$99 wireless RiFt competitor uses Gear VR path

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$99 wireless RiFt competitor uses Gear VR path

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Re: $99 wireless RiFt competitor uses Gear VR path

Post by metronome »

Interesting, looks very sleak, how do you think this compares to something like this?

https://www.chinavasion.com/china/whole ... martphone/

or even Durovis Dive?

Ok I had a look at it; seems quite bulky and heavily reliant on tri def and splashtop :S

One thing though, this sort of thing uses mouse emultion, where as oculus have a lot of support they will be able to seperate out and code specifically for head motion and gun motion separately...
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Re: $99 wireless RiFt competitor uses Gear VR path

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Its more a gear VR competition then rift.
$99 cheap + most people do have good mobiles.
Interesting small iinvestment, easily considered over durovis dive.
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Re: $99 wireless RiFt competitor uses Gear VR path

Post by metronome »

I decided to go with the colorcross..
http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Head-Mou ... 45475.html

I don't think these phone HMD's work any better than any other...

Possibly grabbing a tegra4 phone for low latency on limelight eg 4ms instead of 45ms on snapdragon... but theres only one phone on the market and its only 720p (Wilko wax)

The gear VR is flawed because its not tegra based, even its does have a nice OLED UHD screen, its decoder latency will let it down for PC game streaming.
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Re: $99 wireless RiFt competitor uses Gear VR path

Post by Hannibalj2 »

metronome wrote:I decided to go with the colorcross..
http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Head-Mou ... 45475.html

I don't think these phone HMD's work any better than any other...

Possibly grabbing a tegra4 phone for low latency on limelight eg 4ms instead of 45ms on snapdragon... but theres only one phone on the market and its only 720p (Wilko wax)

The gear VR is flawed because its not tegra based, even its does have a nice OLED UHD screen, its decoder latency will let it down for PC game streaming.

The Gear VR is Flawed? It can do 2Oms latency thanks to Carmack having access to the hardware. The current best mobile solution on the market. What is the latency of the Tegra?
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Re: $99 wireless RiFt competitor uses Gear VR path

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Hannibalj2 wrote:
metronome wrote:I decided to go with the colorcross..
http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Head-Mou ... 45475.html

I don't think these phone HMD's work any better than any other...

Possibly grabbing a tegra4 phone for low latency on limelight eg 4ms instead of 45ms on snapdragon... but theres only one phone on the market and its only 720p (Wilko wax)

The gear VR is flawed because its not tegra based, even its does have a nice OLED UHD screen, its decoder latency will let it down for PC game streaming.

The Gear VR is Flawed? It can do 2Oms latency thanks to Carmack having access to the hardware. The current best mobile solution on the market. What is the latency of the Tegra?

Not sure if it's the same kind of latency but on XDA limelight, tegra devices have a decoder latency of 4ms instead of around 45ms for snapdragons....
also apparently Carmack actually has alot of problems getting access to the samsung hardware in his interviews he mentions the hardware teams are very reluctant to listen to his ideas... where as the software teams listen to everything...
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Re: $99 wireless RiFt competitor uses Gear VR path

Post by Hannibalj2 »

I think Carmack was just telling the story when he was dealing with Samsung. Samsung will likely not use tegra any time soon. They are investing on their own Exynos.

Currently the best option as far performance on a mobile device will be the Gear. Low latency, low persistence, touch pad for interactivity and Oculus tracker chip. Another aspect is the content, developers are given requirements to follow so they can meet 6O FPS.

There is a bunch of Cellphone cases that are been released or going to. One problem is fragmentation. The other is that trackers on cellphones still not fast enough. Graphical lag can be attain by varying factors, but ultimately the result will be inferior experience, some to the point of wanting to vomit.

We will have to see how Qualcom, PowerVR, Mali next generations will handle the Nvidia Challenge.

There is no doubt that Nvidia's Soc is the best performer. Still power hungry, although the new Maxwell iteration will be interesting to see.
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Re: $99 wireless RiFt competitor uses Gear VR path

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Tbh I think that anything that isn't dirt cheap (ie colorcross) or a consumer oculus is worth looking at;
Anything else its just too much money for not a fully developed prodcut that won't have the software support from game devs...

