figure out how to get the data from my head tracker into java and feed it into these variables?

The plugin will just need to behave exactly the same as the oculus plugin. I'm not worried about the calibration side of things at the moment as I can hard code those for the time being.

It would be so nice if we could get this working with the new freepiIO plugin. That way any tracker could be used with minecrift. I've not ever tried wrapping a C dll for use in Java before thoguh and I think that would be a bit of a steep learning curve.

I am keen to help but I just get the feeling that what I am trying to do would be quite easy for someone you knows what they are doing

. I've written applications etc before but have never done any plugin style work using other peoples code.

Thanks Matt.

Post by **Dakor** » Thu Jul 04, 2013 4:12 am

I got the same problem as well with the beta release.
I hit space and the message does not disappear, so i switched back to .27 for now

Post by **StellaArtois** » Thu Jul 04, 2013 5:17 am

Jademalo wrote:Ok, here is my second attempt =p
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/523 ... %20GUI.zip

Thanks Jade! I'm going to rip all of this except the device config. Still not convinced on that...yet!

Post by **StellaArtois** » Thu Jul 04, 2013 5:18 am

mabrowning wrote:Heyo!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jQ3vQ85tR0Q

Wow!

Post by **StellaArtois** » Thu Jul 04, 2013 5:23 am

mabrowning wrote:
thenomad wrote:
I can't speak from experience, but apparently you need to go directly up - don't turn your head back to face forward and then go up.
Thanks for the suggestion! I've been trying that, but to no avail, I'm afraid.

Any other tips? Or is there a way to bypass the calibration? It seems to come out basically calibrated OK anyway...

Sorry. We're actively developing this. Stella added some code last night to give you progress/feedback. Check back soon! There currently isn't a way to bypass it, but the problem comes with yaw drift over time: you won't see any issues if you just glance around, but play for 5 minutes or so and suddenly you won't be moving forward anymore!

We should now provide some additional feedback during calibration, so you should now know when you've looked 'far enough left' etc. Also, I want to add some options to allow you to skip recalibration on startup if it's not needed. It's probably only completely necessary to calibrate the Oculus when you're also using Hydra pos track.

No way to bypass or abort calibration just yet. It's on the cards at some point soon.

Post by **StellaArtois** » Thu Jul 04, 2013 5:26 am

CaptnYesterday wrote:Have to agree with Thenomad on this. You guys are really doing this fast. Constant updates and even pioneering into the new ground with control and menu. Really blew away expectations. Not to mention this is no demo, but a full fledged game support mod.

Genuinely confused at how you 2 are keeping this pace, but you guys have our respect for sure. Its also nice to start seeing your work appear in the online articles alongside CinemaVR, Rift Coaster and Titans of Space.

Many thanks for the kind comments! mabrowning is putting the most work in to be fair - he's a coding machine. I try to keep up...

Post by **StellaArtois** » Thu Jul 04, 2013 5:27 am

Marulu wrote:Oculus VR just released a update to their SDK including profiles which store your IPD and other Rift related data.
Could you please add support for this function of the SDK in the next release of this mod?

JRift support for 0.2.3 is already in. Profiles (IPD and eye height) incoming soon.

Post by **StellaArtois** » Thu Jul 04, 2013 5:35 am

For the guys having SPACEBAR calibration issues - we're in a slight version hell at the moment which we need to sort out soon, sorry. Try the latest classes build HERE and update them in your Magic Launcher config.

Let me know if that doesn't fix things for you.

Post by **StellaArtois** » Thu Jul 04, 2013 5:38 am

Croccy22 wrote:I now this is cheeky would would it be possible for someone just to put together a "Template" plugin that would just hard set to Pitch, Yaw and Roll to variable p,y and r (For example). So All I would need to do then would be to figure out how to get the data from my head tracker into java and feed it into these variables?

I like the idea! No doubt mabrowning will run with this!

Post by **Dakor** » Thu Jul 04, 2013 5:53 am

StellaArtois wrote:For the guys having SPACEBAR calibration issues - we're in a slight version hell at the moment which we need to sort out soon, sorry. Try the latest classes build HERE and update them in your Magic Launcher config.

