As you spoke earlier about a FOV comparison:

can you do something like that:
2nd picture on the text:

http://trackingreality.com/2012/02/14/h ... nceptions/

As its easy understandable for people that don't know all the technical terms and formulars if you do it somehow like the others FOV thingies around.

Other nice blogs on this side:
http://trackingreality.com/2012/01/04/h ... s-of-2012/
http://trackingreality.com/2012/02/26/cybersickness/

Hey,
By reading the "A day with an Oculus Rift" Post I got an idea for an Kickstarter bonus:
Maybe Carmack is willing to give vou Autographed Fotos/Cards/whatever.

In my mind that sounds like a nice gimmick ^^

So I won't hijack this thread, but I just wanted to mention that I am attempting to create that stereo driver I've been talking about and plan to add support for this Rift HMD.

Please check my work log thread and continue discussion there if you're interested:
viewtopic.php?f=26&t=14970

Just signed up after clicking a link from the iracing.com forums. What a great idea. I've been looking in to a 3 monitor setup for the past half year and was investigating HMDs + Freetrack a couple of months ago. Really interested to see where this is heading; what a great initiative!

Hey Palmer,

One idea for a Kickstarter reward might be to offer fully-assembled FOV2GO Model D viewers. This is just an estimate, but the price of materials and shipping would probably put it into the middle-tier of rewards (in order for a useful amount to still be contributed to the campaign). Since the design of the Oculus Rift feels like an evolution of the FOV2GO, it seems like the software pipeline for displaying proper 3D images across both would be nearly identical. There might be some genuinely useful (although perhaps niche) overlap there, where people who wanted to support the project but couldn't afford the full HMD can still have part of the experience when and if mobile software that supports the Rift starts appearing. If you're not crazy about the prospect of assembling 25-50 FOV2GOs on top of all of the Rift orders, an option may be to offer kits.

A worthwhile low-tier reward might be a pair of anaglyph glasses. While the image quality isn't awesome, it's at least on-topic, inexpensive, and (again) potentially useful. I know I've never picked any up purely because it's just never been convenient. Someone who is just getting into the scene can access a lot of content (YouTube, 3D Vision, lots of legacy stuff) with a decent basic pair.

Anyway, just some thoughts from a first-time poster. The design of the Rift sounds both fantastic (FOV!) and extremely sensible. Coupled with the proposed price and John's hands-on testimonial, it's very easy to be excited about. I'd certainly like Canabalt HD (and any of our future Android projects, as appropriate) to support it and FOV2GO at some point. I can pretty much guarantee that I'll be picking one up as part of the Kickstarter campaign!

Hey Palmer,

Admittedly I haven't had a lot of time to spend with this due to other work commitments but I did manage to squeeze out a few concepts for you. If you like any of these or if you'd like to discuss it further please give me an e-mail denunger@worldworksgames.com (Subject: Oculus) and I'll send over the high resolution files to you. Or you can contact me during normal business hours via phone or Skype (e-mail for info).

If you don't like what I've done, no hard feelings at all Still wishing you the best of luck with this project and really excited for you!

Cool designs. I especially like the RIFT logo (first one on the top-right).

However the look/feel of the "oculus" seems to be at odds with the "rift". They are very different styles. Anyway, sure Palmer will have more feedback, just my 2 cents.

Oculus looks pretty cool. Like an eyeball

I agree, I think the Oculus is great, not so keen on the Rift tho. As said, they are totally different styles... but the thinner Oculus implies greater clarity imho

There's some juxtaposition there between the logos in terms of line weight and style but its really a pretty common treatment when defining distinct brands. Oculus and Rift need to stand on their own, otherwise they become a jumble of muddy mega-logo...lol. Or at least that's the designer ramble you'll hear out of me

And yay! The eyeball in Oculus is reading for everyone! That makes me happy The line darting through the center is an abstraction of the focal plane and or FOV

Rift went through a lot of iteration but it kept coming back to some kind of human form in the negative space creating the rift. In this case, the head is silhouetted in such a way that it feels like we're looking at the back of someones head as they gaze into a wide panorama of image...again, design ramble

Yes Bishop51,
That is what I thought when I saw the top pictures also.
I thought Oculus was the companys Name/Logo and that RIFT was a product made by that company.
I feel the Oculus Logo would be great to represent the company as a whole and would be printed somwhere on all thier products but then each product would also have it'a own name/model, that would also be printed on the product, in this case the RIFT.
You would print somwhere on the unit in a prominent position,using your artwork "RIFT" Than somwhere else on the unit, still using your art work but printed smaller " By Oculus"

Is that what you mean Bishop51 ?

My 2 cents. The Oculus symbol has a nice clean look. At first glance it simply looks like a unique font instead of a picture. Also the O is distinctive and symmetrical and would work as a desktop icon. The Rift is a bit too pictorial and literal for my tastes. I think just a slick font (maybe continuing the motif of the sliced letters) would look good.

It really is amazing! The more demand the better, can't wait to see what the final tally is.