I'm actually surprised Nvidia haven't brought out their own GearVR type thing, they already have the mobile tegra soc's, they have game streaming, and hefty gfx cards to drive it all. Plus with their new focus on making VR easier and more open they would be an interesting bet, they've effectively already created the mobile VR eco-system....


I don't get what anyone would actually use GearVR for? random sammy demos and the odd mobile game, it won't be able to stream PC games and using any third party software like limelight places you firmly back in needing a tegra soc video decoder camp...

Unfortuantely the only phone out that uses tegra is the Xiaomi Mi3 TD Tegra which are almost impossible to find.
http://www.allgain.co.uk/xiaomi-mi-3-16 ... oChv_w_wcB



So basically Id love to know how the experiance comapres with ColorCross & Mi3 Tegra VS GearVR & Note4 for pc gaming...
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Re: $99 wireless RiFt competitor uses Gear VR path

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These are slight expensive

http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Cool-Pro ... 85993.html

But K9 coating on lenses do worth it.
More neat crafted then color cross. Optics too appear to be slightly larger.
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Re: $99 wireless RiFt competitor uses Gear VR path

Post by Dilip »

On a side thought......

Is there anything like 'Reverse MHL' I mean can computer HDMI output be feeded to mobile screen via MHL by any means of Hacking.
That could be super cool latency free thing.

I think For those chips which are on drawing board, (Snapdragon 905 ;) ) manufacturers must consider 'Reverse MHL' or any way to allow mobile to have input
rather just output. World would be more perfect place this way, isn't it? Splash tops are just CRAPPY SLOW.
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Re: $99 wireless RiFt competitor uses Gear VR path

Post by metronome »

You can run Trinus Gyre over USB connection, not native HDMI put its a step from wireless somewhat...
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Re: $99 wireless RiFt competitor uses Gear VR path

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Tried Rift DK2 and Blown away by presence.
Sadly though Now i Strongly Believe 8K is point where picture quality can compare with your 1080P monitor, that will suck dry GTX 970 in Three way SLI :o

Though slight less FoV color cross kind cardboard gives more crisp picture.....Am i sound ODD trust me it do look pixel packed when i tried
Xperia SP with this..
http://www.aliexpress.com/item/PU-water ... 66854.html

Quality is Really good it do look crisp with Xperia SP (4.7 Inch 1080p Bravia Engine)

FoV is slightly less but screen quality i would say 5 times better but presence wise and scale wise rift was better but its
too ufair to compare something $350 to $12.

I will post pictures in a day or two.
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Re: $99 wireless RiFt competitor uses Gear VR path

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can trinus gyre feed video over usb?
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Re: $99 wireless RiFt competitor uses Gear VR path

Post by metronome »

8K!? Cinemas barely have that these days lol let alone a VR set....

That does actually look like a very nifty version, I actually quite like the look of that one, amazing as these clones are, they aren't bulky at all, they just need to head straps

Reminds me of the alu version that still hasnt launched yet...

https://www.shoplocket.com/products/yZy ... uminum-kit

But im excited to try out my G2 when my colorcross arrives, its insane though, I think these mobile VRs had totally leap frogged things like Vuzix HMD's etc..

Btw how did you reach the 8K descision? I remember M$ tried to do 12K gaming but it blew the PSU after 45mins...


Yes trinus gyre does do 3d video over USB... I actually have a usb hub running to my sofa so I can plug in phones and glasses and things :P

http://oddsheepgames.com/?page_id=134
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Re: $99 wireless RiFt competitor uses Gear VR path

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8K decision is just cause even at 1080P Dk2 screen is heavily pixeleted when you see any thing that's far. for example in demo of Tuscany i could see building good but the moment i seen sky and mountains that are at good distance, seen from sea side of Villa and all surrounding it looked like just seeing through net.

Now i can guess how that DK1 could be? if DK2 is this.

Indeed pixelation felt bad to me.

Not blaming DK2 its AWESOME in terms of Positional Tracking and Head Tracking JUST SUPER CRAZY ACCURATE.
As i mentioned i did felt my self ported to that Villa

Don't mind pixelation ruined illusion once i reached back of villa sea side.

That said FoV is nothing Like anything. They are doing so much magnification which ends up here. Whats bad in sacrificing little on enlargement while using bigger screen at slight near focus?
Just a thought.

