My Nvidia 3D Vision Review

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distantreader
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Re: My Nvidia 3D Vision Review

Post by distantreader »

Yep. It's a Sony CPD-G520P 21" CRT monitor. Vista and Win7 only allows 1280x960 @85Hz and as I mentioned in the last post I was able to get it run at 1280x960@120Hz.

Currently I've tested only the following games:
1-The Witcher Enhanced Edition - Excellent S3D in both Vista and Win7
EDIT: Discovered severe distortion in some cases even though it's not really affecting the rest of the game. I'd say Witcher can only be rated as "OK" with Nvidia 3D Vision.

2-Tomb Raider: Underworld - Excellent S3D both in Vista and Win7
3-Prince of Persia 2008 - Excellent S3D, tested only in Vista
4-Assasin Creed - Excellent S3D, tested only in Vista
5-Gothic II - Not tested long enough, but what I saw was good S3D. Tested only in Vista.

Regarding older/other brand shutter glasses/dongle compatibility, you must have the 3D Vision plugged in to enable S3D - Then you can make use of the older glasses/dongle - Yes older glasses/dongle are compatible with the new Nvidia S3D driver but only if you had the 3D Vision. My I-Art Eye3D wireless/wired work fine with its own emitter/dongle plugged in the VGA port, just as it always have been concurrently with the 3D Vision of course.

I guess it's the way Nvidia market their product: both S3D driver and hardware in a package and not giving out S3D driver for free as in the past. I also guess that somebody will probably be able to hack this new S3D driver to make it work without the 3D Vision sometime, but currently no such hack exists.

Yes I understand the pain of being out of work, I'd been there. Wish you luck with the job search. Hang in there!

Cheers


shonofear wrote:Hey distantreader,
so are you just using a standard CRT setup? if so at what refresh rate?
And do many games work on the new Windows 7 and with good 3d Stereo compatibility ???

So correct me if i am wrong, but will the new Nvidia Stereo drivers work with cheaper wired glasses and dongle (like the X3D ones) ?
Out of work so cant buy the New Nvidia glasses kit... :( yet
Cheers fellas
Last edited by distantreader on Fri Feb 06, 2009 1:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: My Nvidia 3D Vision Review

Post by delyrious »

Also works on the pn50a450 (720p 50" Samsung 3D ready Plasma) works perfectly with a full screen native resolution of 1365 x 768 (= no black boarder and no need to wait for driver fix)..... Additionally with use of a miniDIN-3 splitter (I built my own) you can use your ssg1000 Samsung glasses and emitter at the same time with no interference. 8)
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Re: My Nvidia 3D Vision Review

Post by Shaq »

Burnout also runs at 60hz but Refreshlock won't work. The screen repeatedly flashes like it is trying to set the refresh rate. It works for manhunt however. It looks like Burnout is forced to only run at 60hz. I am going to try and email the company. Hopefully there can be a patch for it.
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Re: My Nvidia 3D Vision Review

Post by rkuo »

distantreader wrote:Yep. It's a Sony CPD-G520P 21" CRT monitor. Vista and Win7 only allows 1280x960 @85Hz and as I mentioned in the last post I was able to get it run at 1280x960@120Hz.

Currently I've tested only the following games:
1-The Witcher Enhanced Edition - Excellent S3D in both Vista and Win7
EDIT: Discovered severe distortion in some cases even though it's not really affecting the rest of the game. I'd say Witcher can only be rated as "OK" with Nvidia 3D Vision.

2-Tomb Raider: Underworld - Excellent S3D both in Vista and Win7
3-Prince of Persia 2008 - Excellent S3D, tested only in Vista
4-Assasin Creed - Excellent S3D, tested only in Vista
5-Gothic II - Not tested long enough, but what I saw was good S3D. Tested only in Vista.

Regarding older/other brand shutter glasses/dongle compatibility, you must have the 3D Vision plugged in to enable S3D - Then you can make use of the older glasses/dongle - Yes older glasses/dongle are compatible with the new Nvidia S3D driver but only if you had the 3D Vision. My I-Art Eye3D wireless/wired work fine with its own emitter/dongle plugged in the VGA port, just as it always have been concurrently with the 3D Vision of course.

I guess it's the way Nvidia market their product: both S3D driver and hardware in a package and not giving out S3D driver for free as in the past. I also guess that somebody will probably be able to hack this new S3D driver to make it work without the 3D Vision sometime, but currently no such hack exists.

Yes I understand the pain of being out of work, I'd been there. Wish you luck with the job search. Hang in there!

