I need help in selecting these EVG920V Glasses

[nrkazmi]

Hi Guys. I am Nayyar Raza Kazmi from Pakistan. I am totally new to 3D. My interest in 3D started when I watched Toy Story 3 in 3D in Cinema with a pair of RealD polarized glasses. I brought those glasses to home only to be disappointed that they dont work on watching 3D samples on Youtube.
My interest further grew and I asked a cousin who purchased EDimensional Glasses for me and sent them to me in Pakistan. I tried to use them with its drivers to play FS2004 but with glasses all I could see was horizental lines and blurry images on the LCD Screen with or without the ED Glasses. I tried searching the web and tried some methods but nothing worked. Even bumped up the refresh rate to 85 which is the maximum my monitor supports but still nothing worked, so I guess these ED glasses are a piece of crap and the money has gone wasted
Now being disappointed with ED Glasses, I have my eyes on Chinese EVG920V glasses which support interlaced 3D. I have a Core2Duo 2.53 Ghz System with 2Gigs of DDR2 RAM and onboard Intel Graphics of 128MB RAM and a ViewSonic VA2226w 22 inches LCD Monitor.
Will I be able to play FS 2004 in good quality 3D with these Chinese EVG920V glasses If I attach a VGA converter. If not can I watch 3D Movies available for download from different sites with these glasses and would the quality be good enough to watch. I dont watch the best quality but I would be satisfied with decent graphics.

Please keeping in view my requirements as mentioned above kindly advise me should I buy these Chinese EVG920V glasses or not.

Thanks in advance

[Fredz]

Even bumped up the refresh rate to 85 which is the maximum my monitor supports but still nothing worked, so I guess these ED glasses are a piece of crap and the money has gone wasted

The problem is not with the eDimensional glasses but with your monitor, standard LCD monitors are not compatible with page-flipped stereo 3D. To use these glasses you need a monitor which support a 120 Hz refresh rate, like a CRT monitor or a recent 3D LCD monitor.

[cybereality]

Don't bother with the Chinese EVG920V glasses. Get the real ones, the Vuizx VR920. They VR920 has their own 3D drivers which work with a number of games (Half-Life 2, Crysis, etc.) and also the IZ3D driver which supports hundreds of games. You will be getting the full quality 640x480 resolution in 3D, but you can also bump it up to as high as 1024x768. The EVG920V actually use the same hardware as the VR920, but with the VR920 you get better driver support, which is more important. It may be possible to use the EVG920V with the IZ3D drivers (in interlaced mode) but I am not sure how good quality that would be. Keep in mind the EVG920V uses composite video while the EVG920D and the VR920 use VGA. Also you might have keep the resolution at 640x480 in 3D mode, which wouldn't work for a lot of modern games. So if you really must have an HMD, go with the VR920.

But, to be honest, I would recommend getting a 3D monitor if you can afford it. The Zalman Trimon is pretty nice (that is what I use) or you could go with the Nvidia 3D Vision. Obviously those will cost a little more, but you will be getting better quality than with a low-end HMD.

[nrkazmi]

Thanks my friends with your valuable advice and for clarifying some issues. Now this raises some further questions in my mind and I hope you will help me in those too.

1. Since I already have ED shutter glasses with ED drivers. Would they work if I purchase a 3D monitor only. I don have a separate 3d card installed as my computer has intel DG31PR motherboard which has onboard 128 MB graphics chip. Moreover can I watch downloadable 3D movies with my ED glasses.

2. What about the quality of EVG920V in terms of 3D video quality for downloadable 3D movies from Internet which are mostly in standard VGA resolution. Is it acceptable or just crappy

[Fredz]

1. Since I already have ED shutter glasses with ED drivers. Would they work if I purchase a 3D monitor only. I don have a separate 3d card installed as my computer has intel DG31PR motherboard which has onboard 128 MB graphics chip. Moreover can I watch downloadable 3D movies with my ED glasses.

To view 3D movies you'll need a 3D movie player like Stereoscopic Player or sView. I guess they should work with your graphics card but you should try them before buying a 3D monitor I guess.

[cybereality]

Well I have never used the EVG920V glasses so I can't speak for the quality. However they only accept a composite signal, so it will likely be a slightly blurry image. You want to be using VGA. In terms of video quality on an HMD, it can be nice, however the virtual screen size is not very big. It will appear as you are looking at a 15" laptop screen at a distance of about 1 foot. So you are not going to get a "big-screen" cinema experience with the glasses. And the resolution is not going to be as good as a full quality HD monitor, but I guess it can look OK. Remember it only supports field sequential, so while the resolution is 640x480 you are only going to get 640x240 in 3D. Not that great. You will probably need to buy the Stereoscopic Player in order to watch 3D videos. It uses mainly the CPU, so I don't think it will matter what your video card is. However if you want to play 3D games you will need a real 3D video card, like an Nvidia GTX 460 for example.

