Nvidia 3D Vision or Zalman monitor

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Nvidia 3D Vision or Zalman monitor

Post by KlotePinoGH »

Hey all :)

You guys are probably sick of another comparison thread but I really tried to find a decent explanation before posting.

I have recently really did some research into this first starting out with thinking about buying the nvidia solution since I have a good GFX card and it usually has good driver support. However literally right before I was going to buy the 3D vision kit I stumbled across the Zalman 22" monitor.

The whole concept sounds much simpler to be honest, less ghosting and no more weird problems like extreme flickering. Also it unlocks the way to stuff like iz3d drivers and DDD drivers which are much more customizable and users can add profiles themselves for others to download.

I did see that the zalman monitor drops down the resolution to half of standard resolution when entering 3D mode and not the 120hz rate i thought was required but people are still really positive about it. for me the price difference would be:

Zalman Monitor + Glasses: 200 euro's
Samsung 2233RZ + Nvidia Glasses: 360 euro's

There must be a reason why nvidia has those special glasses etc? I assume they use a different system but is the result actually more beautiful on the samsung screen with the full resolution because the zalman solution feels way more secure to me.

Thanks in advance for the responses!
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Re: Nvidia 3D Vision or Zalman monitor

Post by cybereality »

Personally, I have a Zalman and I think it is the best solution overall. That is not to say it necessarily looks better than the 3D Vision. That I don't know, I've never seen the Samsung/3D Vision in person. But I have read numerous complaints about that monitor, ghosting on the top of the screen, weird flickering issues, grainyness to the image, etc. I really have no major complaints with the Zalman. That is not to say its perfect. Right off the bat it halfs the resolution in 3D, and that may be a big issue for some people. I don't really notice much, it looks fine to me. Another big issue if the vertical viewing angle. On the Zalman it is really small. You basically have to get into the "sweetspot" and stay really still. If you leave this area then it ghosts really badly. In practice its not so much of a problem once you get it setup in the right position.

In terms of the pros, well it works with all 3 major 3D drivers: Nvidia, IZ3D and DDD. This is a huge bonus and I find I use the iz3d driver more often than not its better than the Nvidia's. DDD driver is last but still works well with some games like Crysis or Bioshock. The Zalman monitor itself is very nice as a 2D monitor and has loads of physical adjustments: tilt, swivel, lift and also turns 90 degrees into portrait mode. The Samsung has like no adjustments. The polarized glasses as passive so there is no flicker, no batteries to run out, very light and stylish. Comes with standard glasses and clip-ons for glasses wearers. And the price, it costs half of the 3D Vision bundle for an arguably better product. In my opinion there is not much of a decision.

Please though, wait for some 3D Vision owners to chime in and give their opinion. I have never seen the 3D Vision so I can't say for sure how good it might be. All I know is that I am happy with the Zalman.
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Re: Nvidia 3D Vision or Zalman monitor

Post by KlotePinoGH »

cybereality wrote:Personally, I have a Zalman and I think it is the best solution overall. That is not to say it necessarily looks better than the 3D Vision. That I don't know, I've never seen the Samsung/3D Vision in person. But I have read numerous complaints about that monitor, ghosting on the top of the screen, weird flickering issues, grainyness to the image, etc. I really have no major complaints with the Zalman. That is not to say its perfect. Right off the bat it halfs the resolution in 3D, and that may be a big issue for some people. I don't really notice much, it looks fine to me. Another big issue if the vertical viewing angle. On the Zalman it is really small. You basically have to get into the "sweetspot" and stay really still. If you leave this area then it ghosts really badly. In practice its not so much of a problem once you get it setup in the right position.

In terms of the pros, well it works with all 3 major 3D drivers: Nvidia, IZ3D and DDD. This is a huge bonus and I find I use the iz3d driver more often than not its better than the Nvidia's. DDD driver is last but still works well with some games like Crysis or Bioshock. The Zalman monitor itself is very nice as a 2D monitor and has loads of physical adjustments: tilt, swivel, lift and also turns 90 degrees into portrait mode. The Samsung has like no adjustments. The polarized glasses as passive so there is no flicker, no batteries to run out, very light and stylish. Comes with standard glasses and clip-ons for glasses wearers. And the price, it costs half of the 3D Vision bundle for an arguably better product. In my opinion there is not much of a decision.

