Iz3d driver vs. Nvidia's fully dead

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artox
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Iz3d driver vs. Nvidia's fully dead

Post by artox »

First I would like to say that this is my comparison - the way I think it shold look and you dont have to agree with me.
Since Nvidia's stereo driver is currently, so to say ,lethargic and we don't know when it will wake up or fully recover, meaning that shutter support as well as post processing effects support is kind of gone (although I have not tested nvidia's vista drivers) I suggest we focus on the qualities of the drivers, but do not neglect the point of having, or not having shutter support.

1.) Comparing game compatibility - Nvidia clear winner - they have support for a wide range of dx7 to dx9 games

2.) Next - game speed with stereo - I've tried both Nvidia's driver and Iz3d's in anaglyph mode and I'll go with Nvidia their drivers work a little faster and that is without turning on the autofocus in iZ3d's, which leads to half the framerate.

3.) Quality of the stereo effect - I was skeptical towards iZ3d's drivers, due to having seen screenshots with very low level of separation, compared to Nvidia's. I was extremely pleased to find out that Iz3d have changed the whole concept of stereo. When setting the effect I didn't have to worry about making great reductions to sepration because of high level convergence. I kept getting surprised how you can get super pop out effect without having your images separate if we come to a close-up (and that is not even with the autofocus function). - iZ3d - full marks.


4.) Compatibility with the latest post-processing effects - You know who wins this one, so I won't even comment it, all I can say is bravo Iz3d.

5.) Perks with anaglyph - personally I was surprised to find out that iz3d's drivers preserve the colors much better than Nvidia anaglyph support.

6.) Driver update's and compatibility with Win XP - iZ3d rulls.

7.) Shutter support - Nvidia still the champion, hopefully not for long.

Games that I've tested or tried to test:

UT2004 - both Nvidia and iZ3d get this one right, but with iZ3d you get both deepness and pop-out, which is a great combo.

The witcher - Nvidia - you have to turn off or reduce a couple of effects, meaning shadows, depth of field and lightning. Iz3d - shadow sticks out and doesn't feel right, other stuff can be turned to max.

Prince of Persia - warrior within - Nvidia - you have to either edit the ini file and turn off post-processing effects, or use the dragon util.
Iz3d - you definately have to turn off shadows, or you get yours displayed twice, everything else great - a real showpiece title.

MdK 2 (dx7 game) - hangs up at some poing with 162.50, worked fine with previous Nvidia drivers, but you at least get stereo. Iz3D - stereo doesn't start.

NFS Most wanted - Nvidia, worked with all post-processing effects with previous driver versions + dragon util., with 162.50 it doesn't so you have to turn them off. Iz3d - everything runs fine, if you don't take into account the choppiness.

Far Cry 1.3 - Nvidia you have to either turn off a lot of stuff, or use dragon utility, but after that you get a consistent stereo effect.
Iz3d - great pop-out, but stereo is all wrong - trees in the back keep jumping out in front, as if it is a living forest or something.

Tomb raider anniversary - Nvidia post processing via dragon util. Iz3d obviously no problems.

NFS U2 - Nvidia you have to switch off a lot of stuff, Iz3d everything is fine, but framerate drops considerably of course partially due to turned on effects.

Bioshock - hangs up after loading -with iZ3d. With Nvidia post processing is not right.

Infernal - great surprice Nvidia no stereo at all, iz3d - showpiece.

Resident Evil 4 - Nvidia - works only if not having applied the lightning effects fix patch and the crosshair (lasersight) gets doubled. Iz3d, works both with and without the patch, no doubling everything is fine including framerate.

NFS Porsche Unleashed - Nvidia image gets stretched and there is a lot of flickering (shutter glasses) but you get stereo (haven't tried in anaglyph), iZ3d - no stereo (dx7 game).

I'm probably gonna try a few more things in the next couple of days, so stay tuned.

Final thoughts:

iZ3d - get shutter support and you'll still be the winner, but this time you'll leave Nvidia biting the dust.
Nvidia - either drop dead or do something :).
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Re: Iz3d driver vs. Nvidia's fully dead

Post by LukePC1 »

Hi artox, good to see you again and thanks for the review :)
artox wrote: 1.) Comparing game compatibility - Nvidia clear winner - they have support for a wide range of dx7 to dx9 games
You have to put in account the time when the driver was created! If you test only the most recent games you could forget Nvidia. Many games don't work at all or only with the right driver. And switching drivers all the time is not good, too.

