geo-11 Watch Dogs 2 and Legion

[Zappologist]

Had some spare time and Tested Watch Dogs 2 and Legion

Direct Modes don't work, one game crashed at start, the other just displays the mouse, on a black screen

DX11 works on both, however WD 2 has an issue with shaders getting broken on and off flickering as you move the camera around. Performance seems great though. If this is ever fixed it would be simply amazing to walk through San Francisco again, in perfect smoothness.

Legion is not broken, but I think this game is a lost cause. Performance is simply abysmal, I think even in 2D. Cannot believe that we have a perfect Jedi Fallen Order curtesy of the awesome people behind geo-11 but we still cannot do anything about Legion. I think Losti concluded at some point that it has something to do with RAM speed, so maybe someone with fast RAM can try and report. At least thanks to geo-11 we now have a hope of bruteforcing Legion with future upgrades.

On a tangent:
Bo3b, hope you guys can make direct mode work with most games, since I imagine that's the best path to become hardware and software agnistic. I can understand it this is the most important target for you guys in the short term, in parallel with a UI/Fix manager perhaps, but I hope you have some bandwidth to investigate and implement an "interlaced" mode. It can really be a game changer, judging by my experience with Depth3D. It turned my Reshade 3D gaming from a "slight hassle" to a seamless, plug and play experience (thought I guess this is more applicable to 3D TV owners, not sure. Even people with active monitors, how do they tackle the double mouse, or switching out of the game to browse the web? In-game the split image is merged, but out of the game you are stuck with broken vision)

[Feisty_Fernando]

Had some spare time and Tested Watch Dogs 2 and Legion

Direct Modes don't work, one game crashed at start, the other just displays the mouse, on a black screen

DX11 works on both, however WD 2 has an issue with shaders getting broken on and off flickering as you move the camera around. Performance seems great though. If this is ever fixed it would be simply amazing to walk through San Francisco again, in perfect smoothness.

Legion is not broken, but I think this game is a lost cause. Performance is simply abysmal, I think even in 2D. Cannot believe that we have a perfect Jedi Fallen Order curtesy of the awesome people behind geo-11 but we still cannot do anything about Legion. I think Losti concluded at some point that it has something to do with RAM speed, so maybe someone with fast RAM can try and report. At least thanks to geo-11 we now have a hope of bruteforcing Legion with future upgrades.

On a tangent:
Bo3b, hope you guys can make direct mode work with most games, since I imagine that's the best path to become hardware and software agnistic. I can understand it this is the most important target for you guys in the short term, in parallel with a UI/Fix manager perhaps, but I hope you have some bandwidth to investigate and implement an "interlaced" mode. It can really be a game changer, judging by my experience with Depth3D. It turned my Reshade 3D gaming from a "slight hassle" to a seamless, plug and play experience (thought I guess this is more applicable to 3D TV owners, not sure. Even people with active monitors, how do they tackle the double mouse, or switching out of the game to browse the web? In-game the split image is merged, but out of the game you are stuck with broken vision)

Watch Dogs: Legion is more CPU dependent than a number of games. Need at least a Ryzen 9 5900x or the game will tell you that your CPU isn't fast enough during benchmark tests.

[Losti]

WD2 fix should also be broken in 3DV because of a game update. Please in case of geo11 testing and issue reporting it would help to know if 3DV is ok.

Added shader fixes for the latest version, i dont know how the complete fix behaves, but the effects are fixed again in the first sight of view! I only run the AutoFix from DSS with the latest version of the game. This is tested for 3DV and 17 months ago but you can give it a try, please first in 3DV.

https://losti.s3.amazonaws.com/WD2_20210206.7z

[Lysander]

WD2 was perfect for me but only checked the beginning, on the roof and in the office. There was great performance improvement. Don't have Legion to check.

[Zappologist]

Hi Losti,
You are correct that I should have tested 3DV first, just as a baseline, but I've never had an issue with any fix version previously. Moreover
all the games I've tested so far with geo11 just worked. So I did not even think to try 3DV first, I was not expecting any issues.

I've tried again now, uninstalled then reinstalled 3DV fix, works perfectly. Then replaced the geo11 files, used force_stereo=2 flag, then used direct_mode = nvidia_dx11. Same issue as before. In certain moments, triggered by character movement and view angle, the shaders/shadows become misaligned. It's as if the fix is switched off and the shadows are exactly as in the vanilla/non-fixed version.

Not sure it's worth starting a new game, just to confirm what you and Lysander are saying, which is that in your case geo11 works well - probably in the initial area. I only have a save in downtown, mid day. I fast travelled to a few headquarters and the issue is less visible but as soon as I get outside it happens again. Another important thing I've just noticed, the sky stays broken all the time. So at least that's a constant with the geo11 driver in this game. Is the sky and clouds at correct depth for you guys?

