I assume they upgraded the firmware. Without the upgraded firmware the Z800 only supports nvidia stereo. With the upgraded firmware the Z800 also supports page-flipping, but there is no way to sync it, you just need a swap-eyes key and to keep the frame-rate high.

The firmware can only be upgraded by physically removing and replacing the chip.

CarlKenner, Thank You for the info.

Would you, by chance, know what version of firmware is compatible with page-flipping?

Thanks in advance,
-- Shahzad.

that would be: v6.38

At $25 plus shipping I was hoping that Mercy Yamada or someone could confirm that it was needed or not.

Here my edimensional wireless glasses are working with ed-activator (interleaved-StereoNormal-LCDMode1). Choosing S3DShutter-Marked in iZ3D driver gives me Stereo3d (loosing half of the resolution) in Tomb Raider Anniversary (I´ve played only one minute). I´m using iz3d driver 1.09b2 and Windows XP.

BlackQ:

If you had complete control of turning on/off the left and right LCD's on shutterglasses would that work?

The reason I am asking is that I built a circuit that allows me to use the computer's RS232 serial port to control the shutterglasses manually in my stereo3d programming experiments:

http://www.tkk.fi/Misc/Electronics/circuits/sega3d.html

Hi, XYandZ!

Let me discuss this with our developers tomorrow (Monday) and I'll return back to you

I guess it could work limited. The problem now is, they don't have fast access to the backbuffers, like NV seems to have it.

However it should be possible to get a refresh rate (the flickering) about as high as your 2D FPS are. So if you have a high end System and play not too recent titles or turn off some specs you should have a good refreshrate with a super high FPS as a 'bonus'.

Example: HL2 engine based games run easyly at (nearly) 120FPS in 2D. Now every second or third frame switches the left and right, so you get an equivalent of 100hz with NV drivers.
It may be lower at complex scenes and higer at simple scenes. But you would get allways a very high Frame rate or heavy flickering.

But since many games need to be very fluent anyway it's still not the worst thing to do.

Oh and for comparison: with NV driver you need still 30+ S-3D FPS = 60+ 2D FPS That means you'd 'only' need about 50-100% more performance than with NV shutters or turn things down.

But maybe my guess is completly wrong

Hello. I don't know alot about 3-D gaming, but I have heard that IZ3D is being made compatible with shutter glasses now. Would it be possible to use IZ3D with the TriDef shutter glasses (made to work with a DLP TV), and would the experience match that of the TriDef glasses with TriDef software?

Thanks.

-Syn

http://mtbs3d.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t ... t=iz3d+dlp

Not sure about using the Tridef shutters but normal shutters appear to work somewhat.

What exactly do you mean by "normal" shutters? Elsa Revelators as mentioned in that link? What brands are "normal" shutters? And are they as good as the TriDef ones? If it works with eDimension glasses I thought it might work with the TriDef ones.

-Syn

Im just not sure on the connections used for each type of shutters.

The Tridef shutters use an I.R. emitter connected to the "3-D sync out" of the Samsung TV. Do you think Tridef's shutter glasses would work with IZ3D?

-Syn

I assume TriDef shutter will work with Samsung 3D DLP TV connected to PC with iZ3D driver in 3D checkerboard mode

Sounds great. I assume shutter glasses are better than the regular IZ3D glasses. And IZ3D supports way more games than TriDef's software does. I'm new to all this 3-D gaming stuff, thanks for answering all of my questions.

-Syn

regular iZ3D glasses are passive (like sunglasses) and work only with iZ3D monitor, but iZ3D driver enables 3D for wider spectrum of 3D devices, including Samsung 3D DLP TV

to XYandZ:

Looks like this scheme will not help a lot - we need to give you left and right exactly at the right moment, but we can not do it yet - this process is under graphics card main driver control

BlackQ:



I was afraid that might be the case.

Thanks for taking the time and for the prompt response though.

Something i dont understand if someone could clear up for me. Why does interlaced shutter work with iz3d but normal shutter lose synch? Are they not both page flipping that require the same level of synch to work?

nop - interlace is left and right together in one frame, but interlaced line by line - no sync is necessary for LR then - flipping is different story - device need to take LR at right time, but graphic card does not give us a chance yet to interrupt internal processes to give LR to device at right time

right like BlackQ said the DONGLE of for example the ED Glasses does the sync. So it either has internal memory or 'just' skipps every second line.

I'm not shure, but maybe it's even able to double the sync which comes from the GPU

But maybe there is hope that ATI will give you information to do it? I think nvidia isn´t so interested in it.

Yes, please let us know if you will be able to properly support shutter glasses with ATI graphics cards now that they are a partner.

I would be SO THRILLED to stomp on my old Nvidia card and move on to ATI after the poor choices Nvidia has made over the last 2 years in regards to dropping the most common 3d hardware types to force you to buy their glasses...if and when they ever come out...

The 'normal' way does not seem to work here. My Idea is to use a micro controller and a "photo transistor" to sync. How does this sound?

The photo transistor should be able to tell when it's time to shutter and the microcontroller can contoll the output perfectly. At 100hz it could wait 10ms and decide then wheter to swap eyes or not...

I've got no Idea if it could do the trick. This would only work with marked shutter of course, but if the hardware was there maybe Iz3D would make a little box in black and white to tell the controller what to do...

Or maybe we could use the VR920 USB output somehow with a micro controller...

So would the graphics quality be a little bit worse than full 1080P with the IZ3D software and TriDef glasses? Is it 1080i actually, instead? It should still be cool, but someone clear me up on this.