Please though, wait for some 3D Vision owners to chime in and give their opinion. I have never seen the 3D Vision so I can't say for sure how good it might be. All I know is that I am happy with the Zalman.

Thanks alot for the quick reply and yes that's about the same feeling I have right now. I can honestly not at ALL judge if I'm going to be annoyed by the resolution. I actually have a BenQ 24" 1920x1200 screen right now and if I drop the resolution down there I obviously notice it immediately but with 3d it's of course a different story. Can you maybe give me a little background about your experience because that might make me able to judge better if I'm going to be annoyed by the resolution. Btw do you still set the normal resolution(1680x1050)in the game menu's? Because if you lower that it would actually increase performance too.

I'm hoping for some 3D vision users to give me something to work with here. And the 3 different drivers is a major bonus for me since it looks like both are more active and flexible with adding games.
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Re: Nvidia 3D Vision or Zalman monitor

Post by KlotePinoGH »

Actually just looked at the TriDef website and the Zalman monitor is not listed as supported. Is this just a mistake or is it actually not supported?
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Re: Nvidia 3D Vision or Zalman monitor

Post by Neil »

It works, it's just not recognized by brand name. Select "interlaced" under standard displays.

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Re: Nvidia 3D Vision or Zalman monitor

Post by cybereality »

For me resolution is not the biggest deal. I used a CRT monitor with shutter glasses for a while at 1280 x 1024. Then I was using the VR920 HMD which is only 640 x 480 but still looked decent (and held me over when I got a 2D LCD screen and chucked my CRTs). Then I got the Zalman which is 1680 x 1050 but half resolution per eye in 3D mode. I mean, it looks a little less detailed, yes, but its not like half the graphics. I have heard some other Zalman owners complain about this though, so your mileage may vary. At first its certainly noticeable, especially if you switch to 2D mode and take the glasses off. But once you play for a while in 3D its acceptable and you get used to it. I imagine the raw image quality would look better on the 3D Vision, similar to what I have seen on a CRT with shutter glasses. But for me its not a deal breaker. Also, the Zalman *must* be run at full resolution, 1680x1050. The 3D does not work at lower resolutions unless you set the monitor to 1:1 pixel mapping (with a black border around the image). So I always run at full res and performance is not a problem using an 8800 GTS 512MB.
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Re: Nvidia 3D Vision or Zalman monitor

Post by Neil »

Actually, this isn't true anymore.

In the case of Tridef, they have functionality that artificially stretches the image in a manner that allows lower res options in S-3D mode on the Zalman and interlaced monitors.

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Re: Nvidia 3D Vision or Zalman monitor

Post by KlotePinoGH »

Mmm, Ok thanks again! Well I really can't justify paying another 150 euro's for a product that has a slightly higher resolution so unless there's an actual difference in sense of depth or anything I'm gonna go with the Zalman. :mrgreen: But isn't the stereoscopic method(like the Zalman uses, right?) not an outdated and oldskool way to get the 3D effect? That's the impression I got from the nVidia forums.
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Re: Nvidia 3D Vision or Zalman monitor

Post by cybereality »

KlotePinoGH wrote:That's the impression I got from the nVidia forums.
Well big surprise that people recommend the Nvidia solution on Nvidia's forums. Polarized solutions are, in fact, the state of the art. That's why they are used in professional theaters setups (RealD, IMAX3D).

Also, I find it hard to believe no one here has the 3D Vision / Samsung monitor. Surely someone here has another opinion...
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Re: Nvidia 3D Vision or Zalman monitor

Post by The_Doctor »

I have not used the Zalman, but I used the iz3d driver interlaced try-out on a crt and while it's ok, it's nowhere close to the clarity of a full resolution 120HZ panel. I would buy the 120 HZ solution over the interlaced every time. I have the Viewsonic 120Hz monitor, not the Samsung but used the Samsung when it first came out. I can't tell a difference between the Samsung and Viewsonic. Both have ghosting and both are tn panels with weird colors if you look at them from the sides/up/down and not straight on.
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Re: Nvidia 3D Vision or Zalman monitor

Post by BlackShark »

I own a Zalman monitor, I have had the opportunity to test the nvidia 3D vision solution at Dimension 3 Expo in Paris last summer.
Both nvidia and Zalman have advantages and drawbacks. The question is, which features are you ready to leave aside to get the others... or if you see it the other way aroud : what drawbacks do you absolutely not want.

