The Sony HMD is real!

Post by **android78** » Tue Nov 22, 2011 10:28 pm

Here's an interesting document to read:
http://www.loreti.it/Download/PDF/Ologr ... /45_01.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Post by **superkev** » Tue Nov 22, 2011 11:10 pm

why do we have to have to have 'pin-holes' to look into the screens ?

Dude. I guess you're just trolling, I get it. But C'mon the aperture's are considerably larger than your eye. How freaking big does it have to be? Issues with HMZ-T1 are *nothing* to do with this. You're in the throwing mud on the wall mode at this point.

Post by **ancjob** » Wed Nov 23, 2011 12:25 am

superkev wrote:why do we have to have to have 'pin-holes' to look into the screens ?

Dude. I guess you're just trolling, I get it. But C'mon the aperture's are considerably larger than your eye. How freaking big does it have to be? Issues with HMZ-T1 are *nothing* to do with this. You're in the throwing mud on the wall mode at this point.

am not averse to Sony
when i have tried nonames like eMagin,headplay - Sony as abrand will be a welcome addition however it's been pointed by reviewer that focusing on screens is difficult and so is adjust-ability on the head both match the 'symtoms' of headplay.......

but nevertheless if not for st1080 / cinemizer [yet tobe released] , i'd have pre-ordered this from UK....as i need an HDMI HMD and as for now Sony is the only choice....but i prefer to wait..especially for st1080 which has alot of potential to be the dream HMD

Post by **Aeroflux** » Wed Nov 23, 2011 10:25 am

I really don't understand the hype for the ST1080. First, according to the specs it has a piss poor contrast (100:1 or 1200:1 @ f/2.8), which implies black will be gray and white will be dull. Second, 1080p 3D is a challenge to render at acceptable framerates (current games) without going overboard on a SLI setup, and then you deal with other issues. 720p 3D is practical for gaming PCs, so when I considered the Sony HMZ-T1 I didn't see it as a fault. Finally, this company isn't known for creating headsets and even though concerns of the ergonomics have been addressed that doesn't mean it will suddenly become comfortable to wear. Sony seems to have botched that "feature" with a ton of R&D on their record.

At this point it's a comical race. We could equate the companies to a track race:

Vuzix 1200VR: Driver with coke-bottle glasses driving a supercharged pinto. Tends to pull up to the starting line facing the wrong direction.

Carl Ziess Cinemizer: Impressive race car, but didn't show up for the last race and probably won't show up for this race.

Silicon Micro Display ST1080: The driver is in the stands handing out flyers, but someone forgot to mention he requires a vehicle, not blueprints. He claims he'll be ready for the race but the flyers say the car will be shown to the public next year.

Sony HMZ-T1: Great engine, but the driver has tunnel-vision, and getting strapped into the car would enrage a buddhist monk.

Post by **ancjob** » Wed Nov 23, 2011 12:01 pm

Aeroflux wrote:I really don't understand the hype for the ST1080. First, according to the specs it has a piss poor contrast (100:1 or 1200:1 @ f/2.8), which implies black will be gray and white will be dull. Second, 1080p 3D is a challenge to render at acceptable framerates (current games) without going overboard on a SLI setup, and then you deal with other issues. 720p 3D is practical for gaming PCs, so when I considered the Sony HMZ-T1 I didn't see it as a fault. Finally, this company isn't known for creating headsets and even though concerns of the ergonomics have been addressed that doesn't mean it will suddenly become comfortable to wear. Sony seems to have botched that "feature" with a ton of R&D on their record.

At this point it's a comical race. We could equate the companies to a track race:

Vuzix 1200VR: Driver with coke-bottle glasses driving a supercharged pinto. Tends to pull up to the starting line facing the wrong direction.

Carl Ziess Cinemizer: Impressive race car, but didn't show up for the last race and probably won't show up for this race.

Silicon Micro Display ST1080: The driver is in the stands handing out flyers, but someone forgot to mention he requires a vehicle, not blueprints. He claims he'll be ready for the race but the flyers say the car will be shown to the public next year.