I really hope that more people can test it and maybe we can find a pattern to what's wrong. I'm not sure if this geo11 behavior was already raised ("intermittently broken shadows") but the more games we test the more we'll learn about geo11 on specific configurations or specific settings.

EDIT
Found the problem, it was the shadow settings, the issue occurs only when the shadow settings are Low.
The sky/clouds are still at screen depth though, when I have time I'll check the 3DV fix, don't remember if the sky was at proper depth, it's not really visible on clear skies.

[Losti]

Are you talking about WD2 or Legion?

Legion has issues i know. Geo11 is just im dev. Er try to get it 100% in line with 3D Vision. So i dont spend Time to fix those remaining things until dave says he is out of aideas and the driver is ready.

If you talking about WD2 that was broken for me due to an Update also in 3DV because the most things fixed with hard Code shader Files by a dss Script.

[Zappologist]

I'm talking about WD2, see original post. Fixed now by using any Shadow setting other than Low. Only the sky/clouds are at screen depth, the rest seems perfect.

Legion did not seem to have any issues with geo11, it's just unplayable for me due to low performance. It seemed to be better when you first made the fix, I played a bit, but I eventually abandoned it as I hated the stutters. Now it seems much worse for some reason, and I lost all interest in it for now. It must have quite serious engine problems, if even geo11 cannot make it bearable.

In comparison, in WD2 with geo11 I was able to turn resolution to 4K, in perfect 3D, and got locked 60fps!!!
That's an open world game, with hundreds of cars and pedestrians going about their business, in 4K 3D. Looks like a hologram. Never seen this before, or very rarely but in games with more basic graphics. In WD2 it's really shocking.

[Losti]

I'm talking about WD2, see original post. Fixed now by using any Shadow setting other than Low. Only the sky/clouds are at screen depth, the rest seems perfect.

Legion did not seem to have any issues with geo11, it's just unplayable for me due to low performance. It seemed to be better when you first made the fix, I played a bit, but I eventually abandoned it as I hated the stutters. Now it seems much worse for some reason, and I lost all interest in it for now. It must have quite serious engine problems, if even geo11 cannot make it bearable.

In comparison, in WD2 with geo11 I was able to turn resolution to 4K, in perfect 3D, and got locked 60fps!!!
That's an open world game, with hundreds of cars and pedestrians going about their business, in 4K 3D. Looks like a hologram. Never seen this before, or very rarely but in games with more basic graphics. In WD2 it's really shocking.

RegEx needs some tuning as i did for the UE4UF. many shaders has to be cached and it seems the game recache due to game update or geo11, not sure. its getting better some times the more you play. the initial 3DVfix has many shaders chacked but recache will kill the game for a bit until you play further or replay. WDL has huge clipping issues in geo11, the other things seems to be fixed with some geo11 update, long time ago i have tried it hehe.

WD2 is DSS fix, i dont give you much hope that this will be updated.

[Zappologist]

Tried WD2 again, with the new Geo-11 release, and direct modes still don't work. I've done a lot of testing by swapping files and I conclude that the issue is something in the d3dx.ini file. With the file from the fix, direct modes display just the mouse cursor on a black screen. With the file from the Geo-11 release, direct modes work - but the fix doesn't, obviously.

I think I vaguely recall some comments for other games which had this "black screen" issue and people added or changed some values in the ini files to make it work. But I might be misremembering.
If anyone has any idea, let me know and I'll test.
I tried to compare the two ini's side by side but their structure is quite different. I tried uncommenting some lines in the fix ini to make it like the Geo-11 ini but no luck so far.

I'm not too bothered by this. The game works fine in DX11 mode except for the sky/clouds. I'm just leaving this comment here in case the "black screen" symptom starts to occur more often in people's tests. The remedy might be adding/uncommenting just one line, and we should raise awareness as much as possible.

[SubjectBucko]

I don't understand what you mean by direct mode. I am trying to run WD2 in direct_mode = interlaced in the dxdmi.ini with Geo-11 and I am getting black screen with cursor only visible. I do not have 3d vision driver installed as running on a 3D TV with the latest nvidia drivers (516.94). Any ideas how to solve this?

[SubjectBucko]

I think the value in the .ini file that needs to be changes is upscaling = 1., but I cannot find this as an option to edit in either of the .ini files

[Zappologist]

SubjectBucko,
There are four main rendering paths in Geo-11. They are listed one after the other in the *dm.ini:
1. Direct modes: SBS/TAB/interlaced etc
2. Katanga VR
3. DX09
4. DX11
You have just confirmed the issue I've raised.

