SiliconMicroDisplay ST1080 - Short CES Review

Post by **VRnerd2012** » Wed Feb 22, 2012 10:47 pm

Synexious wrote:Why wouldn't you get this instead of an HMZ? The ST1080 is better in every way, except for having six degrees less FOV.

i'd rather check their return policy minutely - for usd699 , lot of money

Post by **cybereality** » Wed Feb 22, 2012 11:11 pm

Synexious wrote:Why wouldn't you get this instead of an HMZ? The ST1080 is better in every way, except for having six degrees less FOV.

Well two reasons:

1) Smaller FOV. Really any little bit counts.

2) AFAIK no support for side-by-side. Which sucks because my laptop can't do HDMI 1.4a, so I would need to find a way to drive this thing for presentations, backtop VR, etc. (of course my PC is no problem).

Post by **brantlew** » Thu Feb 23, 2012 12:02 am

Hey Cyber, a while back there was confusion over HDMI 1.3 or 1.4a for this unit. Do we know that this unit on sale is going to be the the 1.4a version? Also why is your PC not problematic as well? You still need to encode the source feeds into a HDMI 1.4a supported format. What encoder do you use for this?

I haven't really heard (or don't remember) anything about supported 3D formats other than the generic "Frame Packing" terminology on the website. Does anybody have any specific information about supported formats?

Post by **WiredEarp** » Thu Feb 23, 2012 5:16 am

The FOV thing is the only reason i'd consider the Sony at this point of time. As CR says, every little bit counts.

Post by **tomtom2012** » Thu Feb 23, 2012 7:25 am

hmm

Post by **Synexious** » Thu Feb 23, 2012 8:59 am

The ST1080, with its brighter screens, would surely beat the HMZ with a FOV mod.

Post by **tomtom2012** » Thu Feb 23, 2012 10:04 am

read horror stories of HDMI connection protocols on avs forums
not sure if the connection will be problem free
know of VGA that is easy as breeze but HDMI not sure
so st1080 may be/may not be right

Post by **PalmerTech** » Thu Feb 23, 2012 10:31 am

tomtom2012 wrote:read horror stories of HDMI connection protocols on avs forums
not sure if the connection will be problem free
know of VGA that is easy as breeze but HDMI not sure
so st1080 may be/may not be right

First off, VGA is an aging/dying format. HDMI has no problems, don't know what horror stories you are talking about. If the standard itself has issues, it would not be the most dominant digita video transmission protocol on the planet at the moment.

Second, you are Ancjob. This is the second count of one month ban evasion, if you do it again, you will be permanently banned from this board.

Post by **3dvison** » Thu Feb 23, 2012 1:48 pm

I thought the site said HDMI 1.3 has that been changed to 1.4, 1.4 a or somthing else ?

Post by **space123321** » Thu Feb 23, 2012 2:15 pm

As Cybereality stated, no support for SBS means no support from me... unfortuneatly!

Post by **ShawmK** » Thu Feb 23, 2012 2:37 pm

space123321 wrote:As Cybereality stated, no support for SBS means no support from me... unfortuneatly!

Same here, I'm afraid.
My laptop is VGA only, but I might have been tempted to get it just to use with my PC and home cinema - but Sky 3D broadcasts side-by-side, so that takes care of that.
Phooey

Post by **Synexious** » Thu Feb 23, 2012 3:26 pm

Are there any games that only work in SBS? And why don't SMD support SBS?

Post by **GSG9LIGHTNING** » Thu Feb 23, 2012 5:31 pm

Hello Gentlemen !

After i did a little research in the internet i found this forum discussion ( Review of the ST1080 )
And after reading all 7 pages i decided to register here to be able to post some questions especially to PalmerTech, who was able to have a look at the ST1080 first hand on the CES.

I am following the Facebook site and website of Silicon Micro Displays since day one and hope that their HMD will be the right one for my purposes.
I also read all the articles and reviews about the Sony HMZ-T1 and watch the Facebook site of Carl Zeiss Company ( Cinemizer OLED ).
Hopefully i will be able to have a close look on the Cinemizer OLED on CEBIT 2012 in Hannover / Germany in a few days ( 6th - 8th March ) .
But i think that the Cinemizer will have a lower resolution than the Full HD ST1080 and may be even lower than the HMZ-T1 which has only 1280x720p.