The drawbacks of the Zalman are it's reduced vertical resolution : it is annoying when playing driving games, narrow vertical viewing angle : the monitor has a fully flexible foot but you need to tweak it everytime you change your seating position. And it's a rather old display (it uses almost 3 years old LCD technology) so it tends to get blurry in fast moving scenes. It's perfectly fine on most games, but it might be an issue if you play fast FPS games competitively. (you can play Left4Dead, Mirror's Edge or other UT3 FPS games perfectly fine, when i mean competitively i mean at very very high skill level).

The drawbacks of the nvidia system are the shutter glasses : 120Hz isn't fast enough for everyone, in a lit room i can clearly feel the additional eyetrain, it doesn't give you headaches right away but it definitely feels very different from an LCD display, it feels like playing on a 60HZ CRT monitor (in 2D). Also in fast moving scenes, the time difference between the left and right eye disturbs the 3D perception, if you have seen James Cameron's AVATAR at any non-IMAX cinema (RealD, Dolby3D or XpanD) you may have felt it on some fast traveling shots : i especially remember a shot in the human base hangar with the camera traveling quickly to the left between helicopters and mechs suffering from this issue.
The nvidia system is also exclusive to the nvidia GPU brand and nvidia driver, it can't work with anything else.
Ghosting varies depending on the display you are using : it is high even on 120HZ LCD displays but I heard it is very low on DLP projectors.
And then there are the hiccups many users have reported with big flicker happening regularly. Some users never complain about it (so i guess they are lucky users who don't have the issue), others have the issue and can't get rid of it no matter what they try.
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Re: Nvidia 3D Vision or Zalman monitor

Post by KlotePinoGH »

BlackShark wrote:I own a Zalman monitor, I have had the opportunity to test the nvidia 3D vision solution at Dimension 3 Expo in Paris last summer.
Both nvidia and Zalman have advantages and drawbacks. The question is, which features are you ready to leave aside to get the others... or if you see it the other way aroud : what drawbacks do you absolutely not want.

The drawbacks of the Zalman are it's reduced vertical resolution : it is annoying when playing driving games, narrow vertical viewing angle : the monitor has a fully flexible foot but you need to tweak it everytime you change your seating position. And it's a rather old display (it uses almost 3 years old LCD technology) so it tends to get blurry in fast moving scenes. It's perfectly fine on most games, but it might be an issue if you play fast FPS games competitively. (you can play Left4Dead, Mirror's Edge or other UT3 FPS games perfectly fine, when i mean competitively i mean at very very high skill level).

The drawbacks of the nvidia system are the shutter glasses : 120Hz isn't fast enough for everyone, in a lit room i can clearly feel the additional eyetrain, it doesn't give you headaches right away but it definitely feels very different from an LCD display, it feels like playing on a 60HZ CRT monitor (in 2D). Also in fast moving scenes, the time difference between the left and right eye disturbs the 3D perception, if you have seen James Cameron's AVATAR at any non-IMAX cinema (RealD, Dolby3D or XpanD) you may have felt it on some fast traveling shots : i especially remember a shot in the human base hangar with the camera traveling quickly to the left between helicopters and mechs suffering from this issue.
The nvidia system is also exclusive to the nvidia GPU brand and nvidia driver, it can't work with anything else.
Ghosting varies depending on the display you are using : it is high even on 120HZ LCD displays but I heard it is very low on DLP projectors.
And then there are the hiccups many users have reported with big flicker happening regularly. Some users never complain about it (so i guess they are lucky users who don't have the issue), others have the issue and can't get rid of it no matter what they try.
Since you're the first here that has experienced both I'd like to know for sure: Is there any difference in 3D perception apart from the difference in resolution? Also I have played Counter strike Source at a fairly high level and still play Modern Warfare 2 but I'm pretty sure that's not the biggest problem. I'm gonna go see Avatar tomorrow and I know the eyestrain will be less than with these 3D displays but it might give me an indication of what I can handle when it comes to eyestrain. I have the feeling like that might not be that much of a problem.

