My iZ3D story

[SinisterSpatula]

My first experience with the iZ3D monitor was at my local Fry's electronics. At that time iZ3D was the only S3D option on display to experience first hand. I was floored by what I saw, the 3d effect was absolutely amazing. I made the decision right then that I just had to have it, and starting saving up for the big day. When I first got the iZ3D home I was still in awe of the 3D effect, but I noticed the picture did not look as good as what I'd seen before in the store. I don't know if the glasses on the retail demo are somehow better or what. I tweaked with settings, tilted my head, tried wearing the glasses upside down, but still to no avail. The picture had depth and popout like it should but there was so much double imagery in the picture that my games were nearly unplayable at times. (I had a lot of what I know now as ghosting) but I read about the new glasses that were in development and would be out soon. So I figured I'll just wait for the new glasses since they could help a lot and maybe even fix the ghosting to bring it down to a tolerable level. It's been over 6 months now and still the new glasses are under development or haven't made it out the door for release as of yet. Fast forward to a few weeks ago, when another trip to Fry's revealed a new display in the computers section and lo and behold, it was the Nvidia 3D Vision. I tried it out and I was shocked at how much of a difference in ghosting there was. There was no ghosting at all. I knew it would be another gamble to buy it and hope that it works as well at home as it did in the store, but I figured it couldn't be any worse then what I already had. Yes it's a much more expensive option having to buy the expensive glasses, the expensive monitor and having to stick with their brand of GPU and a darker overall image due to the shuttering but it was a clear case of you get what you pay for because once I got it home and set up and was playing my games, I still had absolutely no ghosting whatsoever, even on really high depth and convergence settings. I am floored! I am willing to put up with those drawbacks for picture perfect 3D. I wish I had gone with the Nvidia option in the first place. I strongly suggest looking at both first hand yourself before making a decision. Maybe one option works better then the other for your type of vision. For me, the shutters were the way to go, and I couldn't be happier now. And I don't want it to sound like I'm bashing iZ3D at all, they are a great company from my experience in dealing with them. I love that their developers are so involved and speak directly with the community. I love that they keep the community in the loop. I also love that it's a cheaper option that maybe it will get more people interested in S3D gaming. They just need to sort out the ghosting issues and I really hope the new glasses are the solution, I just got tired of waiting so long for them.

[yuriythebest]

valid points, yeah the iz3d does have ghosting, but the trick is to set it at very low separation with very high convergence then it'll look better.
From what I've read though (I haven't used nvidia 3d vision- just the endimensional shutters) is that the image is darker and the drivers have more visual anomalies, plus there's the "you only get one pair of glasses" issue (you can get more but it's very expensive). Both devices are awesome yet both have no flaws no doubt. I have the new iz3d glasses and they do make the ghosting less irritating (the "bright/shiny" ghosting has been killed off), and also there are no more tinting issues.

[SinisterSpatula]

I haven't had the Nvidia 3D Vision long, but I can confirm the image is indeed darker since your're getting half the usual amount of light with one lens being black at a time. You're right about being limited to only one pair of glasses without spending another small fortune with nvidia. For me, it didn't make much difference as I'm the only one playing games on the computer. For when I want to show someone how cool it is, I let them wear the glasses and I go without. Maybe iZ3D should look into doing circular polarization instead since RealD uses that and when I see movies in RealD I do not see any ghosting at all.

[Neil]

If you haven't seen it yet, here is a comparison of iZ3D's old and new glasses:

http://www.mtbs3d.com/cgi-bin/newsletter.cgi?news_id=88" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I own the NVIDIA solution too, and as long as the game developers implent supprt for all solutions, you will be happy with whatever you own I'm sure.

Regards,
Neil

[BlackShark]

I was also waiting for iZ3D's, (the 26" monitor which still isn't here), i saw a Zalman screen, got impressed and bought it.
Now according to the latests (official) rumors from iZ3D, their next screen will maybe use circular polarisation but ghosting isn't only about the single glass technology but the entire chain, from image generation to the eye.