Let me know if that doesn't fix things for you.

Thanks, works fine now.
You should better use only one release system (=remove the attachments)

Post by **mabrowning** » Thu Jul 04, 2013 5:55 am

StellaArtois wrote:
Croccy22 wrote:I now this is cheeky would would it be possible for someone just to put together a "Template" plugin that would just hard set to Pitch, Yaw and Roll to variable p,y and r (For example). So All I would need to do then would be to figure out how to get the data from my head tracker into java and feed it into these variables?
I like the idea! No doubt mabrowning will run with this!

How about a plugin that listens on a local UDP socket for a packet like

Code: Select all

struct MCOrient
{
    uint16 yawDegrees;   //degrees * 1000
    uint16 pitchDegrees; //degrees * 1000
    uint16 rollDegrees;  //degrees * 1000
    uint16 x; //mm
    uint16 y; //mm
    uint16 z; //mm
};

All variables in network (big-endian) byte order.

Then, you wouldn't have to do any Java coding; anyone could feed data into it. Local UDP sockets have sub ms latency and are extremely cross-platform.

Post by **StellaArtois** » Thu Jul 04, 2013 5:56 am

rowanunderwood wrote:Hello again guys. Just tried out build 37 with the keyhole controls. Not to complain, but I think some options for preset control schemes would be a nice feature. I actually prefer the controls from build #30. What I can't wrap my brain around in 37 is the cursor only moving left-right with the hydra, but up-down with my head (reminds me of the "legacy" style controls from the n64 days). Also I get a lot more nausea with the keyhole style of turning, maybe because you can't know exactly when the turn is going to start? I do really like the hydra becoming a mouse in the gui though, that feels more natural.

rowanunderwood, I'm being a bit thick here, sorry. So you liked the scheme from #30; but you are unable to replicate that scheme in #37? What is the option combo in #30 that you cannot reproduce?

And when you say you'd like some presets, I'd be interested to know how you would envisage them being named?

rowanunderwood wrote:If you are going to add some preset control schemes, I'd like to see the one from build 30 make a comeback. Also I wouldn't mind a two-handed Hydra preset to make jumping/turning/straffing at the same time a bit easier. Thanks guys!

I like the sound of that. More options! Phew...

Post by **StellaArtois** » Thu Jul 04, 2013 5:57 am

Dakor wrote:You should better use only one release system (=remove the attachments)

Yes. Good plan!

EDIT: Done.

Post by **mabrowning** » Thu Jul 04, 2013 6:01 am

StellaArtois wrote:rowanunderwood, I'm being a bit thick here, sorry. So you liked the scheme from #30; but you are unable to replicate that scheme in #37? What is the option combo in #30 that you cannot reproduce?

#37 was where I changed the joystick from turning to strafing and added keyhole aiming/turning to the hydra. I can make that configurable.

Post by **StellaArtois** » Thu Jul 04, 2013 6:04 am

mabrowning wrote:
StellaArtois wrote:rowanunderwood, I'm being a bit thick here, sorry. So you liked the scheme from #30; but you are unable to replicate that scheme in #37? What is the option combo in #30 that you cannot reproduce?
#37 was where I changed the joystick from turning to strafing and added keyhole aiming/turning to the hydra. I can make that configurable.

Ahah! Told you I can't keep up with all your changes

Post by **Croccy22** » Thu Jul 04, 2013 6:12 am

mabrowning wrote:
StellaArtois wrote:
Croccy22 wrote:I now this is cheeky would would it be possible for someone just to put together a "Template" plugin that would just hard set to Pitch, Yaw and Roll to variable p,y and r (For example). So All I would need to do then would be to figure out how to get the data from my head tracker into java and feed it into these variables?
I like the idea! No doubt mabrowning will run with this!
How about a plugin that listens on a local UDP socket for a packet like
Code: Select all
struct MCOrient
{
    uint16 yawDegrees;   //degrees * 1000
    uint16 pitchDegrees; //degrees * 1000
    uint16 rollDegrees;  //degrees * 1000
    uint16 x; //mm
    uint16 y; //mm
    uint16 z; //mm
};
All variables in network (big-endian) byte order.

