3D-Noob buying monitor for games. Aiming for $500 - $800

[NeedMoDro]

Hi, I'm new to 3d. I have a single GTX 570 and an i7-2600k @ 5Ghz, 8gb of ram, bluray, etc...

I want to buy a 3d monitor and am a bit lost. Most of the time I will be using it for games on my PC, I want the best possible experience in terms of visual quality for 2d and 3d PC games (I don't play consoles so that is not a consideration) I would like to watch 3d movies, tv, etc, but that is a distant 2nd to games.

Goal is around $500 but there is always room for improvement if it's worth it. Say $800 cap, but only for significant improvement as far as image quality or the quality of the monitor itself. ie. I won't be trying to RMA it 6 mo from now.

Size is not super important to me, lol. I have a 22" Samsung now and from what I've been looking at in my price range it's gonna be a 23" or 27". Is the 3d greatly enhanced between 23 and 27?

Do I need/want hdmi 1.4?

What features should I look for? Is there anything important I need to know?

What is crosstalk?

Are the monitors that come with 3d-Vision kits bundled any good? Are there better glasses/kits than the standard nVidia one? Is there more than one type of kit from nVidia?

Specific recommendations? links plz!!

Thanks in advance!!


Also... I have a Samsung HDTV, I know that it's not "3D-ready" but it was advertized as 120hz and says "Auto Motion Plus™120Hz". Is there any form of 3d solution for this TV?

[tritosine5G]

get a DLP rptv or projector, LCD is a waste of time , maybe it'll get better but not now.

[NeedMoDro]

get a DLP rptv or projector, LCD is a waste of time , maybe it'll get better but not now.

I've seen a lot of people saying go with a 3d-ready projector. I understand that the size makes for better 3d but what about image quality? Will a $700 projector look as good as a similar priced LCD? And what about during the day? I can't block the Florida sun out of my living room very well.

I haven't looked into DLP TVs at all, I was under the impression that was becoming a thing of the past. Do they work with nVidia 3d?

I'm looking into this for PC gaming, I prefer a mouse and keyboard in most of my games. I only hook my tv and 360 controller to my computer to play games like Arkam Asylum and Assassins Creed(3rd person games). I'm sure I would enjoy sitting at my computer desk playing on a projector across the room but if it's on a DLP tv I'd pretty much have to sit on the couch(not good for mouse and keyboard). Although I do have a rather large desk, are there small DLP TVs that I would be able to sit about 4' from playing on the keyboard?

[Likay]

Is the 3d greatly enhanced between 23 and 27?

In my humble opinion size makes more difference in 3d than in 2d. If you can go for a projectorsetup you should definitely do so. The bigger the better.

Do I need/want hdmi 1.4?

Hdmi1.4 is so far limited to 720p@120Hz but will probably change in the future. Even if of course 1080 is better, viewing in 720 is certainly not bad though.

What features should I look for? Is there anything important I need to know?

Light is important in 3d. If buying a projector+shutters the eyes needs to share the light from it. The shutterglasses eats away min 55% of the light too. This means a total brightness of max 23% compared to 2d-viewing. It's not as bad as it sounds but if not expected you could be disappointed. If you dim the viewingroom entirely the eyes compensate well and a 2500lumen projector + a 60" screen should give a decent experience.

What is crosstalk?

Most (almost all) solutions today have a degree of crosstalk/ghosting. Crosstalk occurs when one eye image leaks through a little to the other eye thus creating a doubled ghost image. It usually occurs in high contrast situations (with some displays it's a timing issue thus causing crosstalk in upper, lower or both edges of the screen) and should obviously be as low as possible.

Also... I have a Samsung HDTV, I know that it's not "3D-ready" but it was advertized as 120hz and says "Auto Motion Plus™120Hz". Is there any form of 3d solution for this TV?

It means that the tv interpolates the original image up to 120Hz. However it's very unlikely it'll work in 120Hz mode with shutters. Anaglyph (red/cyan glasses) would be fine though.


I'm pretty bad informed about priceranges but the projector Acer H5360 + the 3d-visionkit performs well, should be a product in your pricerange and should work well with 60" screen or wallprojection. You could check 3d-vision requirementlist and the price on eventual kits.

[NeedMoDro]

You guys are starting to convince me about projectors. I'm just not sure tho, my friend has one for his ps3 and it looks horrible in the daytime. I'm gonna do some more reading and wait for some more opinions.

Right now it's between the Acer HN274 and the ACER H5360. I'm still leaning toward the LCD tho. Prices are pretty much the same after buying a 3d vision kit to go with the projector. I'm just not sure the projector is practical for my needs, and am concerned with overall image quality.