Sony HMZ-T1: Great engine, but the driver has tunnel-vision, and getting strapped into the car would enrage a buddhist monk.

if this is a race of HD heavy weights then why include a bicycle [Wrap 1200VR]

Post by **Synexious** » Wed Nov 23, 2011 12:59 pm

Aeroflux wrote: At this point it's a comical race. We could equate the companies to a track race:

Vuzix 1200VR: Driver with coke-bottle glasses driving a supercharged pinto. Tends to pull up to the starting line facing the wrong direction.

Carl Ziess Cinemizer: Impressive race car, but didn't show up for the last race and probably won't show up for this race.

Silicon Micro Display ST1080: The driver is in the stands handing out flyers, but someone forgot to mention he requires a vehicle, not blueprints. He claims he'll be ready for the race but the flyers say the car will be shown to the public next year.

Sony HMZ-T1: Great engine, but the driver has tunnel-vision, and getting strapped into the car would enrage a buddhist monk.

LOL

Post by **cybereality** » Wed Nov 23, 2011 8:34 pm

@ancjob: I'm sorry dude, but you are making a lot of assumptions on a product you have not even seen. I've used the HMZ-T1, and the full screens are in crystal clear view. The edges are not blurry or warped or anything like that. The picture is the best I've seen. Seems you just want to complain and talk up how good eMagin is even with evidence pointing against it.

Post by **ancjob** » Wed Nov 23, 2011 9:28 pm

cybereality wrote:@ancjob: I'm sorry dude, but you are making a lot of assumptions on a product you have not even seen. I've used the HMZ-T1, and the full screens are in crystal clear view. The edges are not blurry or warped or anything like that. The picture is the best I've seen. Seems you just want to complain and talk up how good eMagin is even with evidence pointing against it.

no one said that Sony HMD has bad image quality so i can say with 100% surety that image quality is the best - truly HD

now coming to optics - people at diff. forums have pointed out the difficulty to adjust and get all corners of screen within vision.....so regd OPTICS - i am a little sceptical! [ issue seems same as headplay that in order to get all corners of screen - you have to place HMD very close to eyes...but still not feeling comfortable just managing somehow]

coming back to z800 - no one 'd say emagin has bad optics but i never said that emagin has great image....image quality is just so...so [i rate headplay better than z800 for it's deep rich colors and HD like feeling]

yes - optics only - z800 reigns supreme - had it have GREAT image quality like Sony HMD has then probably the Ultimate HMD 'd have been there...that's why i am now hunting for Sony HMZ and the new generation of HMDs

i guess prism optics is patented so in order to use that sony 'd have to pay a lot of royalty and lenses 'd be very costly....that's why sony avoided the prism optics...[correct me if am wrong] else the price 'd have been > usd$2k etc...

already no-name like emagin ,headplay have been tried so Sony being a brand definitely deserves a fair try!

will wait for st1080 and if nothing is there then HMZ will be gotten just a matter of time!

Post by **ancjob** » Thu Nov 24, 2011 1:06 am

@superkev

pal - can u plz tell me if the unit is automatically detected as plug'n'play with auto resolution setting done by pc/blu-ray player using HDMI ?

one thing that's bad is 'lack of VGA port' on the control box - at least they 'd have included VGA port as well......

i have the nettop [asrock ion 3d blu-ray version ] it does not have the display - just the 'cpu' box.[currently waiting for a nice 3D capable LCD Tv/monitor- being pricey so waiting till prices come down]

currently it detects 'headplay' as generic plug'n'play and loads the native 800x600 resolution automatically - i am NOT sure if it will be as easy with Sony HMZ using HDMi though the nettop has Full 3D capable HDMI 1.4 port

Post by **rowanunderwood** » Thu Nov 24, 2011 6:09 am

Aeroflux wrote:I really don't understand the hype for the ST1080. First, according to the specs it has a piss poor contrast (100:1 or 1200:1 @ f/2.8), which implies black will be gray and white will be dull. Second, 1080p 3D is a challenge to render at acceptable framerates (current games) without going overboard on a SLI setup, and then you deal with other issues. 720p 3D is practical for gaming PCs, so when I considered the Sony HMZ-T1 I didn't see it as a fault. Finally, this company isn't known for creating headsets and even though concerns of the ergonomics have been addressed that doesn't mean it will suddenly become comfortable to wear. Sony seems to have botched that "feature" with a ton of R&D on their record.