Unfortunately those ED glasses do not work with much anymore. You could use them with a CRT monitor, but LCD screens will not work. If you can find a cheap used CRT monitor this may be a decent option just to test things out. You should probably be able to use the Stereoscopic Player in software page-flipping mode using the ED glasses. This is taxing on the CPU, though, so you will need at least something decent to run this. SD videos should be ok, but I doubt HD videos will work unless you have a dual core 2.4Ghz or better. And you can forget about Blu-Ray 3D. However games will not work unless you are running Windows XP with a 7 series Nvidia card and older drivers (again only with a CRT monitor). Most of the new 3D monitors that are 120Hz LCDs will only work with the Nvidia 3D Vision glasses, not the ED or other shutter glasses. Also, the Nvidia 3D Vision only works on Windows Vista or 7 with a newer Nvidia card (8800 GT or up). There are other options, like the Zalman Trimon, which will work with other video cards and OSes. Also, I believe the IZ3D monitor is on sale at NewEgg right now for $130 w/ free shipping in the US. The iz3D isn't the best quality, but for that price you can't really go wrong. However you would have to consider how much it will cost to get someone to ship that to you so it might not be worth it.

[Fredz]

Unfortunately those ED glasses do not work with much anymore. You could use them with a CRT monitor, but LCD screens will not work.

That's not true, using these glasses you can view 3D movies with any 120 Hz capable display supporting a VGA port (3D LCD monitors, DLP projectors and TVs, etc.).

However games will not work unless you are running Windows XP with a 7 series Nvidia card and older drivers (again only with a CRT monitor).

Wrong again, you can play 3D games using eDimensional glasses with any graphic cards and 120 Hz monitors under all Windows versions (XP, Vista, 7) if you use the TriDef 3D driver or the iZ3D driver.

There are other options, like the Zalman Trimon, which will work with other video cards and OSes.

The Zalman Trimon is a polarized 3D monitor, the eDimensional glasses would be useless with it. And it's only an half resolution display too...

Also, I believe the IZ3D monitor is on sale at NewEgg right now for $130 w/ free shipping in the US. The iz3D isn't the best quality, but for that price you can't really go wrong.

The iZ3D monitor is also a polarized display, so it can't be used with eDimensional glasses either. For $130 you'd better keep your money for something else, ghosting on this monitor is awful and it's no wonder iZ3D stopped selling them...

You can buy a good CRT monitor in the list I provided for much less than that (~$50), which will be better than an iZ3D in any respect.

[cybereality]

That's not true, using these glasses you can view 3D movies with any 120 Hz capable display supporting a VGA port (3D LCD monitors, DLP projectors and TVs, etc.).

Well I was trying to give a simple answer for someone that wasn't informed. Yes, maybe 0.01% of LCD screens will work with shutter glasses, but it is easier to say that LCD doesn't work. I know about the Nvidia 120Hz LCDs but I do not think they work with generic shutter glasses. Do you have a link to someone who has gotten one of the Nvidia 3D Vision 120Hz LCDs to work with ED glasses? I've never heard of it being done and a quick search brought up nothing. And yeah, I know DLP displays work, but thats not what the OP was asking about.

Wrong again, you can play 3D games using eDimensional glasses with any graphic cards and 120 Hz monitors under all Windows versions (XP, Vista, 7) if you use the TriDef 3D driver or the iZ3D driver.

Again, show me a link where someone has got this working. I am on this forum all the time, and also the iz3d and DDD forums and I have heard nothing but problems from people who have tried this. The glasses cannot sync via DCC over DL-DVI cable so you are basically taking a crap-shot and hoping things are displayed on the right eyes. This might work for a minute or two on an older game like UT2004, which can stay at a high FPS, but otherwise it is not going to work at all. I don't know where you are getting your information from but from what I know it doesn't work.

The Zalman Trimon is a polarized 3D monitor, the eDimensional glasses would be useless with it. And it's only an half resolution display too...

Like I don't know its a polarized monitor, I'm looking at it right now! Thats why I said it was an "other option" meaning not ED glasses. Try reading next time.

The iZ3D monitor is also a polarized display, so it can't be used with eDimensional glasses either.