Then, you wouldn't have to do any Java coding; anyone could feed data into it. Local UDP sockets have sub ms latency and are extremely cross-platform.

PLEASE, PLEASE and DOUBLE PLEASE!!!!!! (Or Triple). That would be perfect.

In fact could you speak to CyberVillian in the FreePIE thread? They have an Android Plugin for FreePIE which talks to android using UDP on 5555. If the format of your plugin could match the output of the Android plugin then we instantly have support for Android/AHRS/YEI/Hillcrest/Hydra/Wiimote. All from building one plugin

.

I'm sure he will give you the code for the android plugin so you can see what format the data is in.

Thanks, Matt.

PS. You rwork on this has been brillaint. I have been playing it on my DIY Rift with Mouse emulation and it loks superb. If you can get this plugin working the DIY Community will be eternally grateful

Post by **mabrowning** » Thu Jul 04, 2013 6:28 am

Croccy22 wrote: PLEASE, PLEASE and DOUBLE PLEASE!!!!!! (Or Triple). That would be perfect.

In fact could you speak to CyberVillian in the FreePIE thread? They have an Android Plugin for FreePIE which talks to android using UDP on 5555. If the format of your plugin could match the output of the Android plugin then we instantly have support for Android/AHRS/YEI/Hillcrest/Hydra/Wiimote. All from building one plugin .

I'm sure he will give you the code for the android plugin so you can see what format the data is in.

Thanks, Matt.

PS. You rwork on this has been brillaint. I have been playing it on my DIY Rift with Mouse emulation and it loks superb. If you can get this plugin working the DIY Community will be eternally grateful

Hmm... looked into the Android Plugin. Its sending raw sensor data, not post-fusion data. I don't really feel like adding *yet another* sensor fusion implementation to the mix. Also, it isn't an "output" plugin, only input, so even if I did make it the same network format, you couldn't feed data to it from FreePIE. No, we'll just go with a custom UDP packet format that is super-simple to create for people. Realistically, FreePIE is probably the only thing that is really needed, so I might even take a crack and an output plugin for that. No promises!

Post by **rowanunderwood** » Thu Jul 04, 2013 7:59 am

mabrowning wrote:Alright, hydra keyhole aiming and other goodies is in 1.5.2 build#37 and 1.4.7 build#6

- Keyhole width depends on head pitch (so you aren't constrained to hemisphere of allowable aiming) - not fully working on mouse.
- Hydra controls are now:

- Pointing "aiming" controller left and right beyond the keyhole will rotate the character. "joystick" sensitivity actually affects this only.
- Joystick used for strafing
- Hydra "aiming" can be used as mouse in menus. Joystick no longer used for this.
- Allowing keyhole to move with head (more options!)

Controlling with hydra doesn't feel completely right to me.. I'd be very interested in some feedback on this regard. Perhaps all it'll take is using it for a few more minutes to get adjusted. Or actually using it in VR(August is so far away...). The hydra was never really good on a 2D screen ^_^

I'm not a fan of the keyhole turning. Didn't like it in Metroid either. When you flick your wrist over to do a turn, you aren't exactly sure when the turn will begin, hence nausea

However, I also agree that strafing is a must, its almost impossible to build without strafing. What's the solution? Well, before we get our hands on a Rift with positional tracking, or a sixsense with a third sensor, I think the solution is to have a control option for two-handed hydra with strafing/forward/backward on one stick and just turning on the other. You guys should keep the positional plus one-handed options in there for sure as a proof-of-concept for when we get more sensors, but I don't think they are going to practical for building. Thanks!

Oh and one more thing

as a lefty, best possible outcome would be to have everything rebindable. My muscle memories are so screwed up from bouncing between southpaw and non-southpaw button options on certain other games.