[Likay]

I edited in the link to 3d-vision requirement in the above post. But remember that the lightissue is bigger in 3d compared to 2d. Maybe you could attach a pair of cheap rollercurtains in the price as well? I got mine for appr 20-25$ each (even attached my silverscreen to one ).

It's good you have the possibility to see a projectorsetup so you have a reference what to expect. How many lumens is your friends beamer?

[NeedMoDro]

I have no idea about his projector. And I'm pretty sure he doesn't either, lol. I know it's 1080p and supposedly pretty expensive. He got it from some guy selling them out of a van at our college, so you never know, lol.

You guys mentioned screens for the projector... Will I need to invest in one or can I just use a white wall? About how much do decent screens cost?

[tritosine5G]

The most important two things you need to know about 3d in 2011: how's brightness and how's crosstalk. These are utmost importance and LCD can't deliver. (Another thing that DLP has better IQ anyway)

You can't really use 2D metrics to measure a 3D display ( those specs are fake anyway),
when we talk about 3d, resolution is overrated, the usual million contrast fake stuff is overrated...
If you can go for rear projection with mirrors and good quality screen, otherwise high gain silver or glass beaded front screen.

Here are some links to get you started:
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NgLxQBTb ... r_embedded[/youtube]
<-thats one of the best screens ever made
http://www.acrylite-shop.com/US/us/shee ... 0zi6b.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
<-thats the similar less dark but cheaper

http://omegasales.wordpress.com/2011/05/10/647/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

<- thats also similar but front projection

[NeedMoDro]

Sigh... I just don't know... The loyalty between LCD and Projector owners reminds me of nVidia vs ATI fanboys.

I think I'm gonna have to go with the LCD... I fully understand that the best 3D only comes from a projector. But I'm a PC gamer and a big time graphics whore, for me and my price range I think LCD wins.

I'm trying to build a sweet gaming setup, not a home theater. I'll get a projector or plasma or whatever form my living room when when I can afford to do it properly. Besides all that... my GF can't see 3d so it might be a problem when I wanna watch a 3d movie in the living room... lol.

[tritosine5G]

shutterglasses can be modified for simultaneous 2d 3d viewing, don't be so disheartened , DLP worths every penny and LCD is a toxic , e -waste
for instance,
That Little Acer projector gets compared to 5000 dollar projector beasts, not LCD waste, theres no comparison really...

[NeedMoDro]

shutterglasses can be modified for simultaneous 2d 3d viewing, don't be so disheartened , DLP worths every penny and LCD is a toxic , e -waste
for instance,
That Little Acer projector gets compared to 5000 dollar projector beasts, not LCD waste, theres no comparison really...

You know... just when I think my mind is made up I find something that makes me change it... lol.

I maybe shouldn't have mentioned the gf thing bc frankly it has no effect on my decision. Out of curiosity tho, how does the simultaneous viewing work? btw... it's not that she can't see 3d, its that it doesn't work very well, she only has like 20% vision in one eye.

[tritosine5G]

well the stuff you 'd want, ( cheap front projection looking good), would work with CASIO laserprojector at around 900 bucks, its DLP (DLP says winner) , and VERY bright.
But , 5360 is not too bright at 3D... 5360 and those little LED fellows in my signature need RP or very tight FP really...

-you can bet the CASIO 120hz firmware is messed up! So we have trouble with that just yet, 60hz is okay though.

Glasses stuff is simple, you have to swap lens between two pairs , and done.

[PalmerTech]

LCD is a toxic , e -waste
for instance

What about CRT? One of the reasons people switched from LCD from CRT is that they are incredibly toxic to the environment!

As for simultaneous viewing, it is theoretically possible, but there is no way to actually do it with shutter glasses yet without custom hardware. Trito, you can only swap lenses for a polarized setup, we are talking about active glasses, right? In that case, you cannot just swap lenses between two pairs.

Want my input, NeedMoDro? Projectors are really, really nice, but not practical for just a gaming setup. And while they might be good for 3D gaming, they are not worth it for normal, 2D computer usage (Caps out at 720p). With a 3D monitor, you get a nice new monitor that you can use for things other than gaming. In light of that, I would look at either the new active shutter Planar monitor, or the new 27" Asus 3D monitor. Or you could get a head mounted display...

EDIT: I just double checked our environmental regulations, and LCDs are not classified as toxic at all. The only thing bad about them is the trace levels of mercury in the backlight tubes, and LED backlit monitors are not classified as e-waste at all, you can simply throw them out.