Cheers
What issues are you seeing with the witcher? I turned shadows to medium and lighting to low or medium and that seems to make the 3d effect perfect. I just got to Chapter 1 tho.
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Re: My Nvidia 3D Vision Review

Post by mikemav »

Okay all, having issues with GRID running. rFactor still seems to work (though not at full 60FPS all the time in S3D- it seems to be mod/car/track dependent) Anyway, I posted about my GRID start up issues on the Nvidia forum as well and looks like one of their mods is looking into it but not seeing the issue thus far http://forums.nvidia.com/index.php?showtopic=88765

Anyone else here with 3D Vision and a copy of GRID to check?
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Re: My Nvidia 3D Vision Review

Post by distantreader »

I've posted my issue at Nvidia S3D forum with links to images, here's the link:

http://forums.nvidia.com/index.php?showtopic=88843" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The graphics errors I see only happen in ACT 2 where certain characters got rendered with errors in both 2.5D and S3D. The images I put up illustrating the graphics glitches on only two characters using the same model from ACT2 and ACT4 that I considered most serious. There are a few other less serious glitches on other characters.

EDIT: Forgot to mention, I set shadow to low, lighting to low,medium,high with the same result.
rkuo wrote:What issues are you seeing with the witcher? I turned shadows to medium and lighting to low or medium and that seems to make the 3d effect perfect. I just got to Chapter 1 tho.
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Re: My Nvidia 3D Vision Review

Post by Neil »

If you are going to share images, can you please embed them in your messages directly? You can directly attach them to the message, or post in our gallery (http://www.mtbs3d.com/gallery" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;) and use that as a source.

Thanks in advance,
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Re: My Nvidia 3D Vision Review

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I would have had it not been due to the nature of the graphics content of the images. Take a look yourself and if you think those pix are OK to be embedded in post I wouldn't mind to re-attach them for the reader's convenience.

Cheers
Neil wrote:If you are going to share images, can you please embed them in your messages directly? You can directly attach them to the message, or post in our gallery (http://www.mtbs3d.com/gallery" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;) and use that as a source.

Thanks in advance,
Neil
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Re: My Nvidia 3D Vision Review

Post by Neil »

Smart move! :mrgreen:

Out of all the characters you could have chosen, why did you go with the naked one?!? :shock:

(Just watch - the NVIDIA forums are going to get record traffic now)

Regards,
Neil
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Re: My Nvidia 3D Vision Review

Post by distantreader »

Most unfortunate I might add. That was the only serious graphical error in the game using Nvidia driver. There are other glitches on other characters ie fingers got pulled up to sky instead of breasts. :lol:, annoying at times but less of an eye catcher.
Neil wrote:Smart move! :mrgreen:

Out of all the characters you could have chosen, why did you go with the naked one?!? :shock:

(Just watch - the NVIDIA forums are going to get record traffic now)

Regards,
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Re: My Nvidia 3D Vision Review

Post by rkuo »

I saw the fingers to the sky issue too, but it didn't bug me much. That picture looks worse but if it's occasional, I'll live.

I actually saw this artifacting a lot in the NBA 2K9 demo as well.

======================

Separate Q for you folks ... back to the ghosting issue.

OK, so, in that screen of the setup wizard where it asks you to close each eye and select what image you see through that eye ... does anyone NOT see ghosting? For example, I very clearly see an outline of the triangle over the hexagon and I can see the reverse outline if I look for it as well.The reason I ask is that I have an RMA to execute for my glasses because of ghosting issues, but I want to know if this is a general issue that getting an exchange won't help with.

I'm using the bundled Samsung monitor, for reference. And yes, I have dynamic contrast off.

Please chime in on this thread or the one over at the nVidia forums at http://forums.nvidia.com/index.php?showtopic=89133" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;.
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Re: My Nvidia 3D Vision Review

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rkuo wrote:OK, so, in that screen of the setup wizard where it asks you to close each eye and select what image you see through that eye ... does anyone NOT see ghosting? For example, I very clearly see an outline of the triangle over the hexagon and I can see the reverse outline if I look for it as well.The reason I ask is that I have an RMA to execute for my glasses because of ghosting issues, but I want to know if this is a general issue that getting an exchange won't help with.
Hasn't some of the people with the iart and other shutter glasses claimed to have less ghosting because thier shutters are more opaque than the Nvidias? If so I can't fathom how nvidia can sell a 200 dollar system without having ensured they had the latest shutter technology possible providing the best light blockage. Has anyone here tested the various shutter solutions on how much light they let through? What is the most opaque of the shutter glasses? Consumer ignorance gives these companies leeway to hustle the enduser - where is Neil when we need an advocate to start publishing specs relating to opaqueness, light blockage, and ghosting of various hardware?
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Re: My Nvidia 3D Vision Review

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Neil wrote:The difference in glasses and ghosting is a different thing altogether. I will have to double check with my sources, but I understand that NVIDIA adds an extra dark phase in their synchronization to cut down on ghosting. The loss of light is 60% or more, so there is a definite trade-off in image quality.

