What will CV1 be like?

[ripcurl123]

we will be getting the dk2 in july sometime (cough cough)
Im wondering how much better will it be compared to dk2 ,dk2 has amoled 1080p screen with low latency and positional tracking, which is great and ive ordered one. 4k just isnt viable at the moment so on that basis.

I think cv1 will have 2k screen
wider fov maybe 130 degrees
manually adjustable ipd as well as software ipd
positional tracking ,low latency
lighter in weight
be out 3 months after dk2

Thats what I think what do you guys think?

Ripcurl

[mr.uu]

Release this December, ready for Christmas...
1440 or 1600p, so >3k (btw., DK2 has 2k and Palmer said CV1 should have higher resolution...)
Same FOV 110deg diagonal. (more FOV to come in CV2 end 2015 with an $299 dual screen version...)
Better optics, adjustable IPD. (lets see what DK2 has in that regard...)
Optical tracking, clip on cameras for AR and some new input (hand) devices using the IR cam, too...
$199.- pricepoint - thank you Facebook (the ONLY thing Facebook is GOOD FOR, imho...)

[squibbfire]

I have a feeling ck1 will take a while longer probably 2015...didn't they say they wanted some content out for it first?

[colocolo]

I have a feeling ck1 will take a while longer probably 2015...didn't they say they wanted some content out for it first?

Probably there are going to be like 5 -10 important engine titles out there by november(CV1 release) that are already in development. Other titles will follow in 2015.
I still haven't forgotten the phrase '2014 is going to be a great year for VR'.

[Leahy]

I'd say that they probably could release some of the first several thousand CV1s in 2014 but I bet they will just prefer to avoid the clusterfuck of everyone comparing order numbers, feeling jealous when others get theirs for christmas and so forth. So I figure they'll wait until a hefty number are already produced before anyone but the most important developers get one with an NDA. Since it'll be a consumer release they likely will have contracts with Best Buy, Fry's, who knows?

[Dilip]

May be Like this??

[Dilip]

we will be getting the dk2 in july sometime (cough cough)
Im wondering how much better will it be compared to dk2 ,dk2 has amoled 1080p screen with low latency and positional tracking, which is great and ive ordered one. 4k just isnt viable at the moment so on that basis.

I think cv1 will have 2k screen
wider fov maybe 130 degrees
manually adjustable ipd as well as software ipd
positional tracking ,low latency
lighter in weight
be out 3 months after dk2

Thats what I think what do you guys think?

Ripcurl

What i guess is

-2560X1440 OLED Low persistence Screen
-95~100 Degree Horizontal FOV to reduce Pixelation maybe 90 Degree
-manually adjustable ipd as well as software ipd
-positional tracking ,low latency
-lighter in weight
-Smaller Sleeker Profile with Flip-up/flip-Down style screen box like Project Morpheus
-be out on CHRISTMAS 2014

[squibbfire]

I would imagine that they will still be selling this on their website...I really can't see them sending shipments of these to a walmart or best buy just yet...I doubt many people have a computer or laptop that can do advanced higher then 1080 res graphics.

[squibbfire]

Which rift titles do you think will be available in 2014? Are they going to be full blown games or just short games like lunar flight and asunder?

I haven't heard any major AAA titles coming. (i dont know if you would include minecraft in that) But like I mentioned in earlier posts...the rift will have to be already available to consumers by then for AAA companies to consider developing for it yet.

I would love for a nice juicy rift enabled Half Life 3 announcement!

[Dilip]

Selling will more likely to be online only and it has its merits too.here in country like India where online sell was impractical moto g has set records with flipkart.com. I think its best model. Should they partner Amazon and newegg. Regarding AAA titles its high time they can develop their own. May be few secret titles can be work in progrss who knows.

[squibbfire]

I agree...It would be awesome for oculus to be hatching their own AAA title....to bundle with the CV1 rift!!

[Dilip]

AAA game Developed in house yes, bundle with Cv1 - I strongly doubt. They may bundle small tech demoes, but you can't expect AAA games to be bundled. If they sell at normal price like around
30 dollars for a AAA title I am still in.