I want to have units shipping in summer, exact dates are still hazy. John Carmack posted a few pictures in his thread, I am pretty bad about taking pictures of works in progress. It will work with many games, but requires fiddling with now-defunct IZ3D drivers, so it is in no way a perfect solution. The ideal solution will be either support by the games themselves, or a new stereo 3D driver like the one Cyberreality is working on.



Thanks! I am glad there are sim racing people who are interested, it seems like a good fit. Most of the people here are FPS players, I think, and flight sim people tend to need higher resolution for reading gauges and the like.



Thanks for the ideas, Bill! Oddly enough, the FOV2GO design was actually an evolution of the Rift design. I have been working on it since last summer, and after making a folding prototype out of foam core, things just went in the right direction. FOV2GO units would definitely be a cool reward! There are other people involved with the FOV2GO project, though. There has been talk of an FOV2O Kickstarter, so maybe that is how things will go down.

Anaglyph glasses are a good idea, too! Would be very cheap to send. I loved the original Canabalt, would be awesome to see that or any your new titles on an HMD! The FOV2GO in particular has so much potential as a platform for simple games.



Sending you an email! I have an idea for tweaking the Rift logo, but the Oculus one is perfect. I seriously cannot imagine a better logo!


As an update, I have been working on both the Rift and the unnamed 270 degree demo unit. Nothing too pretty to look at, but I will be taking pictures on Friday so you can see how ugly the prototyping process is.

I'd love to see some pics of your development units. Keep up the good work Palmer.

Hey Palmer, just wanted to jump on and show my support, I also ended up here from iracing.com.. can't wait to see what comes out!

Mostly a lurker, and ended up here after Carmack's hands on (from his twitter feed, really excited to see he's taking an interest in immersive stereo gaming).

Coming out of the woodwork just to say I would order one in a minute for a 90+ degree FOV, and will be in for the kickstarter.

I would really like the option of an FOV over 95 degrees, and I would probably opt for the built in head tracker since I don't already have one.

Currently my 3d setup is a 22" zalman, and 2d gaming/other stuff is on a dell u2711, so 3d gaming with a greater FOV would be fantastic (obviously an HMD has other significant advantages too!).

I would definitely be up for adding support to my last big game project, and any future games I make.

I would be happy with 90 degrees but now I kinda hope it will be 120 degrees.
If Carmack couuld help with a pre-warped demo for 120 degrees, I bet overtime when we learn how to warp more software, we will wish it was 120 degrees. Cyber seemed happy with the 110 degree sample unit, so that would be cool also.

Great! More software is great.




The horizontal FOV is actually smaller than vertical, I think the current one works out to about 90 horizontal, and about 110 degrees vertical. I would love to make it higher, but it would mean a huge weight increase. I will be making wider FOV lens sets available, though, so the upgrade will be there as an option for the people who want it!

Great, sounds good.
I still think getting the RIFT out as fast as possible,and not just because I wanted one yesterday, but because, as you can see, people all that much faster can start tinkering with current software and writing new software that is warped for the RIFTs optics.

From a selfish, race-sim perspective (heh), a noticeable vertical FOV could at least be 'written off' as constrained view caused by wearing a helmet!

The larger FOV is what got me interested in the Rift. If it's a trade off between either a large FOV and high resolution then I'd prefer one direction is chosen rather than aiming for a middle-ground. The 1280*800 sounds small enough so I would hope that there's a massive FOV available. 120 should be a minimum.

The best think about this HMD is that it will be modular and we will be able to change the optics or the panels (when a better alternative is available) depending on the intended use. For example: considering the weight reduction, I think 90 degrees should be "good enough" for everyday use... but as a developer, I would consider very useful having other additional lenses (the 120 degrees or even the experimental 270 degrees optics) that I can use for research.

Palmer,

What is the current status of this project? I didn't see a website up and unless I'm missing it I have only heard 'June' as a date. I haven't seen any specs, assembly, driver support, etc. details in one reference. Is there a repository?

I have been researching the ST1080 but the lack of reviews falls under the same purview as a game release without a demo. It screams "sale as many as units possible before word gets out!" That endeavor led me to MTBS3D and your Oculus Rift. I was originally planning on getting something for game development within with-in the next month as the ST1080 should be out in quantity by then, but Oculus sounds at the top of the three reasonably priced units right now and better suited for games with head tracking and upgradable to make it useful for development.

Patrick Reddeck

Im happy with 90 degree FOV as a minimum. I mean, this is still double everything else out there at attainable prices. Having the ability to put 120+ degree lenses in would be the icing on the cake.

If Palmer can get this 5" 1080p IPS panel it would be great.

http://www.engadget.com/2012/05/27/lg-d ... nch-1080p/

I will try to make some 120+ lenses available, but it would not work as the minimum for most people. It is fine if you mount it to a helmet, sure, but pretty heavy with just goggle straps! And actually, assuming that the horizontal FOV is wide enough, it seems like it might even be better to have higher vertical. It lets you see the ground and sky, and that is huge.



No website or repository yet, that is priority #1 right now. Gotta have one up before E3 so people can be pointed there. There is a lot of info spread across a bunch of different threads both old and new, but nothing solid and official.