The nVidia brand is no biggie for me aswell since I have the GTX295.

I'm very worried about the flickering though. It apparently can have many different causes and since my room is completely filled wiht different electronics I might have a chance at getting those flickers.
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Re: Nvidia 3D Vision or Zalman monitor

Post by dreamingawake »

I own 3 3d vision monitors.. well, 2 22" Samsung's and a 50" Samsung 3d ready Plasma..

I've also owned the 22" Iz3d monitor.

Personally I would suggest going with the Nvidia solution. It's going to be a much
better long term investment than the other options. Not to mention the image quality
is much higher.

Yes, you have to charge the glasses once in a while, and you look like a dork
wearing them.. but the 3d is worth it..

Get the 3d vision bundle and Batman Arkham Asylum and you will be a happy man.

Edit: Flickering isn't as bad as it seems on the Nvida forums. Yes, it DOES happen
and you will proably experience it. But if you read up and know how to use
the software correctly (forcing refresh rates helps) you can almost eliminate it.
I get flickering maybe 1/100th of the time? It's really nothing to worry about. :)
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Re: Nvidia 3D Vision or Zalman monitor

Post by Freke1 »

There seem to be an issue with (unbearable) ghosting on the top of the 22" samsung monitor. What is the current situation on that? I was about to buy the monitor but I won't be happy with what looks like massive ghosting on the top 15% of the monitor.
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Re: Nvidia 3D Vision or Zalman monitor

Post by winlonghorn »

To be honest, I would recommend the 3D Vision solution because in a month or so, they will be providing one of the first "true hd 3D" solutions. Acer will be releasing a 23 inch monitor that will support full hd 3D meaning that it will support the upcoming 3D blu rays if you have a blu ray drive in your pc.
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Re: Nvidia 3D Vision or Zalman monitor

Post by BlackShark »

Eyestrain due to the flicker effect varies according to the shutter frequency and the amount of ambient light in the room.
As far as eyestrain goes, unless something has been misconfigured in that cinema, you shouldn't experience much, if any.
Not only all cinema systems use 144Hz shutter technology (except IMAX which is simultaneous projection) and cinemas are very very dark environment.

So you can't really compare the amount of eyestrain of the cinema to shutter glasses at home.
Having tested the nvidia glasses, i clearly felt that 120Hz was not enough for me in a home environment.

On static scenes, the quality is clearly higher on the nvidia system due to the higher vertical resolution (i haven't tested the iZ3D monitor but I guess it's also very high). The main issue here is ghosting. However once the scene starts to move (i moved the mouse in left4dead), I could clearly feel uneven motion between the eyes on the demonstration setup hosted by nvidia even @120Hz : a feeling i never had on the Zalman screen (except when watching amateur video tests with unperfect sync).


If you intend to buy a 22" monitor, I would clearly suggest against the nvidia solution. However they are a tempting choice if you aim for a DLP projector.
The only review of the Acer 24" fullHD display i have read only tested it's 2D capabilities, not a word on ghosting. So i can't recommand a product about which i have no feedback. My guess is that ghosting will probably be lower than the samsung due to faster reaction times, but it's not by much.

If you are looking for an investment for the future. I would like to emphasize that I CLEARLY RECOMMAND AGAINST INVESTING IN ANY 3D DEVICE !
I am not kidding, the stuff currently available will be CRUSHED by what's going to be released over the next two years, you'll regret buying that shiny new 3D display quicker than you think and wish you had waited. And there is absolutely no guarantee about future compatibility once the big brands finally arrive. Standards have barely been agreed, none of the currently available displays support them (yes, not even the brand new 24"Acer 120Hz LCD display) and they are very likely to be changed again and again over the next year. Support for our products can and will be dropped at any moment if the manufacturer decides to do so.