Unfortunatly my system is to slow for the newer games and since nvidia is sligtly faster I'm still using it. But in some time I'll have to change the system...
Play Nations at WAR with this code to get 5.000$ as a Starterbonus:
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http://mtbs3d.com/naw/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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Znith
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Post by Znith »

Bioshock works perfectly fine for me on an iZ3D monitor and it did work fine in anaglyph before I got the monitor. Might be a problem with newer drivers.

Switching off a lot of the bells and whistles is what really put me off from chosing Nvidia. I don't play games in 2008 to have them look like something from 2001.
IZ3D~ My answer to S3D!
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Post by BlackQ »

Hi, artox!

Thanks a lot for your review - it will help us a lot to continue driver improving. We have a lot of things to implement - now we need to find right order :-)
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Post by artox »

No prob, my system is also slow, so I'm testing older games.
I've tried prince of persia sands of time and the two thrones, they both work great.
I'll probably test fahrenheit and knights of the temple tomorrow. They were great for stereo, but fahrenheit had many hud-like issues, so I hope that they won't be present here.
I've had a problem with the hud in all the prince of persia games after a certain degree of separation ( I can't say for sure but probably above 130 separation) it just gets doubled.
About bioshock, I've tested only the latest beta, so it could be a driver issue.

I'm glad to help, I used to do a lot of testing and ini editing in the older days, when stereo profiles were uploaded and solutions were sought. I'm thinking of upgrading soon, so hopefully I'll contribute to the community more.

I'm sorry I didn't take into account how new iz3d's driver is, so my personal suggestion is that we test as much as possible older games, not that I don't like playing new games, but oldies are great for stereo too. That way the guys at iz3d can take account and make their drivers better :).
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Post by artox »

I've just tested knights of the temple and condemned :criminal origins.

KOTT is almost perfect in stereo, but has the same problem which Nvidia's driver had - you can't have good convergence in the third person view and good in first person (when using a bow).

Condemned allows all the effects to be turned on and still have stereo, but you get random light flashes.
I've tried the demo, didn't have space for the full game at the moment, The stuff I'm talking about happens to unnatural light sources (meaning lamps) as well as to sun rays, coming through cracks, they keep sporadicly disappearing and reappearing again.
Other than that the good thing is that the hud in both games is perfect.

UPDATE:

Tried Indiana Jones and the emperor's tomb - stereo is ok, no problems that I've noticed so far.

Chronicles of Riddick: escape from butcher bay is another story - stereo does not even get turned on with Iz3d.
For those of you who remember with the nvidia driver stereo did switch on, but was constrained in only showing the menu "cube" in 3d, everything else - separation with no convergence.

I'm really interested in trying - the matrix - path of neo and call of cthulhu. Escpecially since the second one has got a ton of post-processing going on. I can't however find any demo versions and don't currently have my full versions, so if anyone could do that, please post the results.
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Post by cybereality »

I have a feeling we are going to see some progress with the nvidia drivers this year. I'm not privy to information here, I'm just speculating. But we know Nvidia now has partners in S3D, specifically Zalman. It can be assumed that something may come out of the stuff Samsung and EA had done for the CES/Cebit when they demoed NFS on the new 3d hdtvs. If companies like Zalman and possibly Samsung are licensing Nvidia's technology, you have to assume they are going to want something in return. Especially if EA is involved, that means they can put some real QA on the job. Those companies have the clout that could push Nvdia to keep their drivers updated. Is it just a coincidence that the first 3d driver update from nvidia in over a year came out right after the Zalman did? I'm not saying iz3D isn't a big company too. However they obviously have their own solution, which works very well, and are not in the same position to require the support. But its just more players in the market, and thats good. It should hopefully drive better support in all 3d drivers and I don't think Nvidia is going to drop out so soon. Things are just heating up.
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Post by artox »

Well, the more the merrier, that's my opinion. However Nvidia showed us that they are cutting the branch from under XP users, and I personally am not into transitioning to Vista anytime soon. I am however thinking of upgrading and video card choice is a big question mark. I know that iz3d are reliable now, much more than nvidia have ever been, but if the situation changes in the future and I get an Ati card now, I'll be stuck with no stereo. Currently that's the only thing that makes me consider 8800 gt as an option opposed to the new ati cards on the way, which will hopefully offer 20% increase in performance for the same price tag.
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Post by chilledsanity »

Artox, I like the comparison, especially how you have a lot of older games on your list that I've played. I remember play NFS:PU on the Alps level where once you got to the to top, if you switched to 1st person you could see the snow land on the windshield, it looked friggin amazing.