I'm not sure anyone knows why this bug happens for direct modes. It might be due to how "customized" DSS's fix is, that ini is quite different and has many additional sections.
If you really think the solution might be the upscaling setting, then we need some help from Bo3b/Dave/Masterotaku or anyone else with experience on the *dm.ini, because, as you mentioned, the upscaling feature in that ini is not documented anywhere. The release ini's never have that line, even commented, so I have no idea what the syntax is, or in which section it must appear.

The only things I can test is to play around with the in-game upscaling ("pixel density", I think) and the upscaling in d3dx.ini from the fix release (but since I'm using pixel density in-game, my bet is that I've tried the upscaling in the ini years ago and it suffered from the usual problems like limited mouse range, or crash).

EDIT
I've found an example of upscaling in Masterotaku's Days Gone fix, so you can try this if you wish, however from my previous tests the main difference seems to be the d3dx.ini, not the *dm.ini
You can easily test this by replacing DSS's d3dx.ini with the one from any Geo-11 release. Direct modes will work, but the shaders are broken since the fix is disabled.

; direct_mode: choose stereo output option based on hardware
; nvidia_dx9
; nvidia_dx11
; tab
; tab_reversed
; sbs
; sbs_reversed
; interlaced
; interlaced_reversed
direct_mode = nvidia_dx11

matrix_analyzer = 1
auto_detect_depth_buffer = 1
resolve_msaa_depth_buffers = 1
preserve_depth_buffers = 1
dm_deferred_context_queue_per_eye = 0
repeat_command_list_depth_buffer_stats = 0
get_resolution_from = large_2d_depth_stencil_if_swap_chain_native
upscaling = 1

[Zappologist]

Quick update:
I've tried upscaling both in d3dx.ini and d3dxdm.ini, and I've also added the line "fake_back_buffer_mode = 0" ib the DEVICE section.
No luck!

So even if the general consensus is that these direct modes are the most compatible, it seems that sometimes certain settings/features from a game's fix ini can conflict with Geo-11 in some way. I'll just document my findings whenever I come across such a game, in the hope that the mystery setting or condition is found.

[SubjectBucko]

Thank you for the clear explanation Zappologist. I also tried adding upscaling to the ini with no luck.

[Losti]

Alsp try fake_back_buffer_mode = 1and 2.

[Zappologist]

Thanks Losti, I forgot to say that I've tested those values already.
I've played around with other values as well, at Kai's suggestion:
allow_check_interface=1
allow_create_device=1
allow_platform_update=1
Still no luck.

Another interesting fact: when I use certain values for the above settings 3DMigoto does not like it, so it displays those red text errors as usual. Well, the errors are displayed in split screen, TAB or SBS depending on my settings in dm.ini.
So this basically means that the direct modes do trigger. It's just that nothing is rendered, apart from the mouse pointer.

[Zappologist]

Tried Watch Dogs Legion recently and by some crazy miracle (game updates, Win updates, changing to new drivers, the Holy Spirit ...) the game is now finally playable, using Geo11.
Minimum resolution, upscaling, and most importantly: SLI off.
THANK YOU LOSTI FOR THIS AMAZING FIX !!!!


However, I still could not find any solution to the black screen issue for Watch Dogs 2. So sadly, if for any reason we have to move to new drivers, new hardware, etc, this awesome game and DSS' magnificent fix will be forever lost, even in a "post Geo11" world.
I really hope someone can take a look at this at some point and work out what's happening. This game deserves to live on, at the very least for those of us who cannot afford to visit San Francisco irl

[Boblenon]

And WD 1 in geo 11?

[Lysander]

And WD 1 in geo 11?

Works fine

[Lysander]

Tried Watch Dogs Legion recently and by some crazy miracle (game updates, Win updates, changing to new drivers, the Holy Spirit ...) the game is now finally playable, using Geo11.
Minimum resolution, upscaling, and most importantly: SLI off.
THANK YOU LOSTI FOR THIS AMAZING FIX !!!!


However, I still could not find any solution to the black screen issue for Watch Dogs 2. So sadly, if for any reason we have to move to new drivers, new hardware, etc, this awesome game and DSS' magnificent fix will be forever lost, even in a "post Geo11" world.
I really hope someone can take a look at this at some point and work out what's happening. This game deserves to live on, at the very least for those of us who cannot afford to visit San Francisco irl

Wd2 worked fine for me in geo11 3dv (dx11 output).

[Zappologist]

@Boblenon
Watch Dogs 1 works very well, some bad water reflections and some broken shadows in certain cutscenes or specific locations (the flesh auction).
But it has perfect performance with Geo11, playing it now and this is sadly how it should have played from the start.