If you want to buy 3D stuff, always remember that it's for now... not for later.
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Re: Nvidia 3D Vision or Zalman monitor

Post by Likay »

Dito. Not even dual projector rigs are safe (especially not for ps3 and xb360) because of the demands for two individual signals. Standards really needs to be set to make s-3d going through.
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Re: Nvidia 3D Vision or Zalman monitor

Post by cybereality »

For the price the Zalman is going for its not a huge investment like some other solutions are...
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Re: Nvidia 3D Vision or Zalman monitor

Post by Tretboot »

Thats why i am also very interested in it! Found out they were once even sold for 169 Euros! Thats even a good price for a 22" without 3d. And i could also use it as a second (2D) display. Problem for me so far, seems to be not available in Germany, but i will be on the lookout!
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Re: Nvidia 3D Vision or Zalman monitor

Post by KlotePinoGH »

Actually waiting a little bit might suit my plan well because my GTX 295 was faulty out of the box so I might wait a generation of GFX cards out. I just hope the Acer 24" monitor proves that the ghosting is just a samsung issue and that nVidia starts supporting their products and fixes the flickering issue. :roll:. However I already have an 8800GTX in my computer right now so I might still get decent performance on some games and the Zalman is not expensive at all. Can anyone give me an estimate as to when the next gen of GFX cards will be out? I'll base my decision on this.
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Re: Nvidia 3D Vision or Zalman monitor

Post by Tretboot »

I think no one can really guess that, the ATI Next gen is already out with the 5870. What i can suggest for the meantime is to get some anaglyph glasses and try out 3D Vision Discover with your 8800 and see how you like it.
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Re: Nvidia 3D Vision or Zalman monitor

Post by BlackShark »

The ghosting is not a Samsung issue... it's a LCD response time technology issue. Response times and shutter glasses just don't mix well.
The Acer monitor is slighly faster than the samsung monitor but not much, there will be a bit less ghosting but I can confidently predict there will still be a lot.
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Re: Nvidia 3D Vision or Zalman monitor

Post by KlotePinoGH »

I actually have one last silly question. Since I had a bad experience with the GTX295 and that was the cheapest offer I could find I'm thinking about just going with the Ati Radeon HD5870 since that's perfectly balanced price performance wise. However obviously the normal nVidia drivers are not supported but can I use the profiles that the nVidia drivers have or would I be limited to iz3d and DDD drivers. In general if I were to get a GTX285 or something with the Zalman will I be able get the same compatibility(new profiles for new games etc) as with the 3D vision glasses. I promise this will be my last question :). For some reason I find it really hard to grasp this whole concept. :wink:
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Re: Nvidia 3D Vision or Zalman monitor

Post by wnielsenbb »

If you want 3D you really need to stick to an nVidia card for the most options.
Another point though: you mention "slightly higher resolution" but it is infact 100% higher resolution.
The nVidia demo I saw was on a Viewsonic monitor and it looked awesome to me. The new 120 Hz monitors will make better 2D monitors too for that matter, so I wouldn't for a second consider the Zalman solution. Just my opnion of course. I also wouldn't consider a tiny 22" monitor. I have been using a 37" monitor for years. Now I pretty much only game on my 1080p projector with a 120" screen.
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Re: Nvidia 3D Vision or Zalman monitor

Post by KlotePinoGH »

wnielsenbb wrote:If you want 3D you really need to stick to an nVidia card for the most options.
Another point though: you mention "slightly higher resolution" but it is infact 100% higher resolution.
The nVidia demo I saw was on a Viewsonic monitor and it looked awesome to me. The new 120 Hz monitors will make better 2D monitors too for that matter, so I wouldn't for a second consider the Zalman solution. Just my opnion of course. I also wouldn't consider a tiny 22" monitor. I have been using a 37" monitor for years. Now I pretty much only game on my 1080p projector with a 120" screen.
Warren.
It's actually 1680x525 if I understand correctly so not completely toned down. I do have to admit that waiting for the Acer(which is the same size monitor that I'm using right now)seems tempting but since I'd have to import everything it would be a major hassle if I had any major problems and since the nVidia tech support is so terrible(they haven't fixed any major issues in the 9 months the 3D vision glasses have been available)the Zalman seems like a much more stable choice.