Again, this is obvious. I don't know if you are just trying to pick a fight or if you're just slow.

[Fredz]

Well I was trying to give a simple answer for someone that wasn't informed. Yes, maybe 0.01% of LCD screens will work with shutter glasses, but it is easier to say that LCD doesn't work.

I already said in my first post that standard LCD screens didn't work for stereo 3D.

I know about the Nvidia 120Hz LCDs but I do not think they work with generic shutter glasses. Do you have a link to someone who has gotten one of the Nvidia 3D Vision 120Hz LCDs to work with ED glasses? I've never heard of it being done and a quick search brought up nothing.

Using eDimensional glasses with a 120 Hz LCD screen is exactly the same than with a 120 Hz DLP projector or a 120 Hz CRT monitor, as long as they have a VGA port. I really don't understand why you said that these glasses would only work with CRT monitors.

And yeah, I know DLP displays work, but thats not what the OP was asking about.

Since you said that only CRT monitors were supported, I found quite sound to tell him about the compatibility of his glasses with the different display technologies.

Again, show me a link where someone has got this working. I am on this forum all the time, and also the iz3d and DDD forums and I have heard nothing but problems from people who have tried this. The glasses cannot sync via DCC over DL-DVI cable so you are basically taking a crap-shot and hoping things are displayed on the right eyes. This might work for a minute or two on an older game like UT2004, which can stay at a high FPS, but otherwise it is not going to work at all. I don't know where you are getting your information from but from what I know it doesn't work.

http://forum.iz3d.com/viewtopic.php?p=23767" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
This guy could get his eDimensional glasses to work with his 120 Hz ViewSonic LCD monitor to play games using the iZ3D driver. He experienced occasional eye-swapping with the blue-line-code technique but attributed it to the beta state of the driver. He didn't notice any eye-swapping at all using the Zalman mode.

Like I don't know its a polarized monitor, I'm looking at it right now! Thats why I said it was an "other option" meaning not ED glasses. Try reading next time.

I know that you own this type of display and know which technology it uses, but the first poster doesn't and you didn't said it. And he specifically talked about eDimensional glasses that he bought, so there was really no reason to talk about polarized glasses at all to complicate the matter even further.

The iZ3D monitor is also a polarized display, so it can't be used with eDimensional glasses either.

Again, this is obvious.

It's not obvious at all for the first poster, and as I said the iZ3D is one of the worst possible choice for stereo 3D. So there was really no reason to talk about this monitor and that was a very bad advice to give.

I don't know if you are just trying to pick a fight or if you're just slow.

I'm not trying to pick a fight at all, but I must say that I'm very annoyed by people giving wrong informations on this forum. As you often read this forum, you must have remarked that it's not the first time I react like this in this case.

If I were a newbie in this field, I would have a really hard time making a choice based on the contradicting informations available here, which is a pity since it seems to be one of the most popular website about stereo 3D.

What made me even more angry is the fact that you have been here for a very long time, and that you should know better than anyone how complicated stereo 3D is. The information you gave in this topic was misleading at best, and I think it's not helping newbies at all, nor 3D adoption in general. Very much the contrary in fact.

[cybereality]

Ok, in regards to using 120Hz LCDs with generic glasses: I was only thinking about page-flipped shutter glasses output, I forgot you could use interlaced. So what I said was true regarding shutter output. Even in that thread you linked to the OP states that the eyes switch sync from time to time. And that he had to set it to 100Hz, as I believe 120Hz is only supported on dual-link DVI at those resolutions (and not VGA, which is required to use the ED glasses). So this setup is somewhat problematic. However when using interlaced it does seem like it should work, so I will retract what I said about it not working at all.

And yeah, I will agree that 3D is confusing. I do know a whole lot on the topic, as I am on this forum all the time, but there is still stuff I don't and I can be wrong sometimes. I don't feel bad if you correct me, and you should, but you don't have to be confrontational. This stuff is very confusing at times, even for a vet like me. So I totally understand that a newcomer could be overwhelmed. I just try to help people avoid the obvious pitfalls and give them a few keywords they can search on their own. I am not going to be expected to explain everything.

[Fredz]

Ok, in regards to using 120Hz LCDs with generic glasses: I was only thinking about page-flipped shutter glasses output, I forgot you could use interlaced. So what I said was true regarding shutter output.

No, it wasn't true. You said that LCD monitors were not compatible with shutter glasses, which is wrong. They are as compatible as CRT monitors, which you said were the only compatible monitors. The capability to produce page flipping is not related to the display but to the graphics card and the driver, in this regard there is absolutely no difference between a 120 HZ CRT or LCD monitor.