At this point it's a comical race. We could equate the companies to a track race:

Vuzix 1200VR: Driver with coke-bottle glasses driving a supercharged pinto. Tends to pull up to the starting line facing the wrong direction.

Carl Ziess Cinemizer: Impressive race car, but didn't show up for the last race and probably won't show up for this race.

Silicon Micro Display ST1080: The driver is in the stands handing out flyers, but someone forgot to mention he requires a vehicle, not blueprints. He claims he'll be ready for the race but the flyers say the car will be shown to the public next year.

Sony HMZ-T1: Great engine, but the driver has tunnel-vision, and getting strapped into the car would enrage a buddhist monk.

You won't have to worry about 1080p frame rates with the ST1080, since it only supports hdmi 1.4, frame rates will be limited to 24 anyways!

Post by **Fredz** » Thu Nov 24, 2011 8:38 am

rowanunderwood wrote:You won't have to worry about 1080p frame rates with the ST1080, since it only supports hdmi 1.4, frame rates will be limited to 24 anyways!

30Hz per eye according to their CTO.

"2) Our current product is not based on the 300Mhz HDMI receiver. It is intended for use with standard 1080p 60 Hz input or 1080p 30Hz 3-D (blu-ray) input. We would certainly keep up with the industry trend in future product lines."

Link : http://www.siliconmicrodisplay.com/1/po ... t1080.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

And as has already been said in the relevant thread, HDMI 1.4 is not limited to 24Hz per eye in 1080p, the standard also supports 60Hz per eye in the secondary modes. The actual limit of 30Hz per eye is not due to the HDMI 1.4a standard but to the 225MHz HDMI transmission chips used in current displays.

Post by **cybereality** » Thu Nov 24, 2011 11:59 am

Sure that's not just a mistake? He says 30Hz but then also says Blu-Ray, which all run at 24Hz if I'm not mistaken.

Also, the HDMI 1.4a standard format is 1080P24. Can vendors just support whatever non-standard formats they feel like?

Post by **mayaman** » Thu Nov 24, 2011 12:23 pm

cybereality wrote:You guys don't get it do you? If we don't buy products like this, then there is not going to be a newer/better model. Sony will take it as a failed experiment. And other big name companies won't waste the effort if it looks like a competitor lost a bunch of money. And smaller players, like Vuzix, might not even stick around (or might go military contract only). If you want VR to actually happen in any reasonable amount of time, then you have to support the companies that are pushing the medium forward.

Just a few months ago, people were complaining how the 1200VR was only 35 degrees FOV, and that they wanted something bigger. Why couldn't a company make an HD headset, or something without washed-out colors. Something affordable. Now that headset has arrived and no one wants it. Some irony.

No, you cannot buy the HMZ-T1 (or 1200VR, for that matter) and jack into the matrix today. But these products bring us small steps closer to that dream. And in order to realize that dream, you guys have to follow where the path leads every step of the way. You can't just sit around waiting for you dreams to happen. That doesn't work. You have to make them happen.

I agree, most of these complaints sound like sour grapes. If you want to make it more comfortable, just use a strap that goes along the top of your head, front to back. Have some imagination people.

Post by **Fredz** » Thu Nov 24, 2011 5:39 pm

cybereality wrote:Sure that's not just a mistake? He says 30Hz but then also says Blu-Ray, which all run at 24Hz if I'm not mistaken.