I'm not worried about the Acer Monitor because I think that's a solid choice but I'd practically be tied to the nvidia solution which ties me to only the nVidia drivers and their glasses. I don't know maybe I'm just getting a little paranoid because of the nVidia forums full of negativity. I'd love to see your setup if you can play games comfortably with a 120" projector or even a 37" monitor. Can you maybe attach a screenshot?
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Re: Nvidia 3D Vision or Zalman monitor

Post by wnielsenbb »

525 is exaclty half of 1050. It works by showing each eye every other line of the 1680x1050 display.
I don't have 3D yet sadly. Waiting on something to develop. All shutterglass compatible projectors are at best 720P which doesn't work for me. nVidia is too greedy to support dual projectors so that isn't on my list now. I have the 3D screen and filters just sitting in my closet waiting on something to develop. It seems 2010 will be the year. The TDVision standard stuff sounds like it will support everything, including dual projectors so that will be the way I go if it works out.
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Re: Nvidia 3D Vision or Zalman monitor

Post by cybereality »

IZ3D has support for dual projectors as does the Avatar game.
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Re: Nvidia 3D Vision or Zalman monitor

Post by wnielsenbb »

Certainly I could get something working, but buying a second projector for a solution that isn't supported by who I consider the biggest player in the 3D future doesn't make a lot of sense, especially with all that is going to happen in the next year. Don't get me wrong, I am rooting for iZ3D and applaud them, but it looks like nVidia is shoving their way to the front of the 3D future.
I am really hoping for a laser powered 120 Hz projector that will work with nVidia glasses, and hopefully be upgradable to dual passive when I can afford a second laser projector. After seeing the Mitsubshi Laservue all other display systems look pretty dull. Still, if nVidia re-enabled support for dual projectors I might cheap out and get a second lcd projector like I have now.
It sounds like HDVision is looking to maximize the number of 3D solutions, so they may push nVidia on that.
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Re: Nvidia 3D Vision or Zalman monitor

Post by Neil »

Hi Warren,

I can't subscribe to this view at all. The biggest industry players will be the ones who back and support S-3D gaming standards and do what the game developers ask for. So far, the most influential game developers are asking for industry-wide support: Crytek, EA, Ubisoft, Blitz, and more. Can you show me a successful product where the opposite is true?

While I expect NVIDIA to have a very successful future, they are only going to be one of many active and viable players. The same way there are multiple graphics card makers and TV manufacturers, and so on.

Speaking from years of experience, all of S-3D gaming's industry breakthroughs to date have had nothing to do with any single company in the market. The track record so far demonstrates the complete opposite is true.

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Re: Nvidia 3D Vision or Zalman monitor

Post by gicko »

The ZALMAN monitor with gtx295 and i7 is the most impressive stereoscopic solution in combination with the FUJI REAL D camera for self made pictures, and for gaming AVATAR+ZALMAN is equal to the exploration of a new world that everybody will find amazing.
And the polarised glasses for me are the cutting edge technology!!! not the shutter ones...
AND THAT IS THE OPINION OF A PERSON WHO WANTS EVERYTHING PERFECT
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Re: Nvidia 3D Vision or Zalman monitor

Post by FBIMitch »

:newshutter Hi.. As an owner of the nVidia stereoscopic 3D glasses solution . I am VERY pleased with the 3D effect.

As for headaches caused by eye strain, I have experienced none. There IS a feeling, not unlike the feeling you get when you see Avatar 3d in theatre(polarized glasses). Caused by focus of each eyes separately, quite acceptable though. I have lazy eyes and the stereoscopic glasses are actually good for that! I mean, there is treatments for eye problems that uses this technology. The eye focus exercise is not negative(you can google on this). As long as the refresh rates stays up, that's where eyestrain causes problems*.

I would recommend the nVidia solution wholeheartedly. The WOW factor alone is awesome. I'm a racer, one might says a serious racer. I find racing with these glasses on a whole new experience. The cockpit of the cars REALLY comes to life and light shines/reflexions are just lifelike. Since you look out a windows when you drive a car, the "out of window" feeling is cool!

I use the Samsung monitor, calibrated with Pantone Huey. The colours are great, saturation and brightness is very good(you need a bright monitor when you have the glasses on). I do see some Ghosting in some games, but with the wheel at the back of the IR transmitter I can make it disappear. I have a feeling it has something to do with the z-buffer in the games themselves cause Batman Arkham Aslylum and Need for Speed Shift dose NOT show ghosting.