And the blue-line-code _is_ page-flipping, so LCD monitors are perfectly compatible with this technique. With an eDimensional dongle and glasses you can even use sync doubling to get 120 Hz page-flipping, with no eye swapping and no blue-line-code.

Even in that thread you linked to the OP states that the eyes switch sync from time to time.

The OP said that it was quite probably related to the beta state of the driver, which sounds more than plausible since if implemented correctly, blue-line-code won't produce any eye switching at all. Blue-line-code won't even be necessary for 3D movie playing with page-flipping using any 120 Hz display, as people have already experienced using Stereoscopic Player with 120Hz DLP projectors for example.

And that he had to set it to 100Hz, as I believe 120Hz is only supported on dual-link DVI at those resolutions (and not VGA, which is required to use the ED glasses). So this setup is somewhat problematic.

The VGA bandwith is 400MHz, it can support 2048x1536@85Hz (388 MHz) or 1680x1050@120Hz (306 MHz). The OP did set the frequency to 100Hz because it worked best for him, he didn't say anywhere that 120Hz was not possible.

I don't feel bad if you correct me, and you should, but you don't have to be confrontational.

I'm confrontational because as someone who has knowledge in this field, you've got some sort of responsability towards people who don't. If you're not sure about something then just say it, but don't affirm something that's wrong. It's not helping anyone.

I just try to help people avoid the obvious pitfalls and give them a few keywords they can search on their own. I am not going to be expected to explain everything.

Like everybody I certainly appreciate when someone tries to help other people, but in doing so it's important not to give wrong informations or bad advices. You don't have to explain everything, but when you affirm something it has to be true.

[Likay]

As a small correction: Most lcd/plasmas as is today still doesn't work with shutterglasses because of their internal lag. Since only a very small percentage of lcd's/plasmas are 3d-ready it surely helps increase confusing about compability and needs when using such. You can assume that if a device doesn't say 3d-ready it will not work with shutterglasses (i have seen one exception on the iz3d-forums though). If full of luck, then buy a ticket.
Also: if the device then is 3d-ready you need to make sure what they really are compatible with. As is now everything is too messed up to keep track on and the oppurtunity for the softwaremakers to exclude certain displays using edid-info complicates everything beyond understanding.
For e-dimensional as a company they can go bury themselves. Their statements about their glasses compability with lcd's/plasmas even when using one of their "lcd-optimized modes" is nothing but pure bull. Assuming and advising that they do NOT work on lcd-screens unless the screens are designed for pageflipping is not wrong until technology catches up.

@nrkazmi:
You need a vga-signal for the e-d dongle to work. If the card has dvi-i you can use a dvi-vga adapter. Hdmi is a nogo though.
Download and install the e-d activator and run in combination with iz3d-drivers. Set the e-d activator into interleaved mode and iz3d-driver into horisontal interleaved mode and run the dynamic test if successful. If it works with your screen then you can try other full resolutionmodes and see if eyeswapping is avoided. Newer e-d dongles supports blu-line-coding and if that work it's probably the visually best option to use. I'm not sure which option in the newer iz3d-drivers to use with blc though.
I've tried my e-d's with both my iz3d, samsung syncmaster as well as my lcd-projectors without success so don't have too much hope of success if the monitor isn't specifically labelled 3d-ready.
Let us know how it's going!

[nrkazmi]

Thanks once again all of you trying to help a total newbie in the world of 3D. And your discussion not only helps me clarify the things, it has further helped me to narrow down my choices. It is evident that I am having a hard time understanding the different issues related with getting a 3D image in front of my eyes.

I have decided to dump the idea of EVG920V, and from your discussion decided to move on from what I have got in terms of ED Glasses. Now If I am not getting it wrong, you guys are advising that the ED Glasses will work with any standard CRT monitor or 120Hz LCD Monitor or some funky projectors (not an option for me though).

Another friend in the last post gave the advice to try these glasses with my standard LCD monitor using ED Activator and downloaded iz3d drivers and did as advised. Again the screen went slightly dark with horizontal lines and blurry ghosting of images.

Now at the moment, I have got a system which is Core2Duo 2.53Ghz, 2Gigs RAM, 128MB onboard dedicated graphics chip and a VGA output. My use for 3D is just for watching 3D movies and only one game, I am interested in, that is Flight Simulator 2004.