[tritosine5G]

(...)

you know we have chain to deal with CRT, a procedure and that chain is way worse with LCD, they don't know what to do with the display panel just yet its that toxic really. LCD is an environmental hazard & concern #1 you can go look it up.

Also look up the glasses stuff, and FYI, always sad time to see someone from US talking down on DLP...
http://3dvision-blog.com/modifying-the- ... rame-only/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

real shame they get away selling these as "gamer" monitors...

[PalmerTech]

I have looked it up, and know quite a bit about it. We did have a chain/process to deal with it, but only if you brought the display to a special recycling center for electronic waste, which almost nobody bothered to do. CRTs contain large amounts of cadium, barium, and lead, all of which are toxic.

And I do not need to look the glasses stuff, I know I am right. You CANNOT just swap the lenses. Active glasses just don't work like that! If you can find anything that shows how to do what you are describing, please show us, it would be very useful. EDIT: I see you added a link, that is very cool, but is a heck of a lot harder than just swapping lenses, which I think you were confusing the process with. What he did was route the same shuttering signal to both lenses, that takes some pretty intense soldering skills. Not to mention that you end up with a pair of $150 glasses that can only be used for 2D! Like I said before, you can only do this with custom hardware, and modifying glasses like that is out of the skill range of most people.

And I am not talking down on DLPs, I own a 3D DLP projector, and I like it a lot. But everything I said still applies, monitors are a lot more practical for gaming, and for working. Not everyone wants to dedicate a large space that they have to keep perfectly dark, and then pay a few hundred dollars every few thousand hours for a new bulb! (I know, not a concern with those sweet Casio projectors)

[cybereality]

I would recommend the Acer HN274H. You can get it for around $650. Its a really nice monitor, and will have the best quality 1080P gaming and movie watching. If you go with a projector or HDTV you will be limited to 720P. Ghosting is low on Acer and compatibility is good, especially with Nvidia cards. Its 27", which is more than enough for a desktop. Very nice kit.

[tritosine5G]

-no theres cadmium in CRT P22 phosphor since 60's, its a good old fashioned FUD and you fall for it .

Remember it isnt all that different from plasma, its just that plasma sucks.

I think chinese even sell you 2D / 3D glasses if you really want, why you want to dishearten him?

[PalmerTech]

Trito, go look at my last post again, I edited it in response to the edits you made to your post.

I am not falling for FUD, you are. LCDs are not very toxic, and LED backlit LCDs are not toxic at all! It looks like you are right, modern CRTs do not contain cadmium, but they still contain barium and lead, which are both very toxic.

[NeedMoDro]

I would look at either the new active shutter Planar monitor, or the new 27" Asus 3D monitor. Or you could get a head mounted display...

It's nice to have some pro LCD ppl chiming in

Do you mean the Acer one I posted? The HN274? I haven't really read up any Planar or Ausu models. Do you know the model numbers?

I loooked on newegg and cant find a 27" Ausu but I think I found the Planar, is it this one and Does it come in 27"?
----> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6824016171

Also, I've never owned or used any Planar products, I assume they are good? I tend to be a brand loyalist, my tv and current monitor are samsung, all my peripherals are logitech, nVidia fanboy, last 2 mobo's were Asus, was scared to switch to MSi when i got my 570(wanted to stay with XfX so bad), etc...

[tritosine5G]

-nice job! bias at its finest, again

I'm done with this discussion.

[NeedMoDro]

-nice job! bias at its finest, again

I'm done with this discussion.

I don't think anyone is downing projection, it's just about what fits specific needs.

[cybereality]

This is the Acer monitor I recommend:
http://www.amazon.com/Acer-HN274H-BMIII ... B004YCMEJU" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

That includes the Nvidia glasses. The Planar monitor should be the best quality (maybe slightly less ghosting than Acer) but both should be nice.

[Likay]

-nice job! bias at its finest, again.

Sorry, just can't resist, but please Trito....

[PalmerTech]

-nice job! bias at its finest, again

I'm done with this discussion.

All you are doing is ignoring everything I say that is right, even though you are clearly wrong. Then, you jump on a small mistake I made about cadmium. This is not a matter of bias, it is a matter of you making all kinds of false claims. A real man would just admit they are wrong, not run away from the fight they started like a child.

NeedMoDro, I am sorry, I meant to say Acer, not Asus. Silly me, I know the difference! I too am an Asus motherboard loyalist, and the two laptop I own from Asus are great. Cyber's link is the right one.

[NeedMoDro]

Acer 27" is on order... thanks everyone!!!