*Now, the ideal refresh rate is 120hz. At the Samsung 2233RZ resolution that demands allot on the hardware. But my GTX260 SO does a great job!

Edit 2010/02/15 No more blinking/flashing, I just changed the settings found on nVidia forum. GREAT product!
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Re: Nvidia 3D Vision or Zalman monitor

Post by brewskidafixer »

Hi all i live in Australia and I currently have the nvidia 3d vision with a viewsonic 120hz monitor but I also had a zalmon 22" 3d monitor as well the funny thing is they both died on me.

my viewsonic edid died on it which is a 1 in a million glitch (edid is a chip that sends a signal to your computer telling it what your monitor can do eg name, id, refresh rate, resolution) that may be because of my gts8800 (it hates it) it still worked just no 3d and had to use vga (dvi is needed for 3d).

While I was waiting to get my viewsonic replaced (took 2 months they had to order stock) i bought a zalmon 22" 3d monitor which only lasted 9 days I had 5 dead pixels (got my money back tho), as others have said the monitor screen is many generation behind in tech and I find the screen to be of bad quality eg on a black screen has light in little blobs here and there around the screen.

that aside it did a good job I will say it is works with the most programs including youtube 3d player, nvidia 3d, ddd tridef and iz3d(didn't try iz3d nvidia and tridef were the best).
Its disadvantages were (1.) that SMALL TEXT IS UNREADABLE in 3d (and in the end why i decided to get my money back)
(2.) it is interlaced so half res but get use to it very quickly still small text is crap in 3d
(3.) very small viewing area think of a monitor box but smaller laying flat down (ya head has to always be at the right height you also cant be too far from the monitor a max of about 3 arm lengths ) so if ya want to have people watch it with you ya have to sit in a tight triangle eg first 3 bowling pins. so not very comfortable.
(4.)5ms so for fast game can be quite bad but in most cases ok.
(5.)ready to go and do 3d out of the box and includes it own player and software as well as recommending other software .

advantages (1.) supports many third party software including tridef which is awesome cost $50 tho but convert 2d videos to 3d in realtime and works with a lot of unsupported 3d games (can even make 2d games 3d) was so fun watching everything in 3d (i miss that now coz nvidia 3d vision is not supported (shutter glasses) but might be soon because of new driver features that are coming http://3dvision-blog.com/what-new-featu ... on-owners/)
(2.)can do 3d in windows dose not require supported full screen apps (eg youtube in browser and tridef windowed and some games)
(3.) less straining on the eye then nvidia shutter glasses (tho ya get use to it also ya should be having a short brake if so which is what ya meant to do)

viewsonic vx2268wm 120hz 22" 3d monitor :woot :newshutter :shutter
advantages (1.) high quality screen with high contrast and brightness
(2.)full resolution and text crystal clear
(3.)2ms and very good overall a lot of reviews have marked this as an very very good 2d monitor
(4.)can control the depth with the wheel on the back of the shutter control box of the nvidia 3d shutter glasses
(5.) VERY VERY LARGE VIEWING ANGLE mostly the same and any other 2d display 160 degrees also near any distance so eg i watch moves from the other side of the my room on my bed (also one of the reason i kept it).
(6.)with a refresh rate of 120 is great when using 2d makes everything smooth (if ya have fast enough hardware)

disadvantages (1.) dose not suppport anything but nvidia 3d vision at the moment more support may come with future diver update
(2.)needs to be full resolution (1680x1050) screen app aka game or supported full screen shutter glasses supported programs but will be fixed with this future update http://3dvision-blog.com/what-new-featu ... on-owners/
(3.) monitor position not very adjustable, only the tilt no height adjustment.
(4.) there is some flicker but very rare and overall 1 flick in a split second so not that bad its to do with room lighting can be fixed tho
(5.) this is the only major problem with the viewsonic and nvidia 3d vision that could all be to do with my gts8800 (which i think it is) is the transition from 2d and 3d can be very buggy at times along with the 3d player from nvidia which is poop really poop (no in 3d ui so to do and action apart from pause play and stop ya have to exit 3d to the windowed mode to skip and stuff) but dose the job and interfaces with all codecs and has nearly all view type media formats
(6.) dose not support tridef yet so not awesome 2d to 3d realtime conversion :( but there is the 3Dfier Realtime 2D to 3D Conversion Directshow Filter http://3dfier.blogspot.com/ which is ok some say it dose more accurate result but i find it stutters (might be my hardware again) and dose not come out of the screen like tridef so not very noticeable but is there and still improves the viewing experience.
(7.)only 120hz refresh rate at 1680x1080 but that is native resolution and should really only be used at that resolution.