Also, while I can't name who yet, you are going to start seeing premium shutter glasses options on the market that are targeted more to the premium gamer. Will they work with the NVIDIA solution? We will have to wait and see.
Neil the most important thing to me and I would think many others is headache/eyestrain reduction for long gaming sessions. I know this should be a HUGE marketing point to parents worried about thier children as well. However I haven't seen anyone talk about the new Nvision Versus Iz3d in that regard or read many medical studies. I know Yuri said the IZ3d didn't hurt his eyes nearly as bad as the old shutter glasses - perhaps that was more a CRT v LCD issue - maybe he will chime in. So many people seem to be worried about framerate or color depth or ghosting, but if Nvidia trumps in all those areas, but I can only play 1 hour versus 10 hours with IZ3d passive solution because of headaches/eyestrain - why is no advocate raising these issues? So to those who have used several solutions, is the Nvidia solution allowing you to game many hours without any headache/eyestrain versus Iz3D versus passive polarized 2 projector setup?
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Re: My Nvidia 3D Vision Review

Post by edgoll »

Sheepishly I'll admit to having put in more than an average of 4 to 6 hours a day for the past 3 weeks enjoying the s3d with the new nvidia/ samsung bundle and I have had no eyestrain. For me ghosting is not even an issue. It is very minimal and I have tried over a dozen games. I frankly think other parts of my body will fail first from the strain.. I have used z800 and edimensional shutter glasses in the past (not Iz3d) and this new 120hz technology seems much better for brightness, minimal ghosting, color sharpness and ease of use.
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Re: My Nvidia 3D Vision Review

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When i had the e-dims i got headache of the shutterfrequency. Not too bad but it was noticeable.

The thing i refer as eyestrain regarding stereoscopy is when stereosettings are wrong and makes the eyes tired very quickly. I can have it on both the IZ3D as well as with my passive polarized rig. Sometimes i can actually have a small amount of eyestrain at an imax movie as well. However: A well tuned setting in a game is comfortable and can give way more depth experience than real life.
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Re: My Nvidia 3D Vision Review

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Likay wrote:When i had the e-dims i got headache of the shutterfrequency. Not too bad but it was noticeable.

The thing i refer as eyestrain regarding stereoscopy is when stereosettings are wrong and makes the eyes tired very quickly. I can have it on both the IZ3D as well as with my passive polarized rig. Sometimes i can actually have a small amount of eyestrain at an imax movie as well. However: A well tuned setting in a game is comfortable and can give way more depth experience than real life.
Neil could leverage the userbase here by setting up a database for settings that you and others could elaborate on regarding what caused headaches and what minimized them. IE - iz3d seperation settings in fallout 3 of 600 caused you to have headaches, but at 300 you could play all day with none. This would be nice resource for users and developers.

I had headache during the space station 3d imax movie, but not polar express, I have not experienced eyestrain during any of the reald 3d films.
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Re: My Nvidia 3D Vision Review

Post by Xerion »

martinlandau wrote:
Likay wrote:When i had the e-dims i got headache of the shutterfrequency. Not too bad but it was noticeable.

The thing i refer as eyestrain regarding stereoscopy is when stereosettings are wrong and makes the eyes tired very quickly. I can have it on both the IZ3D as well as with my passive polarized rig. Sometimes i can actually have a small amount of eyestrain at an imax movie as well. However: A well tuned setting in a game is comfortable and can give way more depth experience than real life.
Neil could leverage the userbase here by setting up a database for settings that you and others could elaborate on regarding what caused headaches and what minimized them. IE - iz3d seperation settings in fallout 3 of 600 caused you to have headaches, but at 300 you could play all day with none. This would be nice resource for users and developers.

I had headache during the space station 3d imax movie, but not polar express, I have not experienced eyestrain during any of the reald 3d films.
This won't work, not only because everyone's perception is different, but also because people's rigs are different. I need much less seperation for an equal experience on my projector than on my crt monitor for example.
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Re: My Nvidia 3D Vision Review

Post by edgoll »

I agree it would be hard to generalize since peoples tolerance for s3d is so different. my son in law cannot stand even a few minutes of s3d whereas to me I can go for hours.
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martinlandau wrote:
Likay wrote:When i had the e-dims i got headache of the shutterfrequency. Not too bad but it was noticeable.