Yep, linking 30Hz to Blu-Ray was probably not the wisest thing to do, I think it was only to illustrate the max. refresh rate that can be obtained with current HDMI displays (Samsung and Panasonic TVs for example).

cybereality wrote:Also, the HDMI 1.4a standard format is 1080P24. Can vendors just support whatever non-standard formats they feel like?

The HDMI 1.4a is a lot more than only 1080p@24Hz per eye, just read the specification and you'll see that 1080p@60Hz per eye is also supported as a secondary format, it's just not mandatory. So when 300MHz HDMI chips will be available in new TV sets, no modification to the HDMI 1.4a spec will be needed to support that.

Post by **cybereality** » Thu Nov 24, 2011 10:10 pm

Fredz wrote:
cybereality wrote:Also, the HDMI 1.4a standard format is 1080P24. Can vendors just support whatever non-standard formats they feel like?
The HDMI 1.4a is a lot more than only 1080p@24Hz per eye, just read the specification and you'll see that 1080p@60Hz per eye is also supported as a secondary format, it's just not mandatory. So when 300MHz HDMI chips will be available in new TV sets, no modification to the HDMI 1.4a spec will be needed to support that.

Yes, I know about that. I've just never seen 1080P30 specifically listed as a format, although I do recall someone getting that to work on a certain Samsung HDTV.

Post by **Aeroflux** » Fri Nov 25, 2011 8:45 am

mayaman wrote: I agree, most of these complaints sound like sour grapes. If you want to make it more comfortable, just use a strap that goes along the top of your head, front to back. Have some imagination people.

That has been tried, check the AVS forum thread. Some guy is modifying a baseball hat for it. If the problem were just getting it comfortable it would be a cinch. But the problem is achieving comfort while getting a 100% edge blur-free picture. Either this is faulty QC or it's an inherent flaw of the optics. I'm hoping it's quality control as a blessed few seem to have no issue with adjusting the optics for a 100% clear picture.

Can anybody verify that the IPD adjustment is forced to presets (indented track)? I saw a few people claiming they cannot get proper IPD due to that...but there is no mention of whether it is a free sliding mechanism or a indented track mechanism.

Post by **cybereality** » Fri Nov 25, 2011 9:28 am

I think the issue is that everybody is different. Some people have different sized heads, eye spacing, eye level, etc. Its not going to fit perfectly for everyone. And the adjustments Sony provided are somewhat limited. The slider (which is like an IPD/diopter in one) has a few notched positions. I believe you can still slide it between the notches, but I don't really remember. Either way, its still somewhat limited. It did seem to work for me when I tried it (ie the screens were in clear view) but I could understand if some people had problems.

Post by **mAchiNE** » Fri Nov 25, 2011 5:17 pm

If (When

) I get one of these I will probably mount it into a VFX-1 Shell I have, this should solve the problem of it being front heavy and having tiny fragile straps holding it to your head...

But regardless of any faults this unit might have they seem insignificant considering before this came out the best HMD resolution available at an reasonably affordable price was 800x600

Post by **ancjob** » Sat Nov 26, 2011 1:40 am

mAchiNE wrote:If (When ) I get one of these I will probably mount it into a VFX-1 Shell I have, this should solve the problem of it being front heavy and having tiny fragile straps holding it to your head...

But regardless of any faults this unit might have they seem insignificant considering before this came out the best HMD resolution available at an reasonably affordable price was 800x600

yes - you are right....
i need this as an upgrade from headplay....

Post by **mayaman** » Sat Nov 26, 2011 5:06 am

I still think peole are being overly critical, it's why nobody makes anything for us. Just enjoy the new headset and stop over analyzing it. It's the best one out in years. Let's not kill our only hope of getting future products.

Post by **Okta** » Sat Nov 26, 2011 5:34 am

mayaman wrote:I still think peole are being overly critical, it's why nobody makes anything for us. Just enjoy the new headset and stop over analyzing it. It's the best one out in years. Let's not kill our only hope of getting future products.

Agreed. When this thing was officially announced only a few months ago we nearly fell out of our chairs at the specs, and it has delivered on most expectations.