I understand if it's not a priority, but I hope Iz3d will consider supporting DX7. That's one thing that Nvidia has that nobody else seems to.
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Post by artox »

I too hope that they find the time to become dx7 compatible, because as a stereo consumer I can say that there are a lot of oldies that are great
for s-3d. I don't know if it's because they were easier to run in stereo with the Nvidia drivers, or just because the image was clearer - meaning no post-processing effects and only a great fresh image in s-3d, but dx7 games for me have always been more compatible with S-3d. I thought that the more effects you had the more they screwed up the stereo effect. Well now this isn't an issue with Iz3d's driver, but as I said it doesn't mean that there aren't great games in dx7 that deserve attention. Just try out Giants :citizen Kabuto and you'll see what I'm talking about :).
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Post by artox »

Update:

I tested a few games.

1.)Flatout - perfect stereo, hud - no problems, sun spot - no problems (both were doubled in stereo by nvidia driver)

2.) Fable - post-processing effects appear correctly, however some trees in the distance don't show up right at all, they appear to be sticking out, and do not fit in the whole picture. The nvidia driver had this problem, along with all the post-processing effects not showing up right.

3.) Hitman: Blood money - stereo almost perfect. All post-processing effects appear correctly. The only problem is with water shaders. When the character walks near the water , there is a floating shader (reflection) of the character in the air. With Nvidia - you have to turn off post processing and shadows to get a normal s-3d picture (even when using kind dragon's tool).

As I said with iz3d all 3 games' hud appears normally. Fable requires a fix for the trees, the other two games can be added to supported games list.

PS:
Perhaps this thread should be moved in the iz3d game compatibility section.
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Post by BlackQ »

Hi, guys!

I'd like to help, but we analyzed DX7 structure - it is a bit poor to realize stereo - it is possible, but not easy. We started 1.09 now and then 2.0 will come with DX10 support...but in case if iZ3D will grow faster we may implement DX7 with more developers on board
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Post by artox »

Well, personally I'll be happy even if dx7 support is added somewhere along the way. It doesn't have to be anytime soon.
At least shutter glasses compatibility is coming, that's good news enough for me :)
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Post by chilledsanity »

Hell with shutterglass and DX7 support, there won't be much reason at all to stay with Nvidia. If you guys keep up with this, I don't think I'll be able to justify NOT buying these. And yeah I'm with artox, there's no rush on DX7 support, but to have it as an eventual goal as opposed to never would be really encouraging.
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Post by artox »

I've tested 4 other games. I'll post results for iz3d only, since most of them don't work with nvidia at all.

1. Max Payne 2 - stereo isn't ok, convergence keeps jumping all over the place (and that is when autofocus us off)
2. Thief 3 - all texts in the game keep disappearing. Stereo effect is no good - you can't increase separation as much as needed to get enough depth, only pop-out can be achieved at low separation levels
3. Legacy of Kain: defiance - good stereo can be achieved, but at the cost of losing the hud and having it spitted in the two parts of the screen.
Great levels of separation needed to even achieve stereo effect (over 2000) otherwise you get only separation, no convergence.
4. Call of Cthulhu - only separation, no convergence. (the game has a ton of post-processing effects, it would be great if it worked) I tried great separation levels, to see is any convergence could be gained if the post-processing layer is shifted, but no such luck.)

I really hope that you guys at Iz3d would check at least call of cthulhu and thief 3, since Legacy of Kain is pretty much playable, without the hud and object in Max Payne 2 aren't rendered properly (was the same with Nvidia driver).
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Post by BlackQ »

Hi, artox!

It would be good to put all this artifacts into our bug list - could you pls fill tech support form on iZ3D web site to have a guarantee that all this defects are in our bug list.

Thanks a lot in advance.
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Post by artox »

No problem, I'll do that soon, could I post only one form for all games describing their artifacts or is it necessary to fill multiple forms for each game?
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Post by BlackQ »

it is better to fill it game by game - it will make it much simpler to debug then - thanks in advance!
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Post by artox »

All of the above issues with games have been sent as individual tickets at the iz3d site. Sorry it took me that long (it took 5 min actually) but I don't have much time now. Hope the issues are fixed with future driver releases :)
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Post by BlackQ »

looks like we get it and we'll start to work to cure them
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