This won't work, not only because everyone's perception is different, but also because people's rigs are different. I need much less seperation for an equal experience on my projector than on my crt monitor for example.
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Re: My Nvidia 3D Vision Review

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edgoll wrote:I agree it would be hard to generalize since peoples tolerance for s3d is so different. my son in law cannot stand even a few minutes of s3d whereas to me I can go for hours.
Why is that? If we don't start investigating these issures, companies will invest billions of dollars in a product perhaps and while it works for YOU and a few others, it flops on the market and sends them into bankruptcy. What is different about you and your son in law that causes this very HUGE difference in ability and how can it be overcome - OPEN YOUR MIND! ;) I competely disagree we should not do things because experinces are so different. Today we have databases and expert systems that can take lots of subjective data and do useful things with it. CRT with shutter glasses caused me massive headaches, the more data companies and developers have, the better for us all.
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Re: My Nvidia 3D Vision Review

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This won't work, not only because everyone's perception is different, but also because people's rigs are different. I need much less seperation for an equal experience on my projector than on my crt monitor for example.

All that data can be collected, everyone can post the specs of their rigs, open your mind. Yuri had bad eyestrain on certain solutions, so did I, some did not. Companies in the s3d world need to learn the differences and why some things work for some people and not others so they can overcome the problems and make S3d for us all, you do not agree? Already I learned something new from you in this post about crt versus projector seperation - I never knew that.
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Re: My Nvidia 3D Vision Review

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martinlandau wrote:
This won't work, not only because everyone's perception is different, but also because people's rigs are different. I need much less seperation for an equal experience on my projector than on my crt monitor for example.

All that data can be collected, everyone can post the specs of their rigs, open your mind. Yuri had bad eyestrain on certain solutions, so did I, some did not. Companies in the s3d world need to learn the differences and why some things work for some people and not others so they can overcome the problems and make S3d for us all, you do not agree? Already I learned something new from you in this post about CRT versus projector seperation - I never knew that.
But rigs are currently so diverse there is no meaningful average and so you can't compare the other values either. The projector vs CRT difference exists because the projected image is much bigger, the actual physical separation is much wider on a bigger screen than on a smaller one at the same setting. The same thing would happen with a small CRT vs a big CRT, only from a 19" CRT to a projected image 1.5-2 meters wide is quite a step and so the difference there is way bigger. Besides this, having an image where the characters are lifesize instead of lego-puppet size helps a lot for immersion too ;)
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Re: My Nvidia 3D Vision Review

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There is a way to leverage the membership for positive things! Martin's ideas aren't so off, though the criteria may be different.

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Re: My Nvidia 3D Vision Review

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I agree. When someone asks for a decent 3d setting and i give mine it generarily fits different persons quite ok. However now i got a "3d-sickness" :shock: . I'm so used to 3d which causes me to use quite strong 3d-settings for better experience. This is noticeable when i got visits and i have to turn down settings a tad. :lol:.
Regarding 22" and 100" screen i can also confirm: I use higher settings for the iz3d than for the big screen, however the most important thing is to have somewhat decent balance with convergence and separation. The eyes tells when it's time to alter settings a bit.
I believe it's possible to make a movie with good 3d for all viewers as long as stereoimpression matches what the eyes (brain actually) is comfortable with. If effects are exagerated too much it can very well give nausea for viewers not used to 3d.
As said: The brain is flexible and allows for more 3d (higher settings) once gotten used to it. I think all 3d-gamers have experience of that.
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Re: My Nvidia 3D Vision Review

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Okay all, having issues with GRID running. rFactor still seems to work (though not at full 60FPS all the time in S3D- it seems to be mod/car/track dependent) Anyway, I posted about my GRID start up issues on the Nvidia forum as well and looks like one of their mods is looking into it but not seeing the issue thus far http://forums.nvidia.com/index.php?showtopic=88765" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Anyone else here with 3D Vision and a copy of GRID to check?
Grid works fine here in stereo 16x, vsync on, shadows on low even.

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Re: My Nvidia 3D Vision Review

Post by Neil »

We have dedicated forums for NVIDIA complete with NVIDIA logos ( :D ). If you want to talk about unique gaming experiences and settings, you should contribute there too.

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Re: My Nvidia 3D Vision Review

Post by JanOrz »

What's up guys? Why did the answers to this thread stop?! I have an Acer H5350 DLP Projector and would love to buy the Nvidia 3D Vision Kit and get it working with my projector which can handle 120Hz (I can't it believe myself, but it is shown in the menu of the projector and in ReClock, too).
Can you please tell me if I will need to reverse the images of the left and right eye (cause of the projection images are flipped, or not?). Will I therefore need the "3dflightsim.com Stereo Projection Converter" :?: Do the nvidia 3D Stereo drivers now and in future only work with the nvidia transmitter connected or can I also use the edimensional glasses or others? I would be really pleased to get some answers!

Thanks a lot
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Re: My Nvidia 3D Vision Review

Post by Xerion »

That it accepts 120Hz input, doesn't mean it actually displays @ 120Hz as well; which is why projector specs are useless and there might be more compatible projectors then the known ones, but someone has to test them first.
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