Post by **tyson766** » Sat Nov 26, 2011 7:23 am

Thinking about getting one of these but still waiting for reviews of how well it works when used with first person games or with flight simulators. Anyone that has one already care to comment?

Post by **cybereality** » Sat Nov 26, 2011 10:02 am

Just have to say that Sony made a BIG mistake not producing enough of these for the holiday season. They would have sold like crazy.

Post by **ancjob** » Sat Nov 26, 2011 10:17 pm

cybereality wrote:Just have to say that Sony made a BIG mistake not producing enough of these for the holiday season. They would have sold like crazy.

probably becoz they were unsure of the people's response to such an item...
Vuzix consumer division in loss , cinemizer last HMD not MFG anymore - OLED version may not see the light of the day , emagin 'devil-may-care-attitude' for consumer market - all making sony skeptical hence a good decision to gauge the market response and get early reviews to refine product further......a brand like sony will do exactly like that they did!

at least they took interest in this 'dead' market of HMDs where for FPV - sub-par evg920s galore on ebay.....and no serious interest in product development....i think the ,motivation was becoz of PS3....

this will boost sales of ps3 and prove an edge over their rivals

for me in INDIA probably it will be a long wait if this product ever were to be released in INDIA!
not complaining as by then may be a lot of choices galore !
the battle has got 'sexed' up with this !

Post by **Bishop51** » Sun Nov 27, 2011 1:50 pm

Okta wrote:
mayaman wrote:I still think peole are being overly critical, it's why nobody makes anything for us. Just enjoy the new headset and stop over analyzing it. It's the best one out in years. Let's not kill our only hope of getting future products.
Agreed. When this thing was officially announced only a few months ago we nearly fell out of our chairs at the specs, and it has delivered on most expectations.

Just remember that in the corporate world public criticism generally only counts when there are positive sales in the mix. Which is to say; Sony is definitely listening to the concerns and criticisms now because there appears to be a market for the device. That's a win-win situation as it will hopefully mean we'll get our HMZ-T2 with improved optics, comfort and native head tracking.

In many ways I think Sony specifically earmarked this product for a low yield market test. The run was very noncommittal for such a large company and that tells me that they were testing waters before investing more resources into a second generation product.

Post by **tyson766** » Sun Nov 27, 2011 5:17 pm

Bishop51 wrote: In many ways I think Sony specifically earmarked this product for a low yield market test. The run was very noncommittal for such a large company and that tells me that they were testing waters before investing more resources into a second generation product.

I wouldn't be so sure. The constantly shifting release date and the immature state of oled technology would have me leaning towards production problems.

Post by **cybereality** » Sun Nov 27, 2011 5:44 pm

Bishop51 wrote:...hopefully mean we'll get our HMZ-T2 with improved optics, comfort and native head tracking.

Once again, people can't just sit around and expect a better version of this product to magically emerge. You have to buy whats available today, or there will not be a next one.

Post by **Okta** » Sun Nov 27, 2011 7:26 pm

cybereality wrote:
Bishop51 wrote:...hopefully mean we'll get our HMZ-T2 with improved optics, comfort and native head tracking.
Once again, people can't just sit around and expect a better version of this product to magically emerge. You have to buy whats available today, or there will not be a next one.

Hey man they pretty much sold out world wide on pre order, you cant get any better than that

Post by **PalmerTech** » Sun Nov 27, 2011 7:38 pm

tyson766 wrote:
Bishop51 wrote: In many ways I think Sony specifically earmarked this product for a low yield market test. The run was very noncommittal for such a large company and that tells me that they were testing waters before investing more resources into a second generation product.
I wouldn't be so sure. The constantly shifting release date and the immature state of oled technology would have me leaning towards production problems.

I don't think so. Like I mentioned earlier in the thread, the delays were all very minor, and some came after many stores reported having received their shipments. I think the issues were on the distribution side, not the production side. If they were, then the slight delays of only several weeks would not have been enough to compensate for production problems.