This year i am willing to spend money for a real good HMD and a 360 degree headtracker ( which hopefully will have no jitter effects as my actual Intertrax2 Headtracker from Intersense Company has )
I want to use that setup for a combat flight simulation ( DCS: A-10C Warthog )

So my questions to PalmerTech would be :

Will the ST1080 be the right choise for Flight-Simulations ?
What do you think, will i be able to read cockpit gauges and also be able to spot enemy aircraft and ground targets regarding the resolution and pixel lines ?

Can you please give me ( and others ) some personal thoughts about that ?

The few reviews of the HMZ-T1 frustrated me because most of them had a negative touch ( bad comfort because of the weight when using it longer than 1 hour, small pupil exit, blurry edges, fake 5.1 headphones, etc. )

The Vuzix 1200 VR also had not such good reviews and now all my hope is in the Cinemizer OLED and ST1080.
Thank you very much for an answer !

This guy on YouTube is using the Cinemizer OLED in a racing Simulation with the Headtracker from TrackIR :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OjPhnFvD ... ion_370181
He wrote that the Cinemizer OLED has 1280x720p per eye ( is that resolution confirmed from Carl-Zeiss Company already ? )

best regards,
GSG9LIGHTNING

PS : Sorry, english is not my native language, i hope i didnt do any mistakes.

Post by **VRgamesterz** » Thu Feb 23, 2012 7:07 pm

Hahaha nice catch Palmer, prob not to hard because they might change thier names but they still type like idiots, so his typing still looks to be like a Ancjob.

Ah I dodn't check but how come that site requires a password, say type password below, did I miss something?

Post by **cybereality** » Thu Feb 23, 2012 8:10 pm

If you look on the SMD website it says the following 3D formats are supported:

720p @ 60Hz Frame Packing 3D Format
1080p @ 24Hz Frame Packing 3D Format

http://www.siliconmicrodisplay.com/st1080-features.html

It does not mention SBS. Maybe it has support, I just have not seen it mentioned. In terms of HDMI 1.4a compliance, they are probably not 100% compliant, and thus cannot advertise as such. But similar to what Sony did with PS3, they are probably using HDMI 1.3 and just added on those 2 specific 3D frame-packing formats but nothing else. That would explain why they haven't been more forthcoming about advertising 1.4a support.

Post by **PalmerTech** » Thu Feb 23, 2012 11:07 pm

GSG9LIGHTNING wrote:So my questions to PalmerTech would be :

Will the ST1080 be the right choise for Flight-Simulations ?
What do you think, will i be able to read cockpit gauges and also be able to spot enemy aircraft and ground targets regarding the resolution and pixel lines ?

Can you please give me ( and others ) some personal thoughts about that ?

I think it will be perfect for flight sims. The stuff I saw did not have much text, but what I did see looked very sharp and crisp. There is no problem with pixel lines, the image is very smooth and high quality.

Post by **WiredEarp** » Fri Feb 24, 2012 2:21 am

I'm thinking that the 24 fps @ 1080 mode should be worthwhile for flight sims also.

Post by **GSG9LIGHTNING** » Fri Feb 24, 2012 4:19 am

@PalmerTech
Thank you very much !
I really hoped that you will tell me something like that.

So happy now

Did i understand right that you are in contact with the engineers of Silicon Micro Display ?
If yes i have another question that you might ask them for me.

Are the earphones of the ST1080 on the published pictures ( on their Website ) the ones that come with the final product ?
I think that they are too uncomfortable with its big diameter and hard surface, don´t you guys think so too ?
I had one pair of these on a MP3 Player i bought years ago and i must say i hated those earphones.
They never stayed in position when i moved my head and they felt hard inside the ear.

I threw them into the garbage can and bought in-ear-phones with silicone caps...that was a real difference in comfort !

There are much better types of in-ear-phones now on the market with very soft silicone caps which are removable for cleaning or just change the size of the cap diameter which goes into the ear.
Can you ask the engineers of SMD if they might rethink about the earphones please ?
In my opinion the wearing comfort (ergonomics) must be as good as the used technology to succed with a new product.

Thank you !

