Meant to be Seen

Lack of resources. They were not really equipped to do it themselves, they were relying on third parties to somehow make it all work according to their magical plans, but they had no idea how to actually do it.

Needless to say, they never got anywhere with it.

PalmerTech wrote:Lack of resources. They were not really equipped to do it themselves, they were relying on third parties to somehow make it all work according to their magical plans, but they had no idea how to actually do it.

Needless to say, they never got anywhere with it.

That's a real shame, the optics seemed to be really good. Can I ask if you had a chance to do anymore work on that lucid dreaming device?

The optics were off the shelf from third parties, nothing that special. That is why the first revision was 800x600. Everything after that, like 1024x768 and 720p, was speculative.

And no, I have not. I have some good reasons, but I cannot talk about them at the moment.

You know I got that REM Dreamer lucid dream mask a few months ago, but I haven't had any luck with it really. When I first got it I was wearing it just about every night, and I did have one false-awakening that turned into a lucid dream (I think because of the mask), but it was really short and I woke quickly. After that I tried for probably about a month with no success. At first it kept waking me up in the middle of the night. Then I tweaked the settings down a bit, but then it didn't seem to work at all. Not to mention the fact that it was a bit uncomfortable and hard to fall asleep with. So I just stopped using it. I still like the idea of it, and I want it to work, but it was just not happening. Too bad.

CYB.... did you have much experience with lucid dreams before hand? ...Like, as in, more than a few experiences? Are you (were you) combining the mask with a decent program of self-programming (ie: daily rituals, and positive affirmation type stuff)? In my experience, I am betting there is kind of a hump of sorts, that one needs to get over, and then things become quite a bit easier (though maybe that is mostly hopeful rationalizing). I wouldn't give up on it, unless you are speculating about re-sell value (which might benefit from some positive experiences you could relate to a buyer). All I know is it is worth it to figure out how to do it with out the mask, but the mask may be what levels out the hump.

Yeah, I have a lot of experience with lucid dreaming. Probably been doing it for at least 10 years, so I have had dozens of lucid dreams (if not over 100). Sometimes I can have multiple LDs in a week, and then maybe not have any for a few months. But if I try really hard, doing reality checks, affirmations, etc. then I can usually have one pretty soon afterwards. And I was also doing all the training they said to do with the dream mask. So I did try, but it wasn't really working for me. I will probably try again at some point. I still have some hope.

Does it seem to all of you, that this has a much better chance of making it to market than the TDvisor ?
The TDvisor just felt like vapor-ware from the very start.
This Cinemizer oled does not feel like that.
Just looking at the videos, it seems like it is polished and ready for mass production .
Even the Head tracker looks ready to sell in the clips. I know these are short little video's so who knows what these two products are really like, but they do look very good from what I can see in the videos.
I do feel much better about the OLED Cinemizer being released, than I ever did about the TDvisor.

Yeah, this unit is probably coming out. I mean, Carl Zeiss has already released at least 2 models of the Cinemizer glasses over the past few years (so it is not like this is their first attempt at an HMD). They are also a huge company, with a very profitable business selling optics. I doubt they would suddenly lose the funds to bring this to market. Plus, the prototypes shown look very finished and polished. So there is a good chance this will actually come out. TDVision was always kinda fishy, even from the start. I am not sure they ever even had a 720P headset. I know someone here did get the VGA prototype headset from them (so their company was not all vaporware) but they kept saying they would only make the 720P model if the low-res version sold well (not that great a business model if you ask me). I would have liked to see TDVision succeed, but it seems they couldn't get the funding for whatever reason. But they are still around, so maybe they will make a comeback. You never know.

Anyone have any good ideas on how we are going to mod it for a larger FOV ?

Yes I am looking a bit ahead, but I realy do feel this HMD is going to come out and be a great one. So we should start thinking DIY optics right now..

OK, I'll slow down..LOL

It depends on the microdisplays used, which we have no info on, yet.

PalmerTech wrote:It depends on the microdisplays used, which we have no info on, yet.

I guess they will be too small to use the optics out of a V4,V6, V8 HMD ?

Yes, for sure. Those headsets use 1.2" and 1.3" displays.

I would bet on 0.44", 0.55", or maybe 0.7", as those are the industry standards I have seen pop up over and over. I could be wrong, though, who knows where they are sourcing these OLED modules.