Post by **Bishop51** » Mon Nov 28, 2011 11:04 am

cybereality wrote:
Bishop51 wrote:...hopefully mean we'll get our HMZ-T2 with improved optics, comfort and native head tracking.
Once again, people can't just sit around and expect a better version of this product to magically emerge. You have to buy whats available today, or there will not be a next one.

I'm not disagreeing with you at all cybereality. Sony essentially sold out this run of the HMZ-T1 so I don't think you have much to worry about. If the reverse were true I'd be right there with you on the worry scale. I personally find it very encouraging that people are being vocal about the same subset of issues on this headset. Its a loud enough signal that Sony will likely listen and there's sales there to make it worth their time.

I'm not Sony but I do come from a product production/creation and manufacturing related industry. When I'm working at a product that has iteration involved and when people scream at me about this or that feature which can be improved, I don't plug my ears and sing a song, I make the improvements on V2. If I don't the competition will.

Post by **ERP** » Mon Nov 28, 2011 12:33 pm

Bishop51 wrote:
cybereality wrote:
Bishop51 wrote:...hopefully mean we'll get our HMZ-T2 with improved optics, comfort and native head tracking.
Once again, people can't just sit around and expect a better version of this product to magically emerge. You have to buy whats available today, or there will not be a next one.
I'm not disagreeing with you at all cybereality. Sony essentially sold out this run of the HMZ-T1 so I don't think you have much to worry about. If the reverse were true I'd be right there with you on the worry scale. I personally find it very encouraging that people are being vocal about the same subset of issues on this headset. Its a loud enough signal that Sony will likely listen and there's sales there to make it worth their time.

I'm not Sony but I do come from a product production/creation and manufacturing related industry. When I'm working at a product that has iteration involved and when people scream at me about this or that feature which can be improved, I don't plug my ears and sing a song, I make the improvements on V2. If I don't the competition will.

I think it's going to be important that Sony hear the right message though, I think a lot of the message they are hearing now is about bulk and weight, and that concerns me.
To me at least the biggest constraint on HMD's over the last decade or so has been the obsession with compact designs, it virtually guarantees FOV's below 40 degrees.
I still want a reasonably prices consumer unit with 70+degree FOV and head tracking for games.
What I'm hoping Sony hear is that there is big potential in the gaming space for a wide FOV display. Despite some of the discussions here, it was very much designed for movie playback and not games, the design was completed long before the Playstation group had a chance to give feedback on the device, the first experiment that was done inside the Playstation group was to stick a Move controller on the top of it to get head tracking. Unfortunately it was too late in the design process.

I wonder what the original projections for the unit were and what they consider a success for lifetime sales.

Post by **Bishop51** » Mon Nov 28, 2011 2:42 pm

Yeah, the thing is that I've actually seen the FOV issue come up in a lot of places where I wasn't expecting the discussion. Usually it comes up in a sort of uniformed "I feel like I'm sitting in a tunnel" kind of complaint. That and head tracking have been surprisingly prolific consumer level concerns (along with the louder concerns over comfort).

The REAL trouble as you so rightly point out is that the device is targeted towards 16:9 movies and the PS3 content. That's a bit troublesome because FOV (to the extremes we're discussing here) are unlikely to see major improvement due to it breaking the predominant format Sony is supporting. That being said, I do think Sony is hearing the "tunnel vision" complaints and will probably invest more research dollars into improved optics which may increase screen size (and hence FOV). And given the PS3 platform association, I would be VERY surprised if we didn't see head tracking built into HMZ-T2 (that was a really blind miss on Sony's part).

Post by **Okta** » Mon Nov 28, 2011 5:48 pm

I think you can forget head tracking. The only tracking your might get is an add on that sits on top maybe for the ps3 but doubtful anything from sony for the pc because the scope of use isn't clear enough.