PS :
@ WiredEarp
24 fps at 1080p for 3D experiance should be sufficient for flight simulations, you are right ( Cockpit and gauges in 3D

)
But it might be kind of laggy during gun runs on the ground targets ... i have to test that when i get my ST1080.

Or somebody else might publish a detailed review here

Post by **ShawmK** » Fri Feb 24, 2012 4:57 am

Those earphones aren't very nice, but at least it looks as if they can be removed (unlike the ones attached to the Sony).

I always prefer to use my own headphones if possible; the ones that come bundled with HMDs are usually very poor.

Post by **WiredEarp** » Fri Feb 24, 2012 5:19 am

Agreed, personally I always have headphones for gaming anyway, so would always just use them if I have the option. Personally, I much prefer the 'around the ear' type with big cans and wide cushions that sit outside your ear and against the side of your head. They also cut out a lot of external noise. I like this type as any type that is pushed up against my ear gives me a hot ear after an hour or so.
I've never really used in ear phones, is that what you are talking about with these silicon ones? Can you post a link?

@ GSG9LIGHTNING: I know what you mean, every frame counts in those circumstances. However, depending on how the game is coded, you may still get greater than 24 FPS of input resolution/game loop, which would make a difference in feel etc, especially for VR applications (otherwise, 24fps will be causing a delay in showing head movements on an HMD, which loses immersion and can make people sick). I think it all depends on the game. I wonder if I can switch my monitor into 24fps somehow and test a few games out now to see how they perform? Black Shark should be ok, since most of the combat in that consists of hovering from afar and designating targets etc, so probably slower than A10's combat.

Post by **CyberVillain** » Fri Feb 24, 2012 5:22 am

ShawmK wrote:Those earphones aren't very nice, but at least it looks as if they can be removed (unlike the ones attached to the Sony).

I always prefer to use my own headphones if possible; the ones that come bundled with HMDs are usually very poor.

I think Palmer stated that the hearphones on the Sony was easy to remove, I really hope so, because I have had the my headset for years, and I love the quality of the microphone and headphones....

Post by **pierreye** » Fri Feb 24, 2012 5:44 am

The Sony HMD headphone can be remove but need to open up the casing. I'm going to do a mod to remove the headphone as I just got the Astro MixAmp 5.8 wireless. It come with a transmitter and receiver with Dolby Headphone technology. Using Grado SR80 headphone and the sound quality definitely much better than Sony HMZ-T1 build in headphone. The sound is fuller with better treble and bass too.

Post by **GSG9LIGHTNING** » Fri Feb 24, 2012 5:47 am

WiredEarp wrote:I've never really used in ear phones, is that what you are talking about with these silicon ones? Can you post a link?

Yes i meant in ear phones like these for example :
http://www.cnet.com.au/best-in-ear-head ... htm#image0

I think that the use of the in ear phones depends on the use of the ST1080.
While gaming i also prefer my big Headset with a microphone too ( Better Bass effects and talking over Teamspeak3 ).
But if you want to use the HMD for a movie while you are traveling in a Plane or Train, or just in the living room ( beside your girlfriend/wife who is watching another movie on the TV at the same time ) you will be pleased about the new generation of in ear phones !
They are very comfortable, sound really good ( depending on the price and model ) and absorb external sound in the surrounding too !

Post by **dj2013** » Mon Feb 27, 2012 3:00 am

Hi everyone, I've been following this thread because I'm so excited for this product to come out. I'm from Canada so hopefully they'll release it here around the same time as the US. If not I guess I could make a short 20 minute drive across the border haha.

I wanted to ask a question for the experts on this thread. From what I've read there is a question of whether the ST1080 supports SBS 3D. I only know about SBS 3D recently because my dad bought himself a new 3DTV and I found out that there is a lot of 3D content on the internet that is shown in an SBS format. My question is, do you guys think that implementing SBS support is a software-type thing or do you think that it's hardware-based? The reason why I ask is if it is software-based I can always hope for SMD to release a software/firmware update. If it is hardware-based, I guess this means if ST1080 ships without the SBS support, it'll never be able to support it until a new product comes out.

I hope that question was comprehensible. I look forward to hearing what you guys have to say! Cheers.