I found a pico projector that costs new $100 it's 640x480 LCOS but it can downscale from max resolution of 1280x800. It can project from 6 inch to 56 inch. It's from some Chinese manufacturer. It could be good for a DIY HMD. What do you think?

go to http://www.cybertheater.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; scroll down the page or do a search for PP003 and you will see some info about it with a link to amazon selling it.

I also think this is the same projector http://kxshop.en.made-in-china.com/prod ... -003-.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Then I found this LED pico projector for $108 with shipping 320 x 240

http://www.buy.com/prod/mini-usb-2-0-le ... 69836.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

cybereality wrote:Yeah, I have a lot of experience with lucid dreaming. Probably been doing it for at least 10 years, so I have had dozens of lucid dreams (if not over 100). Sometimes I can have multiple LDs in a week, and then maybe not have any for a few months. But if I try really hard, doing reality checks, affirmations, etc. then I can usually have one pretty soon afterwards. And I was also doing all the training they said to do with the dream mask. So I did try, but it wasn't really working for me. I will probably try again at some point. I still have some hope.

yay another thread about LD-ing! Had like 160 of em. Had 2 yesterday twaz quite epic. A DC gave me his email - didn't work in RL

yuriythebest wrote: yay another thread about LD-ing! Had like 160 of em. Had 2 yesterday twaz quite epic. A DC gave me his email - didn't work in RL

Maybe the DC was from the future. The email doesn't exist yet!

@smoothy: Hmm, those are some good deals. Might be worth it just to mess around, not a huge loss if it don't work out.

sounds like a great idea in theory.....

but do you have the skills to build one?

looking forward to the results

Don't buy chinese LCOS picoprojector!!!

its not true LCOS but colorfilter LCOS / FLCOS, thats crap, with 100:1 contrast!!!

Wait for LCOS, MEMS, OLED.

tritosine wrote:Don't buy chinese LCOS picoprojector!!!

its not true LCOS but colorfilter LCOS / FLCOS, thats crap, with 100:1 contrast!!!

Wait for LCOS, MEMS, OLED.

For $100, what do you expect? Of course its a piece of crap!

cybereality wrote:

tritosine wrote:Don't buy chinese LCOS picoprojector!!!

its not true LCOS but colorfilter LCOS / FLCOS, thats crap, with 100:1 contrast!!!

Wait for LCOS, MEMS, OLED.

For $100, what do you expect? Of course its a piece of crap!

It might not be good quality for large projection, but for a small closeup HMD it would probably work well.

yeah .probably, like , playing Beethoven symphony on an alarm clock.

http://www.syndiant.com/tech_advantages.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

any hope[am so sarcastic!) / news from cinemizer regd the OLED version ?

Expect some news from CES2011, which (I think) is on from 7th-9th of this month. News is coming out from Las Vegas even now.

I would be greatly surprised if Zeiss are not showcasing this interesting HMD.

Samiad wrote:Expect some news from CES2011, which (I think) is on from 7th-9th of this month. News is coming out from Las Vegas even now.

I would be greatly surprised if Zeiss are not showcasing this interesting HMD.

plz keep us posted if you get any update on cinemizer oled

Nothing came out of CES 2011 unfortunately...

Sony showed their prototype Sony Headman which is a very similar product (720p OLED screens) but no price or date, or even confirmation that it's going to be a real product on shelves.

Samiad wrote:Nothing came out of CES 2011 unfortunately...

Vuzix showed 3 new headsets. The Wrap VR1200 (852x480 w/ 6dof tracking), the Raptyr (see-through HMD for AR applications) and a prototype with a 1280x1024 display.

cybereality wrote:

Samiad wrote:Nothing came out of CES 2011 unfortunately...

Vuzix showed 3 new headsets. The Wrap VR1200 (852x480 w/ 6dof tracking), the Raptyr (see-through HMD for AR applications) and a prototype with a 1280x1024 display.

i'd be careful with Vuzix as my experience with their AV920 was preposterous!
bad 3D with flickers all over...

Wow, for over five hundred dollars, you would think the resolution would be higher than 720p. I was hoping for more along the lines of 1080p. I wonder if there are glasses out there at that resolution, and what the difference in price would be?

gamergal8292 wrote:Wow, for over five hundred dollars, you would think the resolution would be higher than 720p. I was hoping for more along the lines of 1080p. I wonder if there are glasses out there at that resolution, and what the difference in price would be?