Post by **cybereality** » Mon Nov 28, 2011 7:39 pm

I am not taking jabs at anyone here specifically, I just hear a lot of complaints (on Nvidia forums, and elsewhere) from people basically wanting a $500 holodeck and whining cause this Sony kit ain't it. The resolution and picture quality blows away everything on the consumer market, and probably throws punches at some professional stuff costing major $$$$. The FOV is pretty decent, and does basically cover the majority of a person's stereo vision. Any bigger and you would not have 100% overlap, and that doesn't make sense for 99% of the content Sony is selling (3D Blu-Ray, etc.). It is the first headset to support the new industry standard HDMI 1.4a. So it works with a wide variety of hardware (console, Nvidia, AMD, blu-ray players, etc.). Really, we could not have hoped for more and, in fact, previous to the announcement people wished for far less. It really is what we have been waiting for.

No it doesn't have headtracking. Doesn't make much sense for Sony to do that, since I can't see them releasing the driver for the PC, or an SDK.

No, it doesn't cover your full 360 degrees vision. But even professional stuff costing $50K can't do that.

No, its not 1080P. But most content we would want (gaming, VR) would still be limited to 720P due to HDMI.

No, you won't put this on and jack into the Matrix. Actually, I'm still sad about that one. Maybe one day.

No, its not as small and light as sunglasses. But if you want that, you could get a Vuzix Wrap. But all the reasons the HMZ-T1 is better are precisely because Sony made the unit bigger. If they wanted to make fashionable sunglass-style specs, they could have done it and it would have been the same 30 degree FOV BS like all the other stuff. Can't have your cake and eat it too.

I understand its currently sold-out and back-ordered. But my point is just to put things in perspective, and not to so quickly forget how things were a few months ago even.

Post by **brantlew** » Mon Nov 28, 2011 9:26 pm

I'm sort of hoping that Sony is evaluating this unit as a potential add-on to the the PS3 (4). A few years ago, Sony was perceived as leading the technological curve in the console game and home media front. They were even able to muscle in Blu-ray as the industry standard. But they got completely left behind by the Wii and Kinect, and their reputation has taken a big hit. They no longer seem innovative, so a push towards VR gaming and media would be a bold move and a nice way to differentiate themselves from the pack. Maybe this is just a giant alpha test to research the technology and the market? The poor build design certainly makes the unit seem like a prototype. As far as head-tracking goes, I think it makes more sense for them to leverage the Move technology to implement head tracking instead of providing a stand-alone solution.

Post by **cybereality** » Mon Nov 28, 2011 9:50 pm

Its true. The PS Eye camera with the right software could probably do tracking on the headset right now. Maybe thats why they went for the white and black with glowing blue LED...

Post by **Synexious** » Tue Nov 29, 2011 6:16 am

cybereality wrote:No, its not as small and light as sunglasses. But if you want that, you could get a Vuzix Wrap. But all the reasons the HMZ-T1 is better are precisely because Sony made the unit bigger. If they wanted to make fashionable sunglass-style specs, they could have done it and it would have been the same 30 degree FOV BS like all the other stuff. Can't have your cake and eat it too.

Well, you can with iOptik

Post by **PalmerTech** » Tue Nov 29, 2011 10:47 am

Maybe, but Sony is going out on a limb releasing this in the first place. Imagine the reviewer outcry if you had to wear contact lenses each time you used it, not to mention the safety issues!

Post by **Bishop51** » Tue Nov 29, 2011 11:30 am

brantlew wrote:I'm sort of hoping that Sony is evaluating this unit as a potential add-on to the the PS3 (4). A few years ago, Sony was perceived as leading the technological curve in the console game and home media front. They were even able to muscle in Blu-ray as the industry standard. But they got completely left behind by the Wii and Kinect, and their reputation has taken a big hit. They no longer seem innovative, so a push towards VR gaming and media would be a bold move and a nice way to differentiate themselves from the pack. Maybe this is just a giant alpha test to research the technology and the market? The poor build design certainly makes the unit seem like a prototype. As far as head-tracking goes, I think it makes more sense for them to leverage the Move technology to implement head tracking instead of providing a stand-alone solution.

