Hey all,
first post.
I bought MSI Stereo2-Glasses Shutter glasses back in January 2006,
my first expedition into the wonderful world of stereoscopic 3D.
Here is a link I got from my seller,
http://www.xvr3.com/msi/
Reading up on CRT's I purchased a NEC Multisync FE1250 22" CRT monitor as well ($90).
I experimented with the setup for a few days but then I got really busy with college.
One day I turned the Monitor on and it was all green. The seller was kind enough to send me another monitor,
which was working fine for awhile, till I started to get pink bands, and eventually stopped turning on.
I believe I disposed of those two huge heavy monitors. My Geforce FX5200 at some point stopped working too.
I blamed the MSI daughter board and removed it, re-boxed the entire MSI shutterglasses kit thinking that it might have broke my graphics card/monitor.
Years pass by, I graduated May last year, and not so busy right now.
Recently I have been mesmerized by the release of 120hz LCD's and Nvidia's 3D vision kit,
but really can't seem to justify such an expensive upgrade.
($720 in my case since I would need to purchase a Core2Duo)
Anxious, I recently ordered a Dell P1230 22" CRT hoping to relive those few awesome moments of 3D I experienced 3.5 years ago ($130).
Unpacking my MSI Shutterglasses kit, I initially installed the daughter board on my 2nd PC tower:
MSI Geforce 9600GT (PCI express x16)
Dual boot Windows Xp and Vista (x86)
On Vista, I installed Nvidia Forceware drivers 182.08 and 182.08 Stereoscopic Drivers from the nvidia page.
I was not able to enable stereo from the GUI, and I noticed it only considered me being able to use Anaglyph.
Is there something I can change in my registry to enable shutterglasses detection?
I tried using the CD that came with the MSI glasses, but all the drivers are for Xp and under.
I didn't even attempt booting Xp on that PC knowing that of all of the Xp Stereoscopic Nvidia releases,
the matching Forceware releases would not even recognize a 9600GT.
So kinda disappointed, I installed the MSI Daughterboard onto my 1st PC tower:
BFG Geforce 7800GS (AGP 8x)
Windows Xp (x86)
I am currently using Forceware 163.71 + 162.50 Stereo drivers, suggested on this page:
http://www.3d.wep.dk/driverguide.html
It works of course, as I tested it on my old 15" CRT at 85hz.
So my P1230 22" arrived yesterday and have been tweaking the 3D settings with it since.
I have been playing most games at 1024x768 @ 120hz (capable of doing it at 140hz).
In Left4Dead, I find that I use a very low separation and increase the convergence to the point where all of the ammo/health slides away,
revealing a good stereoscopic effect (it's always hard to focus the gun however).
I play Quake 3 Arena similarly, but choose to use cg_drawgun 0, so I can increase convergence to the point I can see the floor coming out of the screen.
Need for Speed Underground plays well too, given that I get rid of the entire HUD.
I notice that 91.31 + 91.31 drivers let you use Ctrl + F9, Ctrl + F10 to adjust Screen Depth, and Alt for Backplane,
but oddly those Hot Key's don't work in any game I have tried.
Sadly, I also believe that I am experiencing some ghosting with this CRT (true for all CRT's?).
Maybe I am nitpicking, but I really do miss knowing how much health I have in Left4Dead, and being able to see my gun in Quake 3 Arena.
It makes me wonder whether the new Nvidia 3d Vision kit has much much better driver support, less ghosting, and compatible games.
At the same time, I'm considering whether these MSI shutter glasses are just as competent as Nvidia's knowing that it operates as 120hz as well.
(I tried 140hz too, looked pretty good).
I can't seem to justify another $200 on Nvidia's 3D vision glasses unless I am sure the games actually play better, with less ghosting.
If I were to buy them, they would obviously work with the 9600GT on Vista on my 2nd PC tower, but would I really notice a significant difference?
I imagine my scenario is similar to many previous stereoscopic gamers.
I really can't seem to assess how much better this 3D vision kit is for CRT gaming.
I apologize for this super long post & appreciate any advice.
all the best,
take care. - tidel.
MSI Stereo2-Glasses Shutters XP or Vista / 3D Vision?