[squibbfire]

i would imagine any games backed by oculus and facebook would be considered AAA:-)

[colocolo]

I would bet that we'll see Primal Genesis (UE4) with launch since they have partnered up with OVR very early.
Star Citizen is coming this year,not?
Also EVE VR can be considered as an exclusiv VR title.
Hawken, though i dont consider it AAA. But very nice.
Routine.
Project C.A.R.S. Also for Sony morpheus. Reset? Theory interactive.
Gallery.
I could imagine that bigger developers are involved ambitiously in some serious projects.
5 launch titles must be a minimum for 2014 not?
How many had PS1 ?
Killzone Shadowfall would be badass, but that's just daydreaming.....

[ripcurl123]

we will be getting the dk2 in july sometime (cough cough)
Im wondering how much better will it be compared to dk2 ,dk2 has amoled 1080p screen with low latency and positional tracking, which is great and ive ordered one. 4k just isnt viable at the moment so on that basis.

I think cv1 will have 2k screen
wider fov maybe 130 degrees
manually adjustable ipd as well as software ipd
positional tracking ,low latency
lighter in weight
be out 3 months after dk2

Thats what I think what do you guys think?

Ripcurl

What i guess is

-2560X1440 OLED Low persistence Screen
-95~100 Degree Horizontal FOV to reduce Pixelation maybe 90 Degree
-manually adjustable ipd as well as software ipd
-positional tracking ,low latency
-lighter in weight
-Smaller Sleeker Profile with Flip-up/flip-Down style screen box like Project Morpheus
-be out on CHRISTMAS 2014

thats more or less what I think other than with higher resolution must come higher fov surely

Ripcurl

[Dilip]

Yes but high resolution doesn't necessarily higher FOV. And higher fov induces higher screen door so going too high on Fov. Is not really a smart move unless you afford enormus processing power that's require for 8k screen. I believe 95 or100 degree horizontal is suffice for now if it can give tight packed screen door free image.

[miodrag]

with better optics they could use bigger % of screen so we could have higher FOV, and if they put some custom screen with 2:1 ratio that could use max percentage of pixels

[3trip]

Drivers & title support, they can afford to make VR drivers for many games unwilling to do so themselves.

[miodrag]

http://m.gsmarena.com/auo_makes_highest ... s-8259.php this would be good screen for CV1

[squibbfire]

http://m.gsmarena.com/auo_makes_highest ... s-8259.php this would be good screen for CV1

How fast is it? Low persistence?

[equusvenustas]

http://m.gsmarena.com/auo_makes_highest ... s-8259.php this would be good screen for CV1

How fast is it? Low persistence?

I dont think there is too much problem about persistence with almost any AMOLED display, leds can be turned on and off in nanoseconds and AMOLEDS if recall correctly in some tens of microseconds, unlike LCD's they dont need time to turn the molecules of liquid glass to change the polarization, but i dont know more than that so i could be wrong and in fact be slow.

[Endothermic]

Don't confuse response time with low persistence, they are not the same thing.

Pretty much every light boost (low persistence) monitor is a TN LCD panel so response time is a lot slower (milliseconds) compared to OLED/AMOLED (microseconds) but the stobing back lighting makes them low persistence and they are basically blur free when following motion.

An AMOLED display isn't low persistence if it isn't also strobed and will display blur when following motion just the same as an LCD that isn't low persistence. Just look at the Sony HMZ or the range of AMOLED phones etc which have blur just like LCDs.

[3trip]

Don't confuse response time with low persistence, they are not the same thing.

Pretty much every light boost (low persistence) monitor is a TN LCD panel so response time is a lot slower (milliseconds) compared to OLED/AMOLED (microseconds) but the stobing back lighting makes them low persistence and they are basically blur free when following motion.

An AMOLED display isn't low persistence if it isn't also strobed and will display blur when following motion just the same as an LCD that isn't low persistence. Just look at the Sony HMZ or the range of AMOLED phones etc which have blur just like LCDs.

So any screen can be low persistence if strobed.

[zalo]

A fellow on reddit got very particular when I tried to say that. He said you need the response time of OLEDs to get low persistence in the Oculus sense. LCDs (because of pixel response time) would have nearly a full frame of latency.

Of course, this is something we can use prediction for (up to 50ms of it before it gets noticeable).

[equusvenustas]

Don't confuse response time with low persistence, they are not the same thing.

Pretty much every light boost (low persistence) monitor is a TN LCD panel so response time is a lot slower (milliseconds) compared to OLED/AMOLED (microseconds) but the stobing back lighting makes them low persistence and they are basically blur free when following motion.

An AMOLED display isn't low persistence if it isn't also strobed and will display blur when following motion just the same as an LCD that isn't low persistence. Just look at the Sony HMZ or the range of AMOLED phones etc which have blur just like LCDs.