I would again say that $12 Cardboard and 720P Xperia SP a Lot Crisper then 1080P Rift DK2 for visuals. Tracking was also not bad for what it was just in phone sensors
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Re: $99 wireless RiFt competitor uses Gear VR path

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Would be interesting to see what you think about an LG G3 with its 2560 x 1440 QHD display
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Re: $99 wireless RiFt competitor uses Gear VR path

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I already made a thread for that.....

http://www.mtbs3d.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?f=140&t=19970

People were interested in Rift Only :?
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Re: $99 wireless RiFt competitor uses Gear VR path

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You tell all as you already own G3, besides you are planning that adepter too.
But have you experienced DK2 unless you cant compare that's for sure.
I will post photos tomorrow in this thread only that i have tried all that i am talking about :)
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Re: $99 wireless RiFt competitor uses Gear VR path

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Nooo I dont have a G3 just the G2, I can't afford it but when I tried it in the shop I don't like how big a phone it is...
Btw have you seen this Android gaming streamer thats on KS?

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/sh ... alit/posts

Looks pretty good in the video update... Might as well back it because I won't loose anything if no one else does :D
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Re: $99 wireless RiFt competitor uses Gear VR path

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Re: $99 wireless RiFt competitor uses Gear VR path

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As i posted Earlier Here these goes. As i said i am posting after experiencing.

To me Cardbord and Experia SP was more crisp experience and Tracking was also Decent. I would say Decent not bad
Tried Tuscany on Both.

Rift one do look big but not crisp.... So i think CV1 i would like 4K not 1440p and ideally 8K
For which there is no processing power at least for 2015 games like Witcher3 :P .

So guys either reduce magnification or find way to upscale image or say print 1 image pixel data (Output Image pixel) over 4 physical pixel..

What ever, Current DK2 is Excellent in Tracking and Positional but BAD VISUALLY.
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Re: $99 wireless RiFt competitor uses Gear VR path

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Did i Nuked MTBS..............? :lol:
Where are all......?
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Re: $99 wireless RiFt competitor uses Gear VR path

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What is the 2nd one??
I saw it here as well but not sure exactly what it is :S
http://www.aliexpress.com/item/2014-Uni ... 79797.html

http://mojing.baofeng.com/

This does look the best designed i reckon, but no idea what the specs are
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Re: $99 wireless RiFt competitor uses Gear VR path

Post by Hannibalj2 »

Is just another form factor, but it includes a controller. But it isn't a motion controller, just that it has the shape.
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Re: $99 wireless RiFt competitor uses Gear VR path

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Ha Yeh I got those zeemotes already they cost like $6 off ebay
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Re: $99 wireless RiFt competitor uses Gear VR path

Post by Hannibalj2 »

Yup, although it would be cool if it worked like the Razer Hydra.
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Re: $99 wireless RiFt competitor uses Gear VR path

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Being expensive as $350 still visual fidelity wise Rift was really bad. Needed much resolution boost. Amazingly cardboard clone outshines rift for display 1:10. Oculus really need work around. Don't no why people sing praise visuals are out right bad.
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Re: $99 wireless RiFt competitor uses Gear VR path

Post by Hannibalj2 »

Well, I think I can give you a response for that.

I large portion of DK2 users where Dk1 users. Going from DK1 to 2 is a big step up, hence the good reviews. Many Rift users don't use phone cases for VR, and would they, the experience will be always worse. That means that the majority haven't had the chance to observe the resolution difference.

Now, you do understand that a Phone WILL make you sick after a while due to the latency and and other issues dealing with Android OS. All in all if a user owns a rift, there is no reason to go phone base unless is the Gear VR (at least for now), which brings Rift low latency, low persistence and quad HD. The current gen of Phones are powerful with great displays, but the display is only a factor if all other aspect that make VR are tackled. Right now resolution is the main benefit.

Also many people know that the Rifts Amoled display do not show ALL the RGB pixels due to the way Amoleds were designed. But Amoleds compensate from having a higher pixel switching time which is imperative for VR and reducing more latency.

The Gear VR is using 2560x1440 display, that will be the minimum for CV1. This means that the Rift is already addressing this.
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Re: $99 wireless RiFt competitor uses Gear VR path

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I am also positive same as you, that's why specifically written 'Visuals' nothing else.
As no complain for head tracking or positional tracking of DK2, both are beyond any complains.