-
tidel
- One Eyed Hopeful
- Posts: 4
- Joined: Sat May 09, 2009 4:14 pm
-
budda
- Sharp Eyed Eagle!
- Posts: 389
- Joined: Thu May 22, 2008 9:13 pm
Re: MSI Stereo2-Glasses Shutters XP or Vista / 3D Vision?
Hi,
Your CRT will cause ghosting because its made with standard p22 phosphors. Ghosting is most noticeable in green and blue. Red has practically no ghosting.
You may want to try this work around.
I have mentioned the Red Eye Method elsewhere on the forume - read this for details http://www.mtbs3d.com/phpbb/viewtopic.p ... 4&start=15" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Ideally, the workstation CRT manufacturers should have used fast phosphors in their monitors especially for stereo 3D applications. They would still have commanded a premium price instead of being such cheap bargains like they are now.
If you are going to use the Red Eye Method, its essential to turn the contrast up to maximum and adjust the gamma to balance the low level blacks. If you want to go further, I can recommend the RGB to red monochrome dongle mod.
If you just want to use normal RGB color output, then turn down the color temperature of your monitor from 9000k (bluish) to about 5000K (reddish). This will reduce ghosting a little. Turning up the brightness (black level) may help too.
Good luck.
Your CRT will cause ghosting because its made with standard p22 phosphors. Ghosting is most noticeable in green and blue. Red has practically no ghosting.
You may want to try this work around.
I have mentioned the Red Eye Method elsewhere on the forume - read this for details http://www.mtbs3d.com/phpbb/viewtopic.p ... 4&start=15" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Ideally, the workstation CRT manufacturers should have used fast phosphors in their monitors especially for stereo 3D applications. They would still have commanded a premium price instead of being such cheap bargains like they are now.
If you are going to use the Red Eye Method, its essential to turn the contrast up to maximum and adjust the gamma to balance the low level blacks. If you want to go further, I can recommend the RGB to red monochrome dongle mod.
If you just want to use normal RGB color output, then turn down the color temperature of your monitor from 9000k (bluish) to about 5000K (reddish). This will reduce ghosting a little. Turning up the brightness (black level) may help too.
Good luck.
-
tidel
- One Eyed Hopeful
- Posts: 4
- Joined: Sat May 09, 2009 4:14 pm
Re: MSI Stereo2-Glasses Shutters XP or Vista / 3D Vision?
hey budda,
faster phosphors huh? hmm
So I found some color adjustment controls in my monitor and set
Red to 100
Green to 0
Blue to 0
and ghosting is virtually gone.
In Quake 3 Arena, only time I see ghosting is if I aim the gun straight up to the black sky.
Left4Dead is better too, ghosting wise. (still have to move the layer of post process).
Using red reduces ghosting significantly.
Now I know why my Nintendo Virtual Boy was always red.
It is so much easier on my eyes to adjust to higher levels of convergence (for more popout) with less ghosting.
Oddly enough, I can't find the contrast, brightness, or gamma controls in my monitor.
I just set the brightness higher in game options.
Thank you, I really appreciate the advice.
That said, kind of not my intention to play in red.
Maybe I need to strike the right balance of R,G,B,gamma, & contrast values.
Been reading forums, nvidia 3D Vision seems to have better game support.
decisions, decisions.
Just read about someone playing Wolverine Uncaged after renaming the game executable to ut3.exe
to activate the Unreal 3 stereoscopic profile.
::pouring with envy::
take care.-tidel.
faster phosphors huh? hmm
So I found some color adjustment controls in my monitor and set
Red to 100
Green to 0
Blue to 0
and ghosting is virtually gone.
In Quake 3 Arena, only time I see ghosting is if I aim the gun straight up to the black sky.
Left4Dead is better too, ghosting wise. (still have to move the layer of post process).
Using red reduces ghosting significantly.
Now I know why my Nintendo Virtual Boy was always red.
It is so much easier on my eyes to adjust to higher levels of convergence (for more popout) with less ghosting.
Oddly enough, I can't find the contrast, brightness, or gamma controls in my monitor.
I just set the brightness higher in game options.
Thank you, I really appreciate the advice.