Yes i know that, but i think response time and low persistence go hand to hand because you cant have low persistence if the response time of your screen is at its close to its limits when you are doing low persistence at 60 FPS, the minimun considered acceptable for VR so i think the biggest problem if really you cant push it its the controller of the screen because they are designed for portable devices witch they dont need low persistence or be able to display ludicrous FPS.

[colocolo]

Galaxy S5 got a 1080p panel.....

[Dilip]

whopping powerful JETSON TK1

https://developer.nvidia.com/jetson-tk1

192 USD is high though....may be bulk order could bring pricing down,
its full blown miniaturized PC.

A wish device for RIFT....

[Endothermic]

Yes i know that, but i think response time and low persistence go hand to hand because you cant have low persistence if the response time of your screen is at its close to its limits when you are doing low persistence at 60 FPS, the minimun considered acceptable for VR so i think the biggest problem if really you cant push it its the controller of the screen because they are designed for portable devices witch they dont need low persistence or be able to display ludicrous FPS.

Of course response time and low persistence go hand in hand (since you need a fast response time for low persistence to be any good otherwise you just see blur from the response time instead), but you can have low persistence no matter how slow the response time is (just means it wont really be of any benefit) because with sample-and-hold displays the response time does not effect the persistence of the dsiplay.

Response time is how quickly the pixels change from one colour to another while persistence is how long the pixels are actually lit/visible/displayed for. For a sample-and-hold display the response time has no effect on how long the pixels are lit for which is why they need to be strobed to be low persistence.

The point was you were saying there wasn't much problem with persistence on any AMOLED screen because of their fast response time compared to LCD, which isn't true because AMOLED (current ones anyway) screens are still sample-and-hold displays so their fast response time doesn't have anything to do with their persistence, if the AMOLED isn't stroved it isn't low persistence.

For example if you had some horrible LCD with a 50ms response time it obviously would look horrible since the pixels can't even change quick enough to keep up with the refresh rate, but if the display was strobed so the pixels were only lit for a very short time, then as awful as it would look, it would be a low persistence display.

While if you had a magic LCD (or OLED) display with a 1ns (there are 1 million nanoseconds in a millisecond) response time but it was not strobed, then as fast as its response time is it is still a full persistence display and will show motion blur due to persistence even though the pixels change almost instantly.

[equusvenustas]

Yes i know that, but i think response time and low persistence go hand to hand because you cant have low persistence if the response time of your screen is at its close to its limits when you are doing low persistence at 60 FPS, the minimun considered acceptable for VR so i think the biggest problem if really you cant push it its the controller of the screen because they are designed for portable devices witch they dont need low persistence or be able to display ludicrous FPS.

Of course response time and low persistence go hand in hand (since you need a fast response time for low persistence to be any good otherwise you just see blur from the response time instead), but you can have low persistence no matter how slow the response time is (just means it wont really be of any benefit) because with sample-and-hold displays the response time does not effect the persistence of the dsiplay.

Response time is how quickly the pixels change from one colour to another while persistence is how long the pixels are actually lit/visible/displayed for. For a sample-and-hold display the response time has no effect on how long the pixels are lit for which is why they need to be strobed to be low persistence.

The point was you were saying there wasn't much problem with persistence on any AMOLED screen because of their fast response time compared to LCD, which isn't true because AMOLED (current ones anyway) screens are still sample-and-hold displays so their fast response time doesn't have anything to do with their persistence, if the AMOLED isn't stroved it isn't low persistence.

For example if you had some horrible LCD with a 50ms response time it obviously would look horrible since the pixels can't even change quick enough to keep up with the refresh rate, but if the display was strobed so the pixels were only lit for a very short time, then as awful as it would look, it would be a low persistence display.

While if you had a magic LCD (or OLED) display with a 1ns (there are 1 million nanoseconds in a millisecond) response time but it was not strobed, then as fast as its response time is it is still a full persistence display and will show motion blur due to persistence even though the pixels change almost instantly.

I stated earlier almost any AMOLED display can have low persistence as long the driver is capable of doing it, in my first post i didn't take in account the driver, and yes because these screens include their own drivers we don't know if it can do low persistence so yea you are right if you take in account the driver, but the display itself is not a limitation AMOLED/OLED pixels can have response times of tens of microseconds and non organic LED's as much as 10,000,000-40,000,000 fs (there are 1e29 tp in a femtosecond).