I got the zalmon for $480aud and the viewsonic for $420 plus $270 for the nvidia 3d vision kit (shutter glasses + control box).

overall price aside they were both great with the viewsonic being an overall high quality monitor I just wish the viewsonic and nvidia 3d vision had more support for third party programs which will come in time. and as others have said wait if ya can i rushed and suffered there is no standered yet and i really want a full resolution polarized monitor with a decent viewing angle but they just are not out yet(unless use projectors but $$$$).

let me know if there is anything else any of you would like to know and please tell me of any other programs that work with nvidia 3d vision
ps if real can convert normal lcd to 3d with micro film that goes over the tv check it out http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fFIeQNseEsI i wish i could find more about it
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Re: Nvidia 3D Vision or Zalman monitor

Post by Likay »

To work the micropolarizer needs to exactly match the pixels of the monitor. There are quite a few different monitorsets "out there" with different pixelations (even similar models) so they need to build a huge database of pixelations of monitors. Sheets could be made on demand i guess so there wouldn't be any need for storage. Alignment is also very precise but shouldn't cause any problems i think. Just make similar to sunfilm that you apply to car windows using a tiny amount soapwater.
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Re: Nvidia 3D Vision or Zalman monitor

Post by cybereality »

Its nice to hear a comparison from someone who has tried both. Pretty much what I expected, but I happen to like the Zalman a lot. Although I am planning on upgrading to 3D Vision when the 27" monitor hits the streets.
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Re: Nvidia 3D Vision or Zalman monitor

Post by bartlomiej »

I've got a question. I discovered that my new video card (Radeon 4890) has a deinterlacing function. Does it remove the lines from the interlacing method in 3d mode or does it disable 3d at all? I didn't like the Zalman because of this lines.
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Re: Nvidia 3D Vision or Zalman monitor

Post by Likay »

Edit (Thanks Blackshark) ;)
The lines you see is because one eye only sees the odd lines and the other only the even lines. This is the way 3d is generated and can't be avoided. As Blackshark says interlacing filters only applies for videos. If theoretically a "deinterlacing" filter is applied to stereogaming on the zalman it would give different phenomenas depending on how the filter algorithm works but in all cases it would mess up the 3d.
Last edited by Likay on Tue Mar 02, 2010 10:15 am, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Nvidia 3D Vision or Zalman monitor

Post by BlackShark »

You got confused with the term "interlacing".

Video interlacing traditionally associated with the video compression technique that interlaces two fields coming from pictures taken at different times. This interlacing has nothing to do with stereo3D or with the Xpol filter (used by the Zalman monitor).

In order to try and avoid confusion, keep the word "interlaciong" for the video compression domain, and use the expression "line interleave" to describe the Xpol filter input.
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Re: Nvidia 3D Vision or Zalman monitor

Post by Likay »

Just trying to make things easy. Everybody knows what interlacing is but almot nobody knows what interleaving is. At least not when associating to screenformats/funtions. A quick search for interleaving doesn't make me any wiser.
Interlacing just felt the right thing to say when explaining. I'll look it up.
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Re: Nvidia 3D Vision or Zalman monitor

Post by BlackShark »

To interleave and to interlace are almost synonyms. But when talking about video, the word "interlacing" is already used and widely known among TV/computer enthusiasts. since what happens with the Zalman monitor is a different phenomenon, you have to use a different word in order to make sure the guy you're talking to does not mix up with interlacing.

You can find the word in the file format .avi (audio video interleave) for example.
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Re: Nvidia 3D Vision or Zalman monitor

Post by DmitryKo »

Interlacing can be described as temporal line interleaving.

In Zalman monitor, it's strictly spatial line interleaving, and it does not even support interlaced video signal, so this is not a correct term to to use.
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