This is what absolutely baffles me about Sony. They are in a major battle with Xbox 360 (and to a lesser extent the Wii) and all of these systems have made the biggest splash by making bold hardware moves. The first of these companies that tackles fully immersive VR head-on is going to absolutely clean up. The ridiculous thing is that they already essentially have the hardware foundation to do it and they all have cracked the motion tracking component in several unique ways.

I would be absolutely shocked if engineers at Sony, Microsoft or Nintendo haven't already extensively toyed with workable VR solutions but their marketing and consumer research divisions probably keep pulling the rug out from under them. "No one wants to strap an ugly device to their heads!" they'll say "Our products need to be geared towards an all-ages, on the couch, group experience" they'll pronounce. And while that may account for one stunted aspect of social gaming it COMPLETELY misses out on the deeper implications of a true VR gaming experience and is almost criminally short-sighted. VR may not reach EVERY demographic of gamer (initially) but it will be an absolute watershed moment, earning more greenbacks than anything that came before it once someone does it properly. Preaching to the choir here I know but we all know the truth of it.

All of that said, it is absolutely going to take a Microsoft, a Sony, a Nintendo or perhaps an Apple to properly introduce VR to the world (and give it a fighting chance). Its not just the hardware, its the commitment to the software platform that utilizes it. They're so damn close now and its frankly very frustrating to watch if only because we know there's a lot of internal bickering going on in terms of when and how to bring VR to the world. Like John Carmack said recently (and I'm paraphrasing here) you can essentially only push pixels so far, the next revolution will be in changing how we experience those pixels, and it won't be on a perceptible screen.

I mean why compete with HD TV's or 3D displays when you can completely break the mold?

Post by **Fredz** » Tue Nov 29, 2011 12:50 pm

Bishop51 wrote:This is what absolutely baffles me about Sony. They are in a major battle with Xbox 360 (and to a lesser extent the Wii) and all of these systems have made the biggest splash by making bold hardware moves. The first of these companies that tackles fully immersive VR head-on is going to absolutely clean up.

Considering the big flop VR made in the mid-90's and how Sony invested at this period (Glasstron anyone ?), I'm not surprised that they are not overly enthusiastic about it and that they come at it again only very timidely. Nobody is able to tell what's the future for VR, that's probably why Sony is currently only doing some incremental steps to test the market.

Bishop51 wrote:The ridiculous thing is that they already essentially have the hardware foundation to do it and they all have cracked the motion tracking component in several unique ways.

The hardware of both Sony and Microsoft is clearly not up to the task for current VR expectations, it's basically 2006 technology when speaking in PC generations. They aren't even able to deliver on current displays in 2D or 3D, almost all games are capped at 720p @ 30fps. VR at this resolution/framerate is clearly a downturn compared to what current 2D or 3D displays are capable of (1080p @ 60fps). That'll change with their new generation of consoles, but they're not there yet.

Bishop51 wrote:I would be absolutely shocked if engineers at Sony, Microsoft or Nintendo haven't already extensively toyed with workable VR solutions but their marketing and consumer research divisions probably keep pulling the rug out from under them.

You didn't read this thread, did you ? 2 weeks ago I posted this here :
"Mike Hocking said in July that they were working on head-tracking in R&D with a couple of games at Sony."

Bishop51 wrote:VR may not reach EVERY demographic of gamer (initially) but it will be an absolute watershed moment, earning more greenbacks than anything that came before it once someone does it properly. Preaching to the choir here I know but we all know the truth of it.

Could have been copy-pasted from a PR blurb of the nineties. And unfortunately it's not more true now than it was back then.

Bishop51 wrote:Its not just the hardware, its the commitment to the software platform that utilizes it.

Yes that's precisely the problem, and it's exactly the same for S3D support at the moment. The commitment shouldn't come from constructors but from developers, because they are actually the ones that are delivering content. And considering the feable efforts made by developers for S3D (only _15_ 3D Vision Ready games out of several thousands), I don't really envision a bright future for VR gaming support in a forseable future.