I also have a CRT monitor, which is an old 17 inches Dell Trinitron Display. I went into its setting (currently its on 1024x768 display and in the refresh rate settings it is set at 60Hz but the maximum in drop down box for these settings is just 100 Hz. Does that mean that there are some specialized CRT monitors which can support 120Hz. Am I out of luck here??

Now what choices do I have at the moment.... Either to buy a 3D LCD Monitor which I can after a few months as I have to make some savings to buy one, or to continue with my old CRT or buy another CRT....

As Fredz said that I can use my ED Glasses for watching movies also, so the question now arises from here, that in practical terms step by step what I need to do so that at least I can watch a few 3D movies downloaded from net or sometimes play FS2004.

1. what settings do I need to do on my CRT
2. What settings do I need to do with my ED glasses setting
3. What software would be required to play these movies, or any drivers which might be particularly required.
4. Some movies I see are in Red/Blue Anaglyph format when I download them and open them in VLC Player. How can they be watched (if they can be). I tried home made Red/ Cyan cellophane glasses but that didnt work

I guess I am asking too much for, but looking at the helping response of all you particularly Fredz, Cyberreality and Likay, I have been encouraged to take more help from you guys and I hope you will continue to help me in this regard. I am sorry if I may sound stupid anywhere, but thats how it is because I am totally a newcomer to this field.

Thanks again

[Fredz]

Now If I am not getting it wrong, you guys are advising that the ED Glasses will work with any standard CRT monitor or 120Hz LCD Monitor or some funky projectors (not an option for me though).

Yes, your glasses will work with any CRT that supports 100-120Hz and 120Hz LCD monitors if they have a VGA port.

I also have a CRT monitor, which is an old 17 inches Dell Trinitron Display. I went into its setting (currently its on 1024x768 display and in the refresh rate settings it is set at 60Hz but the maximum in drop down box for these settings is just 100 Hz. Does that mean that there are some specialized CRT monitors which can support 120Hz. Am I out of luck here??

You're not out of luck, you should be able to use this display for stereo 3D at 100Hz. It will exhibit a little bit more flicker than at 120Hz but you can attenuate it by lowering the lighting in the room.

It's possible that your monitor can support 120Hz with a lower resolution like 800x600. Giving the exact model of your monitor could help find the best compromise between resolution and refresh rate.

1. what settings do I need to do on my CRT

Have a look at the driver used by Windows for your screen. If it's using a generic driver you could have more choices for graphic modes by installing the driver corresponding to your monitor.

3. What software would be required to play these movies, or any drivers which might be particularly required.

Stereoscopic Player is the best 3D movie player, you can also try sView.

To play 3D games you can test the iZ3D driver since you already installed it.

If you are using Windows XP and you can find an old NVIDIA graphics card (7600 GT for example), you could also use the old NVIDIA stereo driver for best results.

What is the model of your integrated graphics card by the way ?

4. Some movies I see are in Red/Blue Anaglyph format when I download them and open them in VLC Player. How can they be watched (if they can be). I tried home made Red/ Cyan cellophane glasses but that didnt work

Red/Blue movies won't work with your glasses, you need 3D movies encoded in specific formats like side-by-side, over-and-under, dual-stream, etc. You can find short 3D movies on the 3D vision and Stereoscopic Player websites to test your setup.

[nrkazmi]

@Fredz
The model of my onboard Graphics is Intel Graphics Media Accelerator 3100 (Intel GMA 31) Intel G31 Express Chipset Graphics and Memory Controller Hub(GMCH) 128 MB

[cybereality]

For using the ED glasses with a CRT you only need around 85Hz (although more is better). I would advice testing it out with the CRT first to see if 3D is worth it for you. You are going to want to get the Stereoscopic Player. It costs around $50, but you can download a demo for free to see if it works (only works for 3 minutes at a time). You can also get some decent anaglyph glasses and use those with your current LCD monitor. I recommend the Pro-Ana anaglyph glasses. They sell for under $10. You could use those with basically any 3D video using the Stereoscopic Player. If you are saving to get a real 3D monitor you will have more options. Personally, I would recommend the Zalman Trimon monitor as that is what I use. You can find those for around $500. That has the advantage of working with both ATI/Nvidia and also XP/Vista/7. Otherwise you will want to look at the Nvidia 3D Vision which has really good support for games but only works on Nvidia cards with Vista/7. The 120Hz LCDs go for between $400-500 plus the glasses are $200. There is also the VR920, which is around $400, but you are better off with a 3D monitor. There are also 3D projectors and DLP 3D-Ready TVs, but they cost closer to $1000. Depends what you want and how much you want to spend.