The status of the project is that the optics design and hardware selection is basically finalized. Assembly and final form factor are still being worked on, though I have several prototype units that you could call finished, so this is pretty far along. Software wise, John Carmack has a demo that works great, and I have a hacked together setup that uses a combo of the IZ3D drivers and Nthusim to get standard commercial games working. If I had the money in my hands right now, I could be shipping in three weeks.



Actually, even "double" is a pretty big underestmation. It is about twice as wide, sure, so if it were the same aspect ratio, it would be 4x the image size. However, it is taller, too! Here is a terrible, "not quite to scale but about right" comparison I made up in MS Paint:





Too small, unfortunately. A 5.6" or larger panel is needed, 6" is about ideal. A 7" panel could work, at the cost of making the HMD a little bit oversized. 7" 1080p panels might be our best hope in the near future, though.


I know I said I would post more pics of my various prototypes, but I had to leave them at the lab last Friday before I had a chance. Here is a consolation picture, an HMD I made attached to an ACH helmet!

Wow, that comparison drawing is crazy and really puts this thing in perspective! Can't wait to check it out - especially with Carmack's demo.

You call that an HMD? That's not an HMD...

I did a VR demo with the Rift for the Verge today, there should be some public video available tomorrow.

Twice now I have heard comments along the lines of "I am going to be able to tell my grand kids about the day I first experienced VR".

Some people seem to have more of an issue with the optics than others -- of the dozen or so people that have played with it here, a couple seemed to find it distractingly blurry.

I am really excited about getting kits into a lot of people's hands, because there will be a dozen different takes on form factor, fitting, and adjustment.

John Carmack

That sounds like some killer feedback; I can't wait to get my hands on this!

If you are able, it would be good to know if they were nearsighted, farsighted, or suffer from eye problems like astigmatism. Some of those people might be able to fix the problems with an adjustable unit, but it would be interesting if there are some people who just can't make it work properly.

Can't wait to see what the Verge has to say, they are my favorite tech blog out there.

I am now drooling over here!!!! Can't wait to see the video of it in action!!!

I am anxious to see the video as well. It is so awesome that Carmack is on board to give this thing the exposure it deserves.

OK, now I really do believe it....
Not that I did not believe in you PalmerTech all along, but with input from JohnCarmack and an ID demo, it is just at a whole new level now.
I do not mean to keep harping on it, but I really do believe, what I said before is true. People will buy the RIFT just to play an ID demo that is coded for it.
People have been buying new computers or video cards just so they could play the latest ID offerings for a long time, and it will be the same with the RIFT...Only a whole new form of gaming is about to begin. And the last time that happened, I do believe JohnCarmack was there...Wolfenstein 3D (VR edition) anyone..Ha Ha

Any thoughts or experience using Arduion for head tracking? Unless latency is really bad or compatibility doesn't work it looks like a pretty good $45 solution.

http://www.arduino.cc/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1231185714

http://hacknmod.com/hack/automatic-head-tracking-with-arduino/

Palmer

I'm almost done putting a doc together. I'll PM to get some clarification on some points before posting.


Patrick Reddeck

That looks like a fun project! The discussion thread mentions it's programmed against a 'SimConnect' API. I haven't heard of that one before. Is SimConnect as well-adopted as the FreeTrack or Eagle Dynamics protocols? facetracknoir is an opensource project; would it be feasible to submit code to the project that allows it to track the HMD (i.e. switch from face mode to Rift mode)?

Or maybe glue some googly-eyes to the visor so that it gets picked up... ?

The Arduino stuff looks cool, but still has gyro drift problems. No magnetometer to automatically recalibrate...

Will the final units be adjustable? If not, that would be a show-stopper for me...

Congratulations Palmer! The article is up.
http://www.theverge.com/2012/5/30/3052191/doom-3-bfg-edition-announced-for-the-fall-we-try-it-with-john

Oh, and thank you John for backing this with the considerable resources at your disposal. Please convince Palmer he needs to commercialize this device! Seriously this endeavor could take off like nVidia did in the 90's. As you have mentioned before - we're hitting a wall of diminishing returns with graphical fidelity. Immersive gaming is the next big leap and all the necessary technology is coming together at this very moment.

The link is not valid?

Edit - found it!

http://www.theverge.com/2012/5/30/30521 ... -with-john

I am crying now like a little spoiled kid - I WANT IT NOW!!!! lol!

Congratulations, guys! That was a nice preview. The light weight has me almost as excited as the FOV and price tag.

It looks like the device used in the preview is running at 60Hz. Palmer, is that the same as can be expected in the initial version, or is there a chance for a higher refresh rate?

Thinking about display latency in our engine (and I hope this isn't considered a hijack, just not sure where else to put this and the Rift has gotten me thinking about HMD programming again), I'm wondering if it makes sense to punch a hole for camera control straight into the rendering thread rather than the main simulation thread. Right now what we have is pretty a standard fixed time step simulation thread/interpolated render thread setup, which includes interpolating the camera based on controller input to the simulation. Theoretically, having the motion sensors directly drive the camera on the rendering thread should eliminate (at least) one whole frame of latency...