Currently there are few HMD's on professional market with 1280 x 1024 resolution, with price from 12 000 - 15 000 USD and more. Also a Sensics HMD with very high resolution something like 4000x3000 with price over 30 000 USD.

500 Bucks for 720p glasses is very good price!

If there existed 1080p glasses around this price, everyone here would have bought a pair by now...

I might pay up to $1,000 for a pair of 1080P glasses assuming the FOV was something sweet like 60 degrees or more. I think people get caught up in resolution too much. Its not that important. I use the Wrap 310's regularly and they are only 428 x 240. You would think that would look like crap, but its actually OK. But they are only 26 degrees FOV, that could be a lot better. If they could be hitting 60-90 degrees FOV I wouldn't even care if it was at these low resolutions. It would still be immersive.

cybereality wrote:I think people get caught up in resolution too much. Its not that important. I use the Wrap 310's regularly and they are only 428 x 240. You would think that would look like crap, but its actually OK. If they could be hitting 60-90 degrees FOV I wouldn't even care if it was at these low resolutions. It would still be immersive.

Glad you said it cybereality, I always thought I was weird or blind.
I can still plug in an old 640*480 or 800*600 resolution monitor and not give a thought for wanting higher resolution. Only thing I don't like is all the scrolling on web surfing.

What I like about the new Vuzix is the ability to take a high resolution feed even if the HMD is lower resolution like the Vuzixs Vr1200 852*480. I just don't want to be locked out of a game that can't be set to a low resolution. So I don't care about the VR1200 852*480 resolution because it can take a 1280*768 feed and thats all that matters.

So like you, I also think, BIG FOV IS THE KEY.
If we find a way to MOD the Carl Zeiss or Vr1200 for bigger FOV that would be all I would need.

3dvison wrote: So like you, I also think, BIG FOV IS THE KEY.
If we find a way to MOD the Carl Zeiss or Vr1200 for bigger FOV that would be all I would need.

Modding is one option. Though if it were that easy why wouldn't one of those companies just have done that from the start?

Maybe manufactorers of hmd's are limiting the actual fov to make the whole image in the field of vision (besides that poor resolution might be more visible). It sux when gaming and in movies though. Everywhere else too actually....

Its also about the size of the headset as well. Vuzix seems to want to make them look like sunglasses, which is a cool goal (especially if you want to use in public). But that limits what you can do with the optics. There are only a few nutters (like myself) that would actually enjoy something like this:

cybereality wrote:Its also about the size of the headset as well. Vuzix seems to want to make them look like sunglasses, which is a cool goal (especially if you want to use in public). But that limits what you can do with the optics. There are only a few nutters (like myself) that would actually enjoy something like this:

is that you - cybereality - you look great with that helmet on!
for me it's an immediate turn-on

That image looks insane but i think there's a very tiny person under the helmet. On me it would only be a tiny bump on my head!

LOL!

You could use this picture to sell stuff other than VR products.

Maybe somthing like this:

"You don't have to live like this because of bad breath
[quote=]
[/quote]
Try trident, for great smelling breath.
Because with a Trident mouth, you'll be blowing a bubble, not living in one"
Ha Ha

cybereality wrote:

Samiad wrote:Nothing came out of CES 2011 unfortunately...

Vuzix showed 3 new headsets. The Wrap VR1200 (852x480 w/ 6dof tracking), the Raptyr (see-through HMD for AR applications) and a prototype with a 1280x1024 display.

just stumbled across this:

Carl Zeiss Cinemizer OLED 720p 3D Glasses
Wednesday, March 2nd, 2011 at 1:39 pm  
Carl Zeiss’ new 2011 Cinemizer 3D-capable video eyeglasses are a must have BIG 55 inch OLED TV 3D in your pocket ! 2 x 1280×720 pixels OLED Hight-Definition Widescreen 16:9 for REAL MOVIES EJOYMENT 3D Bluray compatible with HDMI 1.4 input in the Glasses Headtracking for games ! Compatible with iphone , ipod , ipad , computer , dvd , bluray 3D Autonomy of the battery 4 hours Price 515$ US summer 2011

http://3dcapabletv.net/?p=549" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

If they put in 2 X 1280x720 it is a whole different story than the
vuzix WRAP VR1200 with "display resolution support of up to 1280 x 768" but if you dig deeper you find "Twin high-resolution 852 x 480 LCD displays".

AJtYol wrote:If they put in 2 X 1280x720...

We still can't be sure it's true or not.