@Lysander
Only direct modes are busted for WD2. DX11 output works but how are you going to use it when you change to new drivers/hardware? Direct modes would have saved this game forever (even if not many people have those 2016 TVs like me, I believe you can make those direct modes work with VR/AR headsets).
I love this game so much. I'm very bitter about this. But it's obvious that the issue is with DSS' dx3D ini being structured differenty, with specific sections that other fixes don't have, so I think this issue might be fixed if someone with shaderhacking experience takes a look at it. There's just not enough people with the knowledge and interest, and time is always limited, new games to work on, etc.
For now, I'm happy that we have WD1 and Legion. I just would have preferred WD2 + Legion instead, as those worlds are more fleshed out and full of character.

[jordan199]

Tried Watch Dogs Legion recently and by some crazy miracle (game updates, Win updates, changing to new drivers, the Holy Spirit ...) the game is now finally playable, using Geo11.
Minimum resolution, upscaling, and most importantly: SLI off.

Cannot managed to work properly Watch Dogs Legion , so if you can please provide d3dx & d3dxdm files - "to remain forever in Geo11 world. ".

[3DNovice]

This game deserves to live on

+1

at the very least for those of us who cannot afford to visit San Francisco irl

Good game, shitty city

I'm not sure why anyone would ever want to go there, Haight-Ashbury flower power tourism perhaps. I never was a fan of SF, been there multiple times.
But FWIW, it's a complete shithole these days. Go to YouTube and type in San Francisco crime / San Francisco stores closing / San Francisco's Tenderloin / San Francisco's easy on crime

Unrelated, yet of relevance because this is now happening in San Francisco
search "Kensington Ave" on YouTube

[Feisty_Fernando]

This game deserves to live on

+1

at the very least for those of us who cannot afford to visit San Francisco irl

Good game, shitty city

I'm not sure why anyone would ever want to go there, Haight-Ashbury flower power tourism perhaps. I never was a fan of SF, been there multiple times.
But FWIW, it's a complete shithole these days. Go to YouTube and type in San Francisco crime / San Francisco stores closing / San Francisco's Tenderloin / San Francisco's easy on crime

Unrelated, yet of relevance because this is now happening in San Francisco
search "Kensington Ave" on YouTube

Philly has been on the decline for a long while, I avoid it at all cost like Baltimore. Unless you absolutely need to see some of the history there, stay away and stay safe.

Tried Watch Dogs Legion recently and by some crazy miracle (game updates, Win updates, changing to new drivers, the Holy Spirit ...) the game is now finally playable, using Geo11.
Minimum resolution, upscaling, and most importantly: SLI off.
THANK YOU LOSTI FOR THIS AMAZING FIX !!!!


However, I still could not find any solution to the black screen issue for Watch Dogs 2. So sadly, if for any reason we have to move to new drivers, new hardware, etc, this awesome game and DSS' magnificent fix will be forever lost, even in a "post Geo11" world.
I really hope someone can take a look at this at some point and work out what's happening. This game deserves to live on, at the very least for those of us who cannot afford to visit San Francisco irl

What resolution did you end up with, what graphic settings, and how many fps are you seeing in 3D? I can get Legion to run in 3D without Geo-11 but have to turn down several graphic settings to keep stuttering to a minimum at 720p on a 2080Ti with a Ryzen 5 3600XT CPU and 32Gb 1600Mhz ram.

[Zappologist]

@Feisty
I would not dare run this game without Geo11. I have a system more or less like yours, no slouch, but without Geo11 it's a stutter fest.
With Geo11, in 720p, most settings on low, it's ok, feels smooth like 60fps, until you move or drive around. The game has very very serious issues. Losti was saying at some point that it's sensitive to RAM. Could be. It has issues that make me think of the texture/assets streaming that Black Flag used to have in big cities. Or how Days Gone was behaving in big settlements. Nothing can be done about this, I'm afraid.
Before trying Geo11 months ago, the game launched in DX12 by default after an update. I was amazed how smooth it was, night and day compared to DX11.
I did not try yet, but if I ever replay Legion it will probably be in DX12 + SD3D. I bet it will be butter smooth with comparable 3D feel. This is very subjective, of course. For me, smoothness of motion trumps everything else in gaming graphics. Apart from depth, but even in 3D I never enjoyed games that were not 60fps locked.

[jordan199]

WDL with Geo11 has a lot of effects broken compared to the normal 3Dmigoto where is perfect, probably need a specific fix - anyway Losti before retirement wanted the make a GEO11 fix but with more mature version,so that does not have to repeat the fixings.

[Zappologist]

I don't see any issues with the 3D myself. Losti's fix is simply great, and it survives well the port to Geo11 as per usual process.
If you see broken thinks it might be also due to settings. I think Losti's notes (which people rarely read properly, to his great dismay ) mention something about shadows needing to be on High or something like that. But it may also be that I simply overlook many issues without realising it.

[jordan199]

Like I said in 3Dmigoto was perfect, and posted Geo11 issues screenshot on discord - anyway probably on low settings the broken effects are not too evident and I always read install notes even try different profiles.