Yep it is like interlaced, but the pixels are arranged in a different manner. This thread is about real pageflipping and not checkerboard output by the way. The two have completly different problems.

please see here, too:
http://mtbs3d.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=2128&start=15

I was thinking:

Rewire the ED Glasses so that they connect to the serial port.

Capture the output from the "Marked Shutter Output" with software.

software sends signal though serial port to glasses bassed on the marker.

By doing this you are synced with L\R output.

Is this possible?

I hope ATI may help, but not sure about tomorrow

sync in our case mean that the moment when frame is ready it has to be taken by 3D device - to do this we need to interrupt rendering process for next frame and send Present() signal to GPU - we don't know the way how to do it yet

So it will need it's time since ATI provieds stuff and you can program it correctly. Do you have an Idea with what time to calculate?
- Wait a month
- Wait till x-mas
- wait for Nvidia to release Shutters and buy their glasses

- wait until the day after tomorrow (joking)

May you find the answers quick...

I'd be happy to have an idea, but technological relationship development is slower than marketing. Even more, existing thread structure may prevent to do this without access to driver source code ....

Hi, I just tried the 1.09 driver, but it doesn't ork, all DX9/DX8 games don't start anymore.

I have a 8800GTX ith the 178.13 Driver. hat can i do to make ot ork?

Hi, Somian!

Do you have dynamic test work now? What is your system specs?

whats the dynamic test?

and my system: C2DuoE6600, GF8800GTX, 2GB RAM, Windows XP 32

go to Help section in Control Center of iZ3D driver - you will see iZ3D logo there - click on it - rotating iZ3D logo has to appear

hi all, I have been trying to read all this but I must say I don't understand much of it.
I don't know anything about those technical issues and as you can read I don't know much more about speaking or writing in english
still I would like to discribe how it works for me (well it doesn't but almust )
like many users, I use (or at list I try) edim glasses on nvidia gpu, a 8800gts 512, with IZ3D 1.9 but instead of using the edim controller, I use the R3DCTL from razor:
http://lib.store.yahoo.net/lib/razor3d/R3DCTL.exe
I tryed both, this 1 that I used for a long time with stereoscopic player and the edim controller and I must say that it works about the same but the razor3D seem much more stable on my system, even if it have the same probleme loosing the RL-RL sequence (less frequently I think but it's hard to say), the R3D seems to be lighter and run smoothly.

also I was wondering about the "software pageflipping" from stereoscopic player, as I said before I have been using it for a long time with R3DCTL to watch videos and it seems to work perfectly so maybe the creator of stereoscopic player have found some solutions to make it work that could be of interest for the IZ3D devs?
again I want to say I know nothing about all this but I tought it was worth mentioning it ...

I have managed to make my shutter glasses work with the dynamic test and not-so-demanding games using activators and the basic ShutterGlasses mode of the IZ3D 1.09 driver. It seems the activator makes the dongle use the sync signal to flip eyes. The frames-per-second needs to be stable and half that of the monitor refresh rate. Doing this, I managed to play a bit of Call of Duty 4 and Devil May Cry 4 in stereo 3D. Devil May Cry is excellent since its frame speed is very stable even at high quality. My glasses often lost sync in certain scenes of Call of Duty 4. Since the activator hot-keys don't work in games, resync was sometimes impossible.
The stereo 3D effect was awesome, but I need to use an old CRT monitor. The CRT hurts my eyes and takes too much space. I tried the glasses with LCD monitors and TVs, but the ghosting was horrible and some LCDs were polarized the opposite of the glasses, making their screen black.

I'm currently trying to make an adapter for my glasses, with a small driver that catches the blue-line signal. I've found a way to catch the signal, but I still don't know if it's fast enough to keep sync with a game. Since I'm using Visual C++, and my computer has no parallel port, I still have no idea what physical interface I will use.

IZ3D, would it be possible to have an overlay displaying "L" and "R" in a corner of the screen, for easy sync?

I think the best way to use shutter glasses is with marked frames. If someone were to make an USB adapter for popular glasses, that worked with the IZ3D driver, I would certainly buy one.

darn, just went on the edim site and understand my mistake in previous post, didn't know they had that controller (the same as the r3dCTL) too so I tought you guys when mentioning the edim controller were refering to the 1 on the cd.
anyway, I did try the drivers in interlaced mode in the drivers configuration/interleaved mode in the controller with my shutters and it seems to work well with recent games.
succesfully tested so far:
left 4 dead
kane & lynch
space siege
trackmania
Mass Effect
tomb raider Underworld (works but lots of bugs)
just 1 question, I get great dept in those games, really beautyfull actually but can't get any pop-up effects, am I doing something wrong (again)

I've run underworld and if you use separation 420 and convergence -0.01 you should have popout (things coming out of your screen sometimes (try diving through the seagrass in the medsea). How much popout you have depends on your stereosettings and some games aren't really suitable for popout. Mostly it looks good if things are rendered behind screen depth though. 3'rd person games suits best if the main character is on screen depth and everything else in front of behind.

thanks for the answers Likay, I will try that later on tonight, also I started to read this viewtopic.php?f=43&t=1111 but it seems incomplete and I'm not sure it's right about the separation settings and depth so I will read further on and try it out too.

The best is trying to tinker with separation and convergence and see what happens. If you have an "unmatching" combo then the eyes get's tired quickly (eyestrain). In that case try to adjust the convergence to a comfortable level. If you can't then reduce separation a bit. When you're used to adjusting stereosettings it only takes a few seconds to find your desired setting even if you start from scratch.

well I have tryed those setting you recommand in TR underworld, great, it's even better 3D and less eyestrain than what I had before, I'm impressed thanks