There is latency in Android and limitation of processing power. Still i did enjoyed TUSCANY DIVE for android with Xperia SP which is mediocre hardware for such processing.(Xiaomi MI4 is my next mobile dedicated within reach buy for cardboard due to full HD screen and Snapdragon 805) It played nearly flawless for head-tracking unless slight mobile heating up issue. Texture were crisp and in villa 'Fireplace' was as cool as it was in RIFT, though candles were having flame below them (bug) :lol: . Sure sense of scale little less due to FOV limitation quality of display WoWed.

https://play.google.com/store/apps/deta ... uscanyDive

My question is whats wrong in reducing little FOV in favor of better graphics till we don't reach there. Compared to postponing release and waiting for technology to pickup missing pieces of puzzle ( 4K/8K Screens and processing power within reach).

Also learned movie theater thing is just crap at DK2 level, i also don't have any hopes before rift display cross 4K. Even at 4K things will look bad as most of the 'PIXELS' getting wasted in building virtual environment around you (movie plays hardly on 320X240 that's CRT Tv quality of 80's) apart from corners getting wasted while rift does spherical distortion practically you are wasting 4 small and two big triangles of screen area and not using every bit of display real estate.

For movie also i find Mobile and Cardboard Clone much better with this app
https://play.google.com/store/apps/deta ... m.pps.mo3d
Plays movie without eating up any screen real estate in building virtual theater.

You will say even RIFT can do this with this type of APP. True but display at this (Rift) magnification feels bad.

For movie and Media consumption i think AVEGANT GLYPH will shine due to many positive aspects. I am also closely observing development of CAST AR
their particular 'AR/VR CLIP-ONs' interests me as.....

1) It Do not require distortion corrections. Any Standard SBS out put middle ware will work out of box, No special game building required.
2) 720P Picos don't want SUPER HARDWARE to drive them. Even my GTX660 gives 70+ FPS in TombRaider 2014 at 720p with medium settings.
3) Projection likely to be screen-door free.
4) Over all non obtrusive design and going to be 1/3 weight due to lighter design.
5) Very easy to put on put off no head clutches.

Due to some Unknown reasons its still under the shadow. :P

On the other hand RIFT content is very very sparse at present, Ok these are DK2 not CV and most content is still in dev cycle. VREIO is really POWER HUNGRY even at such low resolution of DK2 things were Utter messy and head tracking was AWFUL in SKYRIM. There is no point in complaining being them free.

I am still in trial and error phase with DK2, but content on Android devices appear to be more friendlier. Talking about native apps
still not try Splashtop or Trynus Gyre but many said its flaws, How is their implementation of video over USB?
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Re: $99 wireless RiFt competitor uses Gear VR path

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Don't want to post this everywhere but... do we know of electronics to drive this LG screen?
I can grab a genuine (LG G3 screen) part for about £100 (not bad) and already have built some tracking that's up in the realms of Occulus territory (using an MPU-9150 + arduino pro micro - aka "ED Tracker"). What's needed to drive this though?

If someone can point me at electronics to drive it (I'm digging through threads here but it's kinda slow going as there's no easy terms to search for so I'm still hunting random promising looking threads for further search terms) I can try and get one of these mounted.
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Re: $99 wireless RiFt competitor uses Gear VR path

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G3 display is RGB thus 80% more pixel density at 2560x1440 and a real upgrade over 1080p rg-bg pentile screen of DK2.

More interesting fact learned note 4 's display though is 2560x1440 still its just 20% more pixel packed compare to true RGB 1080p led panel, and not so significant upgrade even from note3 pentile panel owing to fact that its pentile so not that high amount of pixel increased overall.

This makes true player gear's vrvana totem more edgy product as they are claiming RGB OLED 1080p panel for their HMD. Though they couldn't get display as of writing this. But when it come will be on par with pentile Note 4's display bearing GearVR in terms of visual for understandable reasons.

G3 display is indeed amazing for DiYs, if any driving board available. As screens are easily available and economical too. VR TRAX (gear like adepter planned for LG G3) is still under the veil. Even what kind of additional features it will offer over standerd cardboard is not clear.

Too many IFs and BUTs gives VR Queasiness :?
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Re: $99 wireless RiFt competitor uses Gear VR path

Post by metronome »

I read the consumer rift is meant to be 1080p, which would make sense for how cheap they want to sell it for....