Post by **pierreye** » Mon Feb 27, 2012 5:30 am

3D Vision Player or 3D stereoscopic player can convert SBS/TnS to Framepack format but only for PC. For hardware based, Lumagen Radiance can convert any input of 3D format to any output format you desire.

Post by **CyberVillain** » Mon Feb 27, 2012 5:46 am

Is it just me that are suspicious to new guys on the forum?

Post by **dj2013** » Mon Feb 27, 2012 4:02 pm

Thanks pierreye for that. I'm not too worried about the potential purchase now.

What's the point of being suspicious of new guys CyberVillain? Do you not welcome a new member?

Post by **CyberVillain** » Mon Feb 27, 2012 4:06 pm

dj2013 wrote:Thanks pierreye for that. I'm not too worried about the potential purchase now.

What's the point of being suspicious of new guys CyberVillain? Do you not welcome a new member?

There was a dude here that was banned that came back using different alter egos.. thats all

Post by **cybereality** » Mon Feb 27, 2012 8:23 pm

Don't worry. As long... as you... don't... see ellipsis every... 2 words.... I think.. we are... safe....

Post by **space123321** » Mon Feb 27, 2012 8:27 pm

LOL - I am still speachless

CRAZY CRAZY last couple of weeks lol!!!

Post by **dj2013** » Mon Feb 27, 2012 10:42 pm

CyberVillain wrote:
dj2013 wrote:Thanks pierreye for that. I'm not too worried about the potential purchase now.

What's the point of being suspicious of new guys CyberVillain? Do you not welcome a new member?
There was a dude here that was banned that came back using different alter egos.. thats all

Gotcha. Well I'm not one of his alter egos.

If I pre-order the ST1080 and get it shipped to the states, do you guys think I'll be able to cancel the order before the May shipment date if SMD decided to allow Canadian purchases a little bit after March 1st?

Post by **pierreye** » Mon Feb 27, 2012 11:01 pm

We still experiencing aftershock .... effect.

Post by **ginhead** » Tue Feb 28, 2012 3:03 pm

Anyone care to speculate if the pre-order will include a battery pack?

The features page lists ‘5 hour external mobile battery pack’ under the Power section, but nothing battery related is listed in the Product Config section.

I currently have a New Trend USB power pack (5v @ 1amp), but that is not going to give me 7 Watts. Anyone have any suggestions on a good, portable battery? I’ll prob want to pick one up for backup even if the pre-order has something included.

Getting excited to place the pre-order – disappointed that 2012 is a leap year

Post by **PalmerTech** » Tue Feb 28, 2012 3:07 pm

Energizer XP1800. Great pack, cheap price, tons of amps. Plus, several members here (Including myself) use it for VR setups, so you have a bit of a support group.

Post by **pierreye** » Tue Feb 28, 2012 7:44 pm

I can vouch for Energizer XP18000. Manage to get 3 hours plus of gaming with HMZ-T1 (15w) and ASUS WAVI (25w). For 7w consumption, it will go for a long way. You can go for smaller capacity for ST1080 such as XP8000.

Post by **VRgamesterz** » Tue Feb 28, 2012 8:11 pm

About that battery, how many things can get plugged into it at once?
Do you put this in a backpack with the laptop?

Ku

Post by **PalmerTech** » Tue Feb 28, 2012 8:33 pm

It has 3 different jacks, but you can make a splitter cable to allow more. Pretty safe to do (Especially if you add regulators for each device), this thing is meant to have enough power to cold boot laptops.

Post by **brantlew** » Wed Feb 29, 2012 10:39 am

Poll: So who's going to pre-order this sucker?

I'm about 75% on the "yes" side right now.

Post by **GSG9LIGHTNING** » Wed Feb 29, 2012 12:03 pm

I definatly order the ST1080 after the exhibition CEBIT next week.
PalmerTech, i rely on your personal short Review

I hope they ship it to germany in the first half of this year and make me happy

I am pretty sure, that the Cinemizer OLED is out of the race now ( it´s resolution is a no go ).

Post by **CyberVillain** » Wed Feb 29, 2012 1:03 pm

Im going for the HMZ, they look like the better PC-gaming choice right now.. If they change the specs and support Nvidia 3dvision at 60hz i will probably cancel my Sony HMZ preorder...