That said, kind of not my intention to play in red.
Maybe I need to strike the right balance of R,G,B,gamma, & contrast values.
Been reading forums, nvidia 3D Vision seems to have better game support.
decisions, decisions.
Just read about someone playing Wolverine Uncaged after renaming the game executable to ut3.exe
to activate the Unreal 3 stereoscopic profile.
::pouring with envy::
take care.-tidel.
-
budda
- Sharp Eyed Eagle!
- Posts: 389
- Joined: Thu May 22, 2008 9:13 pm
Re: MSI Stereo2-Glasses Shutters XP or Vista / 3D Vision?
Hi,
The contrast and brightness controls should be accessable through the front buttons on the OSD (on screen display), just like my P1130.
To access these settings through the nvidia control panel, you will need to download and install the drivers for your monitor - search google "P1230 drivers" ....
The gamma setting can be adjusted directly in the nvidia control panel, or more simply by "ctrl-G" and "alt-G" in stereo gaming mode.
If your monitor is a Dell, they have a reputation for having the gamma normally set very high, so you may find some improvement available there.
The VirtualBoy was powered by LEDs, but the red display is surprisingly easy to view, like those submarine movies in the red control room.
I know what you mean about the dark sky. With the Red Eye Method properly adjusted I could actually make out the Milky Way in Far Cry 2.
Stereovision will be really good one day when all these technicalities get sorted out. Mmmm.
The contrast and brightness controls should be accessable through the front buttons on the OSD (on screen display), just like my P1130.
To access these settings through the nvidia control panel, you will need to download and install the drivers for your monitor - search google "P1230 drivers" ....
The gamma setting can be adjusted directly in the nvidia control panel, or more simply by "ctrl-G" and "alt-G" in stereo gaming mode.
If your monitor is a Dell, they have a reputation for having the gamma normally set very high, so you may find some improvement available there.
The VirtualBoy was powered by LEDs, but the red display is surprisingly easy to view, like those submarine movies in the red control room.
I know what you mean about the dark sky. With the Red Eye Method properly adjusted I could actually make out the Milky Way in Far Cry 2.
Stereovision will be really good one day when all these technicalities get sorted out. Mmmm.
-
tidel
- One Eyed Hopeful
- Posts: 4
- Joined: Sat May 09, 2009 4:14 pm
Re: MSI Stereo2-Glasses Shutters XP or Vista / 3D Vision?
hey,
Ya, I'm an idiot for not noticing the brightness & contrast buttons right in front of my monitor.
I'm used to finding it in the OSD. Setting the gamma higher helps reduce ghosting, but not nearly as much as the red eye method does.
Still, I'd rather use this than view everything in red.
Right now, I'm really leaning towards ordering the Nvidia 3D Vision glasses from newegg.com and finding out if it's compatible with my system (GF 9600GT, Vista x86, P4 3.4ghz ). I even read on the Nvidia forums, someone was able to enable Eye3d shutter glasses concurrently with the 3D vision glasses on Vista (if only there was a registry tweak that enabled this without the need for the IR Emitter). I'll keep it if it's really a quality product with better driver support, & compatible with my PC, otherwise I'll RMA. The glasses seem far more comfortable than MSI's shutter glasses which makes my nose hurt after a few minutes.
take care.-tidel.
Ya, I'm an idiot for not noticing the brightness & contrast buttons right in front of my monitor.
I'm used to finding it in the OSD. Setting the gamma higher helps reduce ghosting, but not nearly as much as the red eye method does.
Still, I'd rather use this than view everything in red.
Right now, I'm really leaning towards ordering the Nvidia 3D Vision glasses from newegg.com and finding out if it's compatible with my system (GF 9600GT, Vista x86, P4 3.4ghz
). I even read on the Nvidia forums, someone was able to enable Eye3d shutter glasses concurrently with the 3D vision glasses on Vista (if only there was a registry tweak that enabled this without the need for the IR Emitter). I'll keep it if it's really a quality product with better driver support, & compatible with my PC, otherwise I'll RMA. The glasses seem far more comfortable than MSI's shutter glasses which makes my nose hurt after a few minutes.take care.-tidel.