Perhaps the hight rez versions will be reserved for more advanced dev / pro versions...
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Re: $99 wireless RiFt competitor uses Gear VR path

Post by Dilip »

1080p for consumer version is just as DK2 and DK2 is bad visually...

I think may be RGB OLED of some other brand then Samsung could do little better..Still nothing good till 2560X1440
Even that too need to be at little lower magnification then present might look little acceptable..
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Re: $99 wireless RiFt competitor uses Gear VR path

Post by Hannibalj2 »

Dilip wrote:G3 display is RGB thus 80% more pixel density at 2560x1440 and a real upgrade over 1080p rg-bg pentile screen of DK2.

More interesting fact learned note 4 's display though is 2560x1440 still its just 20% more pixel packed compare to true RGB 1080p led panel, and not so significant upgrade even from note3 pentile panel owing to fact that its pentile so not that high amount of pixel increased overall.

This makes true player gear's vrvana totem more edgy product as they are claiming RGB OLED 1080p panel for their HMD. Though they couldn't get display as of writing this. But when it come will be on par with pentile Note 4's display bearing GearVR in terms of visual for umderstable reasons.
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Re: $99 wireless RiFt competitor uses Gear VR path

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Anandtech Samsung Galaxy Note-4 Review wrote: Samsung has equipped the Galaxy Note 4 with their latest generation AMOLED panel, which has a higher resolution 1440p display, although this is achieved with a PenTile subpixel layout that makes total subpixel density lower than a conventional RGB stripe, so true subpixel density increases around 20% when compared to an RGB stripe 1080p panel.
http://www.anandtech.com/show/8613/the- ... 4-review/4

Here is Why.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/8169/the-lg-g3-review/2

G3's display is INDEED RGB 2560X1440 and BOUND TO BE BETTER THAN PENTILE OF NOTE 4 @2560X1440.
NOTE 4 HAVING TRULY LESS PIXEL DENSITY COMPARED TO G3.
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Re: $99 wireless RiFt competitor uses Gear VR path

Post by Hannibalj2 »

Dilip wrote:
Anandtech Samsung Galaxy Note-4 Review wrote: Samsung has equipped the Galaxy Note 4 with their latest generation AMOLED panel, which has a higher resolution 1440p display, although this is achieved with a PenTile subpixel layout that makes total subpixel density lower than a conventional RGB stripe, so true subpixel density increases around 20% when compared to an RGB stripe 1080p panel.
http://www.anandtech.com/show/8613/the- ... 4-review/4

Here is Why.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/8169/the-lg-g3-review/2

G3's display is INDEED RGB 2560X1440 and BOUND TO BE BETTER THAN PENTILE OF NOTE 4 @2560X1440.
NOTE 4 HAVING TRULY LESS PIXEL DENSITY COMPARED TO G3.
Yes, this is well known already. The colors of the Samsung display are more pleasing and have greater response time.

In practice the 1440p looks really good, I have a Note 4. Do you see pixles, yes. Does it bother, not really, because it feel almost like film texture. Considerably better than the DK2.

The LG3 is good, but performance wise the Super Amoled should do better even though LG3 may mitigate the screen door marginally better.
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Re: $99 wireless RiFt competitor uses Gear VR path

Post by Dilip »

Do u love Samsung?
I too were.......


Then i chosen red pill.
World just changed from that moment.
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Re: $99 wireless RiFt competitor uses Gear VR path

Post by Hannibalj2 »

Dilip wrote:Do u love Samsung?
I too were.......


Then i chosen red pill.
World just changed from that moment.
Do I love Samsung? Not particular

I respect they have balls to take initiative about innovation
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Dilip
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Re: $99 wireless RiFt competitor uses Gear VR path

Post by Dilip »

Rather a forced one, considering Samsung market share declining day by day
innovation some time is only chance for survival.
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Hannibalj2
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Re: $99 wireless RiFt competitor uses Gear VR path

Post by Hannibalj2 »

Dilip wrote:Rather a forced one, considering Samsung market share declining day by day
innovation some time is only chance for survival.

That's an opinion vs another one. Samsung in known for taking bold moves.
Portal Dual 180+ HFOV HMD: http://www.mtbs3d.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=18335

PORTAL DUAL VR, Downloads: http://hannibalj2.jimdo.com/
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