For instance : in theory, circular polarisation ghosts more than linear polarisation, it's a math and physics fact, but when jumping to the real world things can get very different.
Like the current iZ3D monitor which uses linear polarisation and yet suffers from ghosting. Then if the user tilts his head a bit, then strong ghosting appears in linear polarisation, which does not happen with circular polarisation.

Shutter glasses should be 100% ghosting free, but in the real world, LCD shutter glasses always bleed a very small amount of light when they should be completely opaque. Then there's the high refreshrate display : LCD displays like the samsung and viewsonic 22" monitors do cause ghosting even with the nvidia glasses, and it's pretty bad, i've had the opportunity to see it for myself. DLP however is said to be ghosting free, it is indeed pretty clean, yet when I went to the cinema to see Pixar's "UP" in a cinema equipped with the Xpand system, i could notice many scenes with obvious ghosting. (on some very high contrast scenes, the anti-ghosting image treatment does not work)
And then there's the sync issue which can cause nightmares on it's own.

I do not own an iZ3D monitor and I have never seen one in action, so I cannot say about it's amount of ghosting (i know it's high), but I do own a Zalman monitor and I have tried the nvidia kit (3d-vision glasses + samsung LCD monitor) at a trade show : the booth was held by an nvidia employee. I could instantly see a significant amount of ghosting. There was also a DepthQ projector using the nvidia glasses but the footage displayed didn't contain much contrast so I couldn't estimate ghosting at all.
Zalman isn't ghosting free either but it's a lot less than what the nvidia kit was showing at that trade show : on the Zalman screen you simply can't notice it unless you have a very very high contrast scene (like a ghosting test image or an extreme contrast game like audiosurf)

[cybereality]

Every solution has ghosting sans an HMD like the VR920. From what I understand of ghosting on the 3D monitors: the Zalman is the best in this regard, then the 3D Vision, then the iz3D monitor. However there are the new iz3d glasses coming out soon so that may change things. I feel bad because iz3D clearly has the best software support and general community involvement. However, at the end of the day, if the hardware is not up to snuff then its a hard sale. Hopefully they have beefed up their R&D department and will fix all these issues with the next model.

[dreamingawake]

3d vision is MILES better than Iz3d and probably always will be.

There is no questioning, the answer is clear.

Get the 3d vision. Give your Iz3d to someone who likes 3d.

End of story.

[SinisterSpatula]

3d vision is MILES better than Iz3d and probably always will be.

I agree. Switching from the iZ3D to 3D Vision was like going from Mr. Magoo vision to 20/20, it's a drastic difference. I can see some ghosting in the 3D Vision solution as well, but it's no where near the amount that I saw on the iZ3D, and it's an amount that I can tolerate so I'm happy as a clam. Looking forward to stereoscopic blu-rays

[Likay]

As a little complement to Blacksharks post about the iz3d and circular/linear polarization. The resulting light from the iz3d as is today is not of a totally linear characteristics regarding polarization. The right eye gets a linear polarization and the left eye gets a more "circularized" polarization. This is caused by the way of working (lcd-panel plus a polarizing front panel). The front panel works as an adjustable retarder and instead of changing polarization it makes it more or less "elipsoidal" to regulate the light from either the left or the right eye. More linear goes to right eye and more circular goes to the left. This is the simplified version of the way it works but might be enough.

As BlackQ explained future iz3d displays may be using circular polarization instead. Believe it or not but i'm probably totally in for that regarding the iz3d!
The result should be an equalization of anomalies between the eyes (instead for left eye taking the most hit as is today). Using a more circularized way the iz3d would work more "symmetrical" (when frontpanel is in "rest" both eyes get an equal view which isn't the case today).
For this to work they probably need a tad different frontpanel (electronics for it) for being able to shift retardercharacteristics, not only regulate it.

This post is a small assumtion from my side but it fits theoretically...

[winch8]

I guess that the new iz3d monitor should use led backlighting so to make it as thin as standard lcd monitors (you know led backlit monitors are thinner).
Are you going to make